If you liked this post, you may also like these:

  • Pictures From Red
  • Focus Shifts back to Fisherman’s Huts and missing items in Natalee Holloway Investigation. (fish trap cage)
  • Scared Monkeys Radio Daily Commentary – Friday, November 30, 2007 – Joe Tacopina Accuses Jossy Mansur Of Fabricating Evidence?
  • Jossy Mansur interview – Podcast replay
  • Joe Tacopina and Greta – Joe Comes out Swinging Against Jossy

  • Comments

    153 Responses to “Jossy Mansur, Fox News … 5/19/07 … Fishermans Huts May be Investigated Next”

    1. justinsmama on May 21st, 2007 7:57 am

      OT~ Remember when the dark side was claiming that Jossy was not allowed into the US? Those ijits.

    2. joe bear on May 21st, 2007 8:43 am

      Search well,tear up the pool,since is hiding something,and check the painted rocks.Godspeed and luck to TIM

    3. Richard on May 21st, 2007 8:48 am

      I don’t claim to have the inside info on what the Dutch are doing there. But so far, judging from what we’ve been told, they’re hitting only the most obvious targets.

      The vdS home.

      The Kalpoe home.

      Now the Fishermen’s Huts.

      And in between these searches/visits/inspections/whatever, if they’re doing anything else we’re not hearing about it.

      I have no problem with that. But it would be nice to know if they’re calling in people for questioning.

      It’s beginning to sound like a Cook’s Tour, as the old cliche goes.

      I remember that the National Sheriff’s Association, the largest group of U.S. law-enforcement professionals, when it gave Beth Twitty honorary membership offered to send volunteers to Aruba. As usual, the Aruba government gave it the back of its hand.

      Would these people still go and search?

      What about TES?

      Do the Dutch want to do anything real, or are they just stomping about, taking photos and saying “Nothing here now.”

      Again, I don’t know what’s going on anymore than anyone else does … but their presence seems to have an increasingly surreal tone. Let’s hope it does produce results, but judging from their slow pace they seem to be anything but highly motivated. I hope I’m wrong.

    4. Richard on May 21st, 2007 8:49 am

      By TES, of course, I mean Texas Equusearch.

    5. minnesota dad on May 21st, 2007 9:31 am

      Ho hum….this is not news.


      Stop playing games Dutch….rearrest Paulus and begin ending this thing by putting him away for 15 years.


      Protect American Tourists From Aruban Predators – Aruba hotels, aruba flights, Aruba scuba, Aruba restaurants, Aruba Tourism.

    6. DennisAOK on May 21st, 2007 9:56 am

      I agree With Minnesota Dad. The best angle is the internal corruption. Someone needs to talk for there to be resolution. There isn’t enough physical evidence, thanks to ALE.

    7. Robert on May 21st, 2007 10:08 am

      I think the dutch have a very difficult task: if the body of Natalee is not found (f.i. because it now is somewhere at the bottom of the ocean) it is very hard to get the perps convicted in a court of law. I’m confident the dutch team know what they’re doing and they know what leads and evidence – that indeed CAN get the perps convicted – they’re after. They’re no amateurs!

    8. John Staton on May 21st, 2007 10:32 am

      Saturday night we were at a Skynard concert. Everyone knows what the last thing they play is, it’s Free Bird. Hay Aruba, many of us have hair that is white, necks that are red and blue is a color worn. We will not stop! We will not forget! You will be held accountable.

    9. Richard on May 21st, 2007 10:33 am

      Robert, I hope you’re right. I just wish they would act as though a fire were lit under them. I’m also thinking that if they were to give out more information about who they were talking to or planned to talk to, assuming that they are doing this at all, it might have a psychological effect.

    10. Molly on May 21st, 2007 10:43 am

      “Free Bird”
      Rock on.
      Justice for Natalee

      molly (in Houston)

    11. Libby on May 21st, 2007 12:16 pm

      As MD said…ho hum.

      I’m sorry but what a bunch of BS. They think we are stupid. They have been playing us for how long now?! Natalee is not at the fishermans hut and she is not at the K brothers house. They know where she is. They know what happened to her. They know who the guilty parties are. They are just playing more games and slapping us in the face. They need to do just as MD said. Retract Karen Jansens letter, reverse the void, charge Paulus and his predators and if possible give Natalee back to her family. Period, end of story!

      IF….and that is a big IF…they ever charge the correct criminals, correct criminals being Paulus, his predators,and all those who assisted in the cover up, they still won’t tell where Natalee is so the family can bring her home…set the ********* on fire like they did pitbull.

      Hello Aruba, until you do the RIGHT thing, this will never ever go away. Hear that Aruba, it will never go away. Keep playing your games.

      IF, again big IF you ever do the right thing, it will eventually somewhat go away. There will always be that memory of what happened to Natalee but at least Aruba will also be remembered for finally doing what is right.

      Boycott Aruba!

      Protect all tourists from Aruban predators. Aruba vacations, Aruba flight information, Aruba hotels, Aruba beaches, Aruba night life, Aruba restaurants, Aruba scuba diving.

    12. 10061906 on May 21st, 2007 12:17 pm

      When looking at the pictures of the Huts; take a good look at the sand. Notice all the tire tracks.
      The look like a an ATV made them.
      Who uses ATV’s in patrolling the beaches. I believe the company is owned by Willeim Von Cromvoirt.
      Don’t we have pictures of Geoff on an ATV. I know I do.
      Going back two years ago I’m sure the same type of tracks where there back then. How come no one saw Natalee or Joran or Deepak or Satish. Unless the person patrolling the area and using the beach ATV was part of the “shark fest”.

    13. JusticeforNatalee on May 21st, 2007 12:45 pm

      Dutch team,


      Go after him!

    14. JusticeforNatalee on May 21st, 2007 12:47 pm

      P.S. Dutch Team,

      I hope there is A LOT MORE going on behind the scenes.

    15. micah on May 21st, 2007 12:51 pm

      I wouldn’t want them to get in a hurry about anything…

    16. Vicki on May 21st, 2007 12:57 pm

      Fishermans huts…come on what do they have a false BOTTOM???or do they think there is DNA in there. SHE WAS NEVER ON THE BEACH….DUH STUPID!!!! they took her to some room…I dont know anyone who has access to an apartment, money for a hotel..is gonna take a girl to the BEACH..it aint happening…they were filming her, something bad happened, they didnt realize this until they uploaded the “film” on the internet and sold it,, and then realized they couldnt wake her…thats why PAPASWEAT went to florida to buy back the film…but HERES THE CATCH..the original film wasnt destroyed.So somewhere out there someone has a film with evidence on it and they are blackmailing the sweatysloots….imo

    17. 10061906 on May 21st, 2007 1:05 pm

      Sources close to the investigation identified “G.v.C.” to CNN as Geoffrey van Cromvoirt. The Aruban newspaper Diario reported he is the brother of a police officer and published photographs of him attending his sister’s swearing-in ceremony.

      Monday’s statement from prosecutors also said that another man had been arrested in the case over the weekend, and also was released.

      “On Saturday, April the 22nd, a 20-year-old man with the initials A.B. was arrested in the Holloway case. He was released after the interrogation period of 6 hours,” the statement said.”
      Did we ever know who belonged to the initials A.B
      On May 27th at C and C’s Geoff grabbed Natalee and almost started a fight with the MBHS students. His friend again was only identified as A.B. Was that Adnin Bikker the attorney?

    18. Miss-Underestimated on May 21st, 2007 1:38 pm

      I wonder if the Dutch is checking if the timeline the self-proclaim liar gave is viable. Could liar have been to all places within the time line and I hope they are also checking Papa Sloots atm transactions and times.

      Liar said to mama “if you stayed home this wouldn’t have happened” Does that mean Mama would have not let liar out of the house or that Papa wouldn’t go looking for young women?

    19. Vicki on May 21st, 2007 1:49 pm

      Probably both Miss U!!

    20. disgustedmom on May 21st, 2007 2:15 pm

      I agree with some of the others on here. The Fisherman Huts is not going to produce anything,…. lest someone plant something there real quick before the Dutch team checks it out.(that last part was my own because I don’t discount them trying to solve this case by planting evidences so long as it doesn’t lead to arresting anyone or actually finding Natalee)

      I don’t doubt Natalee could have been temporarily placed in some Fisherman Hut…but which one? Not the one near the Marriot for sure because that is where J2K want to lead us. There are many. I’d check them all or don’t bother. But moreover, I don’t think Fisherman Hut as much as some other type utility building, such as the pool shed on the VDS property.

      I hate to keep bringing up psychics but this one in particular that has gotten several things right (including that Dave would find a lone cross that was not a grave) said she saw Natalee bound in a fetal position in a shed that had such things as, a small net on a long pole (which could have been like the ones they use to collect debris from a pool surface) and a white rope with floater things along it (which could have been that rope thing with floaters on it used to lay across pools for certain needs of dividing sections). She saw Natalee with an injury to her head (the boys keep saying nat hit her head even as the way she did it keeps changing) and that Natalee was alive when placed into this shed, but she was very sick feeling and scared -hence she was awake. She was tied up and gagged. It was daylight because rays of light were coming in from a window on the side of the building as well as through small spaces/holes in the roof. (why did Joran and his dad have their picture taken smiling from the top of the roof of their pool shed? had they been up there repairing holes and cracks?) And since she saw daylight streaming in, could this be why Paulus or somebody (can’t remember off hand) was taken in under suspicion of ‘holding Natalee captive against her will that led to her death’? Nat was alive before he negligently let her die by hiding her until daylight- at least -the following day?

      That same psychic said when Nat was in the utility buiding of sorts her head was against a stone type wall. That was reported on some board before Joran ever said anything about the Fisherman Huts OR more specicially about Nat being buried by a stone wall inside that hut. I think that psychic may have been read by someone who got afraid and so the whole fisherman hut thing was made up to throw off from any other such structure.

      Another psychic mentioned ‘pool boy’ and several along the way have mentioned pool. Most all have said Nat had an injury to her head. (these are all amateur psychics, meaning they don’t do it for money)

      That woman who claimed to have been attacked at the Fisherman Hut we are supposed to focus on…was she a plant? I ask because when she finally gave a description from which a composite drawing was made, the drawing just so happened to match that of a sex offender from Minnisota or Michigan (can’t remember which one), USA to a T! anyone know where this woman was from?

    21. minnesota dad on May 21st, 2007 2:46 pm


      The Fisherman’s and the area are not worth searching. THEY WERE NEVER THERE.

      In order to try and ‘prove’ that they were there….Joran ‘left’ a pair of size 14 K-Swiss tennis shoes on the beach. Joran, next time you steal a pair of K-Swiss from the lost and found at the Tennis Club, make sure they are your size…..numbnuts.

      The pair of shoes left on the beach were all done to ‘prove’ Joran was there…..rather than at the crime scene at #19 Montana.

      Same goes for the belt found at the lighthouse. ‘Proves’ that Joran was there.


      P.S. I am still waiting for the opportunity to eat my ‘crow pie’. My money says the Dutch Investigators will continue the cover-up…..prove me wrong Dutch and start putting the heat on PVDS – the, we will know that you actually mean business.

    22. glad2bAmerican on May 21st, 2007 3:05 pm

      How can Aruba turn itself around? Who wants to go to an island who botches such a vital investigation even if they do arrest(or frame)someone? I don’t want to be the next victim! Their efforts are useless even if they made any arrests!

    23. 10061906 on May 21st, 2007 3:15 pm

      Minnesotadad: I told you before, I’ll sit right next to you and share some of that crow pie if your wrong.
      Disgustedmom: Some one else posted a very similar scenario.
      I could agree 100% with your posting except for:
      Why would they keep an injured Natalee captive?
      Why not get medical attention?
      Do you think she was alive or at least in the house when Beth arrived?
      Was Natalee moved from the house to the shed while every one was chasing Joran; when in fact he was probably home all that time?
      Did you think Joran move her.
      Do you think she was alive when moved to the shed?
      How long do you believe they kept her?
      What do you think they did with her after removing her from the shed?
      Where in your opinion is she now?

      IMO the only reason that she would be buried on the
      VDS property was if they were forced to bury her there by
      some other force.

    24. Richard on May 21st, 2007 3:23 pm

      Disgusted Mom (#20) … I believe that the woman assaulted at the Fishermen’s Huts some nine days before Natalee vanished was Tracy Allen of Boston.

      She appeared on the Rita Cosby show of April 13, 2006, to tell her story. She reported that the Aruban police took the details she gave them and then did nothing with them. I believe that Dave Holloway checked into that.

      I can’t say anything about the vision of the psychic … there’s no way I know of, short of getting evidence or a confession, to validate it. I understand that other psychics, including one whom I know, have indeed “felt something” when at or near the Fishermen’s Huts.

      As I said, there is no way to prove or disprove this. Is it possible (here I go again) that the “vision” may have been of Natalee in captivity, having been or in the process of being turned over to someone who would take her off the island?

      Here, too, nothing to prove it … or disprove it.

    25. sparrow on May 21st, 2007 4:44 pm

      joran & co, felt the most safe at the van der sloots home, and it didn’t cost the creeps any money. Natalee, i think, died in the vds house. The fisherman’s hut has to have some kind of clue, but I don’t know what that would be, unless it’s where they first tried to bury her. I want so much for the Dutch team to be ambitiuos or energetic enough to solve this case without PVS being able to weasel out of murder along with his slimey, evil son, and those detestable Kolpoe brothers. Killers.

    26. JusticeforNatalee on May 21st, 2007 5:00 pm




    27. mayan_moons on May 21st, 2007 5:08 pm

      Why did the Dutch Investigator’s take jackhammer’s to the Sloot house search and NOT use them? In the warrant they must have stated we need jackhammer’s to search for evidence and granted permission or they wouldn’t have had them to begin with.

      WHY were they NOT used to search under and arround the new fountain the Sloot’s just had to have while their son sits in prison for kidnapping, rape and murder?

      I can only think of 2 reasons why.

      1. Was Paulus’s sleep-over buddy Judge there to prevent it
      like last time?

      2. Or Dutch Investigoator’s are in on the dog and pony

      Which is it???

    28. mayan_moons on May 21st, 2007 5:13 pm

      I just really hope these Dutch Investigator’s haven’t let Aruban Official’s convince them that if they go along with a pretend investigation. Look what a disaster thats turned out to be for Aruba.

    29. mayan_moons on May 21st, 2007 5:16 pm

      oops didn’t finish my thought up there*




    30. mayan_moons on May 21st, 2007 5:40 pm

      Whats the name of the Lead Investigator of this group? What is the name of the Lead Investigator’s Supervisor in Holland? We need a copy of the chain of command in charge of the case and we need it now!

    31. disgustedmom on May 21st, 2007 5:51 pm

      #24 Richard. I agree, psychic stuff is hard to prove. From what I understand so much of what they ‘get’ is symbolic so it would take the psychic and a person who has actual knowledge of the case (and faith in the unknown) to actually put anything psychic to any good use.

      Thanks for letting me know the lady was from Boston. The composite still matched that sex offender from one of those ‘M’ states though. It really did. I just wish I could remember his name.

      #23 I’d like to join MinnisotaDad and 1006 is that crow pie dinner if PVDS is not eyebrow deeply involved in Natalee’s disappearance and that she was on his property. She might not be there now, but I think she was.

      I’ll try to answer some of your questions you put forth 1006. Of course, these are only my opinions.
      1. Why would they keep an injured Natalee captive as opposed to taking her to the hospital?
      Stupid, self-centered, self-importance driven, very late at night, Joran had school the next day, didn’t think she would die, and perhaps even she had been drugged and they didn’t want that to show up in any fluid tests the hospital would do.
      2. Do you think she was alive or at least in the house when Beth arrived?
      Yes and no. I think she was alive in the shed when Beth arrived. I personally think Charles Croes, who got the call from Beth about the cell call early that afternoon, knew exactly whose number that led to and somehow that led to him asking Paulus about it. I think that is when Paulus went into action…while Joran was in school. So I don’t even think Joran knows what happened to her after he left for school that day, but Paulus does. If you want me to speculate more….I think Joran and Paulus thought Nat would come around and go on her way the next morning. I think Joran thought Paulus was going to see that she got back to her hotel. I think that’s why Joran said right away that HE dropped her off at the hotel because eventually she was supposed to have been dropped there by P. Joran did not know she wasn’t and the reason he said HE dropped her was so as not to involve his dad.
      3. How long do you believe they kept her?
      I have no thoughts on this, but I think she has passed away by the time anyone checked on her after they put her in the shed.
      4. What do you think they did with her after moving her from the shed?
      Well, I don’t know, but I do know that those pool chemicals that keep the PH in the pool in balance and chorine would mask a smell really good.
      5. Where, in your opinion, do you think she is now?
      Under concrete, but I am not sure I can reason that she would be in PVDS’s yard somewhere. I’d rather think it was wherever the extra concrete was disposed of IF there was extra concrete to dispose of. If not that, then still under concrete somewhere.

      Another good question would be, where was she in the house while she was sleeping it off. Here’s an interesting little tidbit for you….that Medleyrelay person said that Anita told her the cops DID search the entire house that first time EXCEPT for one of the younger son’s room. You can take it from there.

    32. Rastus on May 21st, 2007 6:14 pm

      Chlorine will hardly mask the odor of a decomposing body. Ask anyone who deals with the not so recently departed.

      Perhaps, someone will implicate the younger son in this whole sordid mess. Since the policia didn’t search his room. . . and we KNOW they royally screwed the pooch.

    33. Carpe Noctem on May 21st, 2007 6:22 pm

      In a perfect world…

      an ex-SEAL team of six would be sent in

      to perform a nightime landing on Aruban shores!

      (Being detected on their stellar radar system is

      really not a big concern. LOL)

      As soon as they land, they split into 2 teams of 3

      connected via radio communications. RED team would have

      orders to go to Montanja to take Paul & Joran out.

      BLACK team, would be sent to Hooiberg to erase all traces

      of Deepak and Satish Kalpoe.

      The hits would be carried simultaneously,

      so that none of those pathetic, sniveling,

      raping-murdering shiteballs

      could not warn the others that they were

      fixin’ to get 3 in the popcorn maker!

      To any of those that would say, you’re rushing to judgement…

      Give me a big f’ing break, cry me a river. What about the

      death sentence they served on Nat? You think they were

      worried about rushing to judgement on her? Did she get

      a judge to review her case? Let me help you with the answer…

      > F-NO.

      Natalee did not have a chance

      once she walked into their trap.

      They played judge, jury, and

      executioner on Nat!

      In a perfect world, the murdering/raping Van der sloots

      and the Kalpoes would get to sip out of that same cup so to

      speak. They would get to be on the receiving end of the horror

      and pain that they dished out to Natalee. In a perfect world, they’d be hunted down like  THE animals they are.

    34. Susan on May 21st, 2007 6:43 pm

      I’d have to agree with those of you who are saying there’s no need to search the “Fisherman’s Hut”. It was just another “DECOY”, a false lead to throw the searchers off track…

      The authorities never had their heads or hearts into solving Natalee’s disappearance. Their only concern was to protect the Van der Sloot’s. What a shameful disgrace!!

      Maybe Arlene Schippers will be there supervising the search, opening and closing the “doors” to the Fisherman’s Hut which she stated do not exist!

      Time is running out damnit!! I fear it’s all hopeless :-( Too little, too late. All of this backtracking by the so-called “Dutch Team” is a crock…

    35. Susan on May 21st, 2007 6:47 pm



    36. Susan on May 21st, 2007 6:49 pm


      By Lynyrd Skynyrd

      If I leave here tomorrow
      Would you still remember me
      For I must be traveling on now
      There’s too many places I’ve got to see

      If I stay here with you girl
      Things just couldn’t be the same
      ‘Cause I’m as free as a bird now
      And this bird you cannot change

      Oh, and the bird you cannot change
      And this bird you cannot change
      Lord knows I can’t change

      Bye-bye babe, it’s been sweet, love
      ‘Though this feeling I can’t change
      But please don’t take this so badly
      ‘Cause Lord knows I’m to blame

      But if I stay here with you girl
      Things just couldn’t be the same
      ‘Cause I’m as free as a bird now
      And this bird you cannot change

      Oh, and the bird you cannot change
      And this bird you cannot change
      Lord knows I can’t change
      Lord help me I can’t change

      Oh No, I can’t change

    37. Sebas on May 21st, 2007 6:54 pm

      Call Eric Soemers in Aruba, police station Noord and ask him who the leading person of the Dutch team is. They are very willing to talk to anyone who is blogging here.

    38. JusticeforNatalee on May 21st, 2007 7:15 pm

      Dutch Team,

      We are counting on you!

      Here’s a search for you to conduct: Search for a way around or through the CORRUPTION and COVER-UP.

      Search for a way to question suspects without asking “Pretty Please.”

      Don’t show us the Cook’s Tour.

      Let’s see the Championship Round as in PROSECUTION and CONVICTION.

    39. mayan_moons on May 21st, 2007 7:16 pm

      That would be a perfect world Carpe, that these POS get the same thing they gave Natalee.

      This time 2 years ago Natalee had just graduated from high school and was looking forward to going on her trip to Aruba to celebrate that milestone. I’m sure she was excited as could be about going, she worked hard to get that scholarship and this trip was her reward.

      I get really angry that she had everything stolen away by these heartless, gutless cowards. Better sleep with one eye open guys coz i promise one day just when you think you’ve lived this down & relax someone’s going to be there to take care of you.

      Until Then


    40. JusticeforNatalee on May 21st, 2007 7:16 pm

      Sebas, aren’t you the one who posted that nonsense about the FBI watching Carpe?


      SM:   YES – so be careful what you believe from him/her (klaasend)

    41. buckeye on May 21st, 2007 7:26 pm

      If they are so willing to talk, give them Dana’s number and have them do a call in show.

    42. sparrow on May 21st, 2007 7:32 pm

      #33 Right own. I would love to be there.

    43. disgustedmom on May 21st, 2007 7:50 pm

      ratsazz, those same chemicals used for pool sanitation etc are also used as a preservative. You put em on a body fast enough, you keep the decomposition down hence the smell down maybe not forever, but long enough. Just go research it.

      BTW, do you (or anyone else) happen to know if the VDSs had a cover for their pool? One of those that hooks on the sides and stretches tight like a trampoline? If so, do they still have it?

      It would be one of those very think ones that you couldn’t really wrap a body in, so don’t go crazy on me, ratsazz.

    44. Susan on May 21st, 2007 7:51 pm

      #41 – Great idea, buckeye! If the Dutch Team is anything like Paulus Van der Sloot, a freaking, profusely sweating piece of schizer, that too will never happen…

      BOYCOTT ARUBA!!!!!!!!!!


    45. disgustedmom on May 21st, 2007 7:54 pm

      # 34 That’s my sentiment too…that the ALE never had any interest in solving this case and were only interested in protecting the VDS.

      It is my humble opinion that the reason was because they have known all along what happened. They only fake search points of interest because they know it’s BS and it would be dumb to waste manhours and money doing something they know won’t produce anything.

    46. 10061906 on May 21st, 2007 7:55 pm

      I would like to know if Rudy Croes contacted the Minister of Justice in the Netherlands; Jan Piet Hein Donner, to request the Dutch investigators. If it was Donner it took over a year for the Dutch to react. Donner resigned in January 2006.
      Or was it his his successor who is ???

    47. Rastus on May 21st, 2007 7:56 pm

      OH MY GOSH!!! Wheel Of Fortune

      Just gave away another trip to >>>>>>>>>


      More emails, they ain’t a listenin’, Jed.

      As a curiosity, does freedom of speech — so vaunted on this site — include cloaked and outright threats of violence? Just wondering.

    48. mayan_moons on May 21st, 2007 8:07 pm

      Justice you’re right that is the same one who posted that!
      I thought the name seemed familar but you called it first!

      Hey the NY guy who jumped on the subway rail and saved another man’s life is on Deal or No Deal. I hope this Hero wins! (don’t really watch that show but will tonight)

    49. 10061906 on May 21st, 2007 8:15 pm

      The problem that I see here is we have a lot of hatred for those that we feel were responsible for Natalee Holloway’s probable death and disappearance. When we talk about hit men taking out 19 Montana and wiping all traces of the Kalpoes from Hooiburg; don’t you think it is a bit much? We want the island of Aruba to sink. We don’t care what happens to the aruban tourism affecting thousands of arubans.
      Remember “Revenge is mine says the Lord.” He will deal with those responsible for an eternity. Apparently those responsible feel immortality instead of fearing mortality.
      What I believe we want is closure for the Holloway and Twitty families and discover where if any of Natalee’s remains can be located and returned to Alabama. This so the families have a place to weep and try to continue on with their lives. Would it not make more sense for us posters and readers, who may number in the hundreds to combine our energy resources and try to make contact with Natalee’s spirit. Her soul is what they could not take away from her.
      I faced possibly dying three times within the last six months. I’m sorry but I now have a slightly different outlook on life. Every time I turn my hatred into something positive, believe it or not I feel stronger.

    50. disgustedmom on May 21st, 2007 8:48 pm

      1006 says, “Every time I turn my hatred into something positive, believe it or not I feel stronger.”

      I believe you because I know it is true.

    51. katablog.com on May 21st, 2007 8:57 pm

      >>>>When we talk about hit men taking out 19 Montana and wiping all traces of the Kalpoes from Hooiburg; don’t you think it is a bit much?>>>>>>>>>>>

      Yes. We condemn those who killed Natalee; doing the same to even the perps would be two wrongs. It also really lessens our message IMHO because it shows anger and violence as the answer.

    52. Rastus on May 21st, 2007 9:13 pm

      #43 Decomposition of a human corspe is primarily inside out. Hence, packing a body in a disenfectant would be near pointless. Bacteria in the large intestine (esp in a hot environment) would kick off the whole start of decomposing stink. Hard to hide that.

      Disgusted, why would I go crazy on you about a pool cover? I mean, if anything, it would be over your ‘accidental’ mischaracterization of my handle. But, really, I find that amusing after a fashion.

      The first amendment is great!

    53. 10061906 on May 21st, 2007 9:26 pm

      disgustedmom: #31 Thank you for your response. Lots of good messages there.
      I’ll copy/paste to read off line. Thanks again

    54. Pearl on May 21st, 2007 10:24 pm

      Satish Kalpoe
      May 31, 2005

      “After I had walked around, I met Deepak and Joran at the dancing floor/stage. Then the three of us agreed that it was too boring at Carlos & Charlies and that we would go to the house..”

      Dutch Investigative Team, can you help me understand something?

      Why did your ALE send their search teams to the San Nichols area on June 7th, when on May 31, they already KNEW that Joran, Deepak, and Satish had all agreed that they would go to THE HOUSE?

      And since the ALE had multiple eye witnesses who saw Natalee being taken away in a car containing Joran, Deepak and Satish…why was THE CAR not immediately searched and seized on May 31 at 3 AM in the morning when Paulus was lying to Beth claiming he knew nothing about Natalee?

      And since Van der Straaten already knew that Joran, Deepak and Satish were all lying about the “we dropped her off right in front of the hotel lobby” LIE, and that no such “Black security guard” existed since video surveillance proved that Joran, Deepak and Satish were liars intent on obstructing any investigation, how is it that THE HOUSE, and THE CAR were not immediately searched and a full forensics sweep done on BOTH?

    55. disgustedmom on May 21st, 2007 10:45 pm

      #52. No sweetie, you’re only partially thinking correctly. You could watch something beside Wheel of Fortune and learn that many a dead body has been stored for years in preservatives such as I mentioned.

    56. Allan K on May 21st, 2007 10:46 pm

      The “Dutch Farce” continues.

    57. outthere on May 21st, 2007 11:29 pm

      psychics. funny how the 90% that are way off are never mentioned (many said Natalee would be found by now, no one brings them up.) They are simply good at what they do, which is prey on others emotions, whether they do it for money, fame, or just to feel relevant. We could fit their comments into any scenario we want, but seriously, they are of no use here. They should just join the John Edward scam-ring (anyone sane think he’s for real?) and we can focus on finding Natalee. If psychics really knew… um… this would be over.

      I do hope this ends soon, for everyone’s sake. I went to Aruba twice, years ago, loved it. So sad, it just isnt the same anymore.

    58. 10061906 on May 21st, 2007 11:40 pm

      For what it is worth: Let me put my two cents in again;
      IMO too much just SEEMS to happen around the Holiday Inn and the Excelsior casino.
      Joran and his father gamble together and it is not for fun. They don’t use Monopoly money in casinos. Maybe they let them gamble to see the lay of the land.
      Joran with Deepak and Satish were spotted trying to pick up girls and sell drugs.
      Geoffery Von Cromvoirt and Michael Dompig. You would be surprised what we can get the girls to do when we tell them we are police officers.
      Michael Dompig and another male trying to pick up girls right in front of Dave Holloway. It’s in his book.
      There are pictures of Michael Dompig, Andreas and girls outside the Holiday Inn at night.
      There are too many pictures on web-shot albums with Geoff in Holiday inn rooms.
      Geoff’s father is in charge of security and surveillance video cameras in the casino and hotel.

      Funny when you check other albums for hotels, the other places don’t show these guys. The only other common places that pop up are Carlos and Charlie’s and Choose a Name.

      Let me get ahead a little.
      The pimps check out the girls at the Holiday Inn. They stalk only the females that are on the lower floors that have outside access without going through the lobby or using room keys. They can check at the front desk when a particular individual is checking out. Once they have this info, they then follow these “wild women” looking for a one night stand before they go home. (As per Joran) These guys don’t kidnap them they sucker them into going back to their hotel rooms at the Holiday Inn. Once in their rooms the girl may think she is safe for some intimate one on one romance. Room service arrives with drinks and out comes the GBH. They get them in a semi conscious condition where they can still walk. They are taken down the hall to a service room. The room is set up for videos and shark fests. Once the sharks have eaten their full and enough pictures are taken; when the girls is again in walking condition, they take them back to their room and tuck them in.
      Or they stay in the room and once the girl is unconscious they come in through the ground floor patio doors with cameras and dishonorable intentions.
      The next morning the girls don’t remember quite what happened but have to leave for their plane. Later they may remember what happened maybe not.

      Now lets look for a motive.
      Joran liked Ruth, but she left C and C’s and Geoff apparently liked Natalee. Someone called Joran, probably Geoff that Natalee was not within her normal circle of friends at C and C’s and told him to try and take her back to the Holiday Inn. Romance her a little and once she is back in her room let us know.
      Or Geoff could have come on strong again and Joran steps in between to protect Natalee. Now Joran is the hero and Geoff is the bad guy. Natalee has found her protector in sheeps clothing.
      But the night they kidnapped Natalee or tricked her into getting into a cab to go back to the Holiday Inn they couldn’t use her room for what they wanted. We dropped her off at the Holiday Inn. True; that is what the original plan was to be.
      Natalee’s roommates were there except for Madison. Freddy and Koen who where at Joran’s and were to meet at the Holiday Inn now have to change their plans. We have a “girl” what do we do and where can we take her. That little stop over was to tell Freddy not to come to the HI, stay where you are we are coming there.
      Mom’s not home let’s go there and do it. Once at the PVDS ranch various males with dishonorable intentions met there. Natalee gets off her one chance of saving herself with the cell phone she had at the casino. Guido leaves his shift at the casino and heads over to see Joran, but he finds his bosom friend engaged with a drugged Natalee, get pissed and in a jealous rage throws a punch at Joran. Guido leaves and doesn’t do anything until; he learns that Natalee is missing. He knows what happened and who was involved and now feels he has to leave the island.

      Where do we go from here??? Follow up with #31 disgustedmom

      PS remember shortly thereafter some of the lower level rooms were renovated???
      Beth could not stay in Natalee’s room; she felt like someone was watching her and she went to the Wyndram.

    59. Waterboy (Jerry) on May 21st, 2007 11:49 pm

      Back in the beginning days of the investigation and when I first logged on to Scared Monkeys, when I was naïve, innocent, and still believed some of what the 3 main suspects were saying, I said, “dig up the floors of the fishermen’s huts-they are only sand; but as time went on, I’ve come to realize that they were not there anyway so what’s the use.

      Wow, that’s one sentence.


    60. mayan_moons on May 22nd, 2007 12:05 am

      hey outthere,

      I also am wary of psychic’s, i don’t like to see vulnerable, desperate people being taken advantage of in any way.

    61. Rastus on May 22nd, 2007 12:06 am


      Please provide a link . . . or two to support your position. I looked and was unable to find where a body was preserved for minutes, much less ‘years’ in pool chemicals.
      There should be at least one case that you can cite.

      I look forward to the information!

    62. Richard on May 22nd, 2007 7:23 am

      1006 (#58), you talk about all the stuff happening in the casino. Please read the article that I posted this morning in the Aruba money-laundering thread, which at this point is the most recent thread on the forum to mention Aruba.

      It talks about some events in Minnesota. Remember, though, that these can’t possibly happen to an American abroad. We don’t want to think “outside of the box,” after all, or defy the assumptions that everyone has made.

      As to the pool chemicals, if you read about the deeds of Hungarian serial killer Bela Kiss, you will find that he did indeed preserve the bodies of some victims in chemicals and stored them in metal drums. I have no idea why he did this, or what the chemicals were (pool or not), but the fact remains that it was done.

      However, we don’t know if that is relevant to this case.

    63. Vicki on May 22nd, 2007 8:25 am

      1906- when we talk about offing the pimps.. we are just venting.. I completely understand where you are coming from, but sometimes the pain becomes tooooo much and I for one feel alittle better after talking about ripping their eyes out or cutting them up slowly..would I do any of this..no..I will wait for God to punish the pimps. Nothing I could ever do would be as great as what he has in store for them. Carpe has been working on pictures and so his pain is more acute than ours… God bless you Carpe. I see Natalee in your pictures.

    64. Waterboy (Jerry) on May 22nd, 2007 8:37 am

      10061906, how about this one.

      The Wever kid has a dual purpose. First, as a card handler and with the help of his friend Joran (his huggie buddy, he lets certain females win,). This builds trust between the selected female and Joran. His second purpose is to escort females back to their hotels after being drugged and raped and if one wakes up, he explains that he found her wandering the streets or beach.

      Only with Natalee, on the way back to the hotel, she dies from injuries or a drug, alcohol mixture. He panics and takes her to a family crypt. During their quality time the next evening, he tells Joran where he left Natalee’s body, but Joran, being the intelligent young lad that he is, forgets the specifics. When Wever boy leaves the country, he cannot communicate the specifics for fear of being overheard on phone or e-mail, etc.


    65. I Love America on May 22nd, 2007 9:50 am

      All you need is lime.

    66. I Love America on May 22nd, 2007 9:54 am

      Lime has been used for many years in outhouses and the like. My grandfather told me once that back in the day when everyone had outhouses, lime was used to deodorize the wastes. He said if it was done on a regular basis, the outhouse didn’t smell bad at all.

    67. disgustedmom on May 22nd, 2007 9:54 am

      #61 Ras, here’s why I’m not going to bother with surfing the web to find you a link….because you asked me to provide a link or “two” which means to me that no matter if I send you a link or 2 or 3 or 4 you will dismiss it. I’m done with this decomposition debate with you now. The truth is out there. Keep looking for yourself if it means that much to you.

    68. JusticeforNatalee on May 22nd, 2007 10:20 am

      Dutch Team:

      Have you questioned the minister at St. Ana Church?

      How about Yolanda Wever?

    69. 10061906 on May 22nd, 2007 10:23 am

      richard: please provide a link to your posting. I would like to read up on it.

    70. Richard on May 22nd, 2007 10:57 am

      1006 … A link to which posting? If you mean the info on Bela Kiss, just look it up on the Internet.

      If you mean the article on the casino/moneylaundering/prostitution tie-ins as found in the Minneapolis area, go to the thread mentioned. The story is there.

      Incidentally, the police investigator who was looking into that was murdered … in May 2005. Interesting coincidence.

    71. Rastus on May 22nd, 2007 10:58 am


      Actually, one link is sufficient. I looked and there is no reference that I found. You make the assertion that pool chemicals are used to preserve a body. Since your assertion is not ‘common knowledge’ then you have a duty to provide a link.

      The fact that you refuse to substantiate YOUR claim, gives it absolutely no credence at all. In other words, BS.

      Evidently, the concept means a lot to you as you keep bringing it up.

      Don’t be a weak sister. Provide ONE link where pool chemicals are used to preserve a dead body. Just one….

    72. Gabriel Leo on May 22nd, 2007 12:26 pm

      O My let’s run ONCE MORE to our PC’s and send out e-mails, but this time lets Rip wheel of fortune apart because they too have done a BIG BIG BOO BOO!

    73. disgustedmom on May 22nd, 2007 12:47 pm

      Oh gee, Ras…now I simply must go find you a link so I won’t be ‘weak’. LOL Sorry, I’m past Jr. High age. That won’t work on me.

      I don’t get why you can’t let this particular thing go. We have no proof my proposal actually happened so even the fact that chemicals such as those used for pool upkeep could certainly not only mask smell but Heaven forbid foster decomposition isn’t worth all this chat between us since we don’t even know if Natalee is deceased.

      I made a proposal. I am not in any way pushing an agenda. You are though, and it’s really weird.

    74. Carpe Noctem on May 22nd, 2007 12:47 pm


      Gay Boy Leo,

      Just when I think you can’t suck it any harder, you

      give it another puff, and totally redeem yourself!





      The gun
      The gun
      The gun

      One of them used one to
      shoot her in the head, I think.

      Please, track down the effing gun(s)

      ——–ALE RECORDINGS———

      Joran: I should have killed you, retard. Shut your trap.

      Deepak: Won’t be fun, if you are standing in front of the judge of instructions tomorrow. Why not? Too much evidence?

      Joran: Then they are also allowed to hit me. Do you think that it makes a difference to me. One slap will be enough.

      Satish: You think, you think.

      Joran: What do you think, that you are going home to get your gun?

      Satish: That I have a gun.

      Joran: Satish, you, get gun at home, me shoot you two dead.

      Satish: Look, the police already went to my house and already investigated [searched] the house. Did they find a gun? What will she get? ["Wat zal zij krijgen." The word 'zij' is for the word 'she' or for 'they', but they use the singular verb for 'will', therefore'she']


      Find the gun. -j4n

    75. Carpe Noctem on May 22nd, 2007 12:51 pm


      #63 Thank you. ;)

    76. Meee on May 22nd, 2007 1:06 pm

      I to was weary of psychics. My brother went to one in. The guy has his own radio show. Does private readings. My brother got an appointment. The guy was pretty amazing. He knew alot of things. My brother got to hear from dead relatives and friends? He was on target with how long ago they died. Even though my brother wasn’t sure. The guy also knew about present things going on in the family. Like my dads cancer. My brothers kid being autistic. My other brother getting divorced. Plus he knew that I had gained alot of wieght. And I should be very carefull of high blood pressure and diabetes. Which is pretty good. Because a month before my doctor told me I have high blood pressure and he’s worried about Diabetes. Because of the other things going on with my family. I never mentioned this to any of them. The info my brother received made me alot more open to these people.

    77. Rastus on May 22nd, 2007 1:45 pm

      #73 Disgusted,

      You made the assertion, and I asked you to support it. SInce, you won’t or can’t, well, it’s a dead issue — put some pool chemical on it though.

      BTW, I am glad you acknowledge that we don’t even know if Nat is deceased. The notion that she is deceased seems to generate a lot of the imperative here, anyway.

      #72, I seem to recall that on this very board that calls to Email were often made to various TV shows (I recall Deal/No Deal was victimized) and others who had the audacity to provide an Aruban vacation to winners/clients/whatever. Evidently, based on the tone of your post, you and perhaps others feel it a waste of time to send a written email of protest. Sorry to say, you missed the point (and sarcasm) of my post.

    78. jb on May 22nd, 2007 1:52 pm

      #73 You told Rastus to go research it, referring to pool chemicals and decomposition in post #43. He did and couldn’t find a thing. Now you won’t back up what you said, instead you throw insults. Why don’t you admit you are wrong? You are clearly wrong. What is weird is you not admitting you are wrong. It is you that seems to be pushing an agenda, not the other way around.

    79. Carpe Noctem on May 22nd, 2007 1:57 pm

      The gift of Aruba – is the gift of dirt bath.

      You might as well just cut out the middle man

      and knock someone over their friggin head

      with a skillet.

      ARUBA IS FATAL. -j4n

    80. Meee on May 22nd, 2007 2:00 pm

      Feel free to e-mail Regis and Kelly. They have started giving away free trips to Aruba once again. Yesterday. Some women landed on pick a trip. She chose Aruba. She missed the question and lost the trip. Some peole don’t get it. No reason for anyone to visit that corrupt country.

    81. 10061906 on May 22nd, 2007 2:13 pm

      My daughter went to a psychic about 20 months ago.
      In the middle of her reading she stopped. She looked at my daughter. Your father has a problem. Tell him to go see a doctor and get every part of his intestines checked. He has a problem. Eight months ago I had emergency surgery and had 12 inches of my colon removed, had my intenstine moved off my bladder and spent 45 days in the hospital. Yes I took the advise but waited just a little too long before going to the doctor.

    82. JusticeforNatalee on May 22nd, 2007 2:14 pm


      Do your island a favor and tell authorities all you know.

    83. mayan_moons on May 22nd, 2007 2:59 pm

      Rasta i see you characterized Deal or No Deal as being “victimized”.

      How do you characterize Natalee’s plight of being seen taken away by J2K, where they come back to their families and friends but Natalee doesn’t come back for 2 years?

    84. glad2bAmerican on May 22nd, 2007 3:58 pm

      #71 & 67
      a Salt Chlorine generator?
      Salt is a natural element found in the earth, in our body and in our homes. It is used to season and preserve our food, rinse out contact lenses and soften our drinking water. Salt is a very economical commodity. When the ions in salt are passed over specially coated blades and induced with a low voltage electrical charge it is converted into chlorine. It is the same process that is used to convert seawater into laundry bleach. When this process is incorporated into your swimming pool you have your very own “chlorine generator”. Why an AutoPilot Salt Chlorine Generator?
      AutoPilot has been the technological leader in the chlorine generation process for swimming pools since 1976.
      Do the Vander Sloots have a Salt chlorine generator?
      Just wondering?

    85. glad2bAmerican on May 22nd, 2007 4:34 pm
    86. glad2bAmerican on May 22nd, 2007 5:00 pm

      Rock salt is used for packing meat and fish(preservative), for the manufacture of soda ash, caustic soda, bleach, and other chemical preparations, refrigeration, and agricultural purposes.

    87. Rastus on May 22nd, 2007 5:09 pm

      #85 Interesting link. I thank you for your providing it.

      I may have skimmed the site too quickly and missed it, but I didn’t see a reference where their patented system was useful for preserving human corpses. Perhaps I over looked their touting of their product’s ability.

      #83 — not that you would see the difference, but it’s apples and oranges (Deal/No Deal vs what you stated happened to Nat). Why do you attempt to compare the two? I wasn’t. An attempt to compare the two would be a weak argument that only the intellectually dishonest would use.

      Plus, we have no evidence that anyone has been vicitmized as you charge.

    88. Rastus on May 22nd, 2007 5:14 pm


      For such a preservation edeavor, one would need many pounds of salt. Maybe that is why paulie went to the amt — to withdraw money to buy salt.

      Frankly, the amount of salt required to preserve a body would likely be far in excess of what is needed for use as ‘pool chemicals’.

      BTW, I also looked through the website’s FAQs to no avail with regard to the preservative angle.

    89. mayan_moons on May 22nd, 2007 5:20 pm

      Answer the question Rasta, i didn’t suggest a comparrison be made between the two, you did.

    90. mayan_moons on May 22nd, 2007 5:34 pm

      How many Dutch Investigator’s can you fit into a fisherman hut?

    91. Rastus on May 22nd, 2007 5:48 pm

      #89, I did answer the question. But here goes again — just for you. We have no evidence that Nat was victimized as of yet. Loads of speculation, but no evidence. Otherwise, there would have been arrest(s).

      Myan, please don’t be disengenuos by stating that you offered no comparison. The fact that you put the two concepts within the same post effectively offers up a comparative. Otherwise, there would have been no reason for you to state my Deal/ND comment.

      If you carefully review my original post, you will note that I made no comparison there either.

    92. mayan_moons on May 22nd, 2007 6:02 pm

      You’re so full of it!~

    93. Miss-Underestimated on May 22nd, 2007 6:04 pm


      Yes there was evidence that Natalee was victimized. Thru his own statement Joran declared he was victimizing, raping Natalee as she was in and out of consciousness.

    94. Rastus on May 22nd, 2007 6:41 pm

      I don’t think Joran ever declared he was raping Nat.

    95. JusticeforNatalee on May 22nd, 2007 7:12 pm




    96. Maggie on May 22nd, 2007 7:45 pm

      Give it a rest Rastus, know anyone who has seen Natalee since the night of May 31st leaving CnC with those 3? She just “poofed, vanished” while in the company of those 3 with no personel belongings like a phone, clothes, a passport, transportation etc on an island 19 miles long and 5 miles wide. At what point do we start believing a pathological liar, who says I still lie everyday. Like he or his family are going to come out and admit guilt. In 2 years we have come to know Natalee well enough to know, she was an honorable, honest, hardworking and responsible person. I do believe the sex slave industry is a problem, but never have felt Joran VDS spent all evening at the casino wooing the MB girls and arranging for other guys to come and hook up with the MB students at CnC and forget a condom! PULEAZEEEE! and have never felt Natalee’s case was about being sex slave. Innocent people don’t need fake lies and alibis before the crime is even made public

      A day after Natalee’s missing, Paulus tells them if they have no body, they have no case.. He says he believed the Holiday Inn story until they changed their story around the 9th. Well if he believed it, why did he tell the boys, the day after Natalee went missing, if they have no body, they have no case. Case for who? the 2 black security guards they framed? Why was he get them lawyers? Puleaze!

      Aruba is 30 km (19 mi) long and 8 km (5 mi) wide, and has an area of 190 sq km (73 sq mi). The population of Aruba in 2007 was 72,194, giving the island an overall population density of 374 persons per sq km

    97. Maggie on May 22nd, 2007 8:16 pm

      These are 2 dif articles I have saved..an idol with younger kids and a good reputation???? What was she on?

      Anita’s delicious sporter and the bad TALES circulating about Joran being a gambler and sex addicted. Giving his mom thick kisses.. YUCKKK.. Anita saying Joran has only went to counseling for his study habits.. Paulus,, Joran lies no more than any other adolescent! Too bad the twilight zone is no longer on.

      The tensions head in the wake of an appearance Renfro made on the Van Susteren show. “Nobody knows this, but the family were the ones determining who goes on the shows,” she says. “It was all them.” That night, when Van Susteren asked about Joran, Renfro described the teenager as an excellent student with a good reputation and “an idol for the younger kids” at school.

      ‘ Joran is a delicious boy ‘ by Floor Ligtvoet Thursday 30 March 2006 –

      After some flirting at Carlos n Charlie’s and necking in the car, he explained, he brought Natalee back to her to hotel. Instead he left the little girl alone on the beach, he later admitted. The American media jumped on an all out hunt for Joran. Weekly photographs and old video of the Dutchman filled the American news shows. He is called a liar, a rapist, and an assassin. Joran’s possible involvement in Natalee’s disappearance proves to be a ratings hit. In one go the seventeen-year-old adolescent is world-famous. Who he is and from what kind of a nest he comes, is well known. Still for Anita van der Sloot, Joran’s mother, in the family house in the rural district of Noord where the dog smells the visitor before the gate opens. “Quiet”, Anita quiets the loudly barking dog, “It is OK.” The small blonde woman enters to a large dining table to sit. She is really not in the mood to talk. The family has already had so much crap poured out about them. But the flow of rumors concerning Joran does not stop. A day earlier a high-level police source whispered anonymously, that joran had been treated for lying. Nonsense, asserts Anita firmly. Her son has undergone only counseling to improve his study habits. Jorans father, former judge in training Paul van der sloot arrives after a long workday. Tired, he gives a deep sigh: “Joran lies no more than every other adolescent.” Paul wants rest at home. The family has the last year stood under enormous pressure, he complains. Their oldest, Joran, is surely not an angel. Every detail from his personal life is entirely taken out of context. “We must refer to the disappearance not the murder.” He talks gently and in a controlled way concerning his child, but Anita excites herself concerning the bad tales that circulate on the island. Joran gambling – and sex-addicted? He is simply a delicious youth! A delicious adolescent, who lives for friends, sport, and family. Oké, he has adolescent traits. Not always sticks to his appointments. If he is supposed to be home at one at night her turns off his cell so his parents can’t call him. If he gets in trouble later, he gives his concerned mother three thick kisses. They don’t have to worry, he is home now. Anita is enraged that her son is accused of rape. “He was in fact very loving with his girlfriends” Joran had always many little girls around him but the contact was frequently only friendly, she says. “They went with each other for as a brother and sisters” Paul wants to show Joran’s room. However., friends, both little girls and boys, could always spend the night he says as he crosses the garden to the outbuilding. Since he was 15 Joran had here, beside the swimming pool and at a reasonable distance of the parental house, his own bedroom and bathroom. Paul opens the door carefully. “Look, here slept four or five during the sleepovers. It was always completely normal. On Aruba it is normal to sleep over at someone else’s place. Minors are on the island entirely dependent on parents or friends with a driver’s license pick up and bring them. During a conversation in Arnhem Joran says he was always super-glad have his own room. “The privacy was very fine, especially if there were friends.” Of course he had also ordinary friendships with girls, says he as he hears his parents reaction. “One girlfriend slept ten times in my bed without ever something happening between us.” Attraction must come, as it happens, however, from two sides, finds he. If that is the case, however, he does not see, honestly said, the problem. Joran was already from age 14 having sex with girls. Also American. “On the island there lives a little the feeling that they are easy. There are guys who go to the beach to hook up with them. He has done that himself “but” he emphasizes, “I have always treated them with respect.” So if the girl does not want sex, then OK, its back to the hotel.” It should have been that way with Natalee but she wanted to stay on the beach, he says. Thus he left her behind. Joran has always affirmed he did not have sex that fatal night with natalee because he that evening had no condoms on him.

      link no longer works..


    98. JusticeforNatalee on May 22nd, 2007 8:35 pm

      ALE botched the case.

      That is the reason forensic evidence is lacking.

    99. JusticeforNatalee on May 22nd, 2007 8:41 pm

      “It should have been that way with Natalee but she wanted to stay on the beach, he says. Thus he left her behind.’

      BALONEY, Joran!

    100. dave on May 22nd, 2007 8:49 pm

      Why on earth are you people arguing with the TROLL Rastass? No wonder it keeps coming back to the “all you can eat buffet” you keep laying out.

    101. mayan_moons on May 22nd, 2007 9:49 pm

      Nah……i was just kickin it in the head a bit. I’m done!

    102. disgustedmom on May 22nd, 2007 10:21 pm

      Something I just thought of…maybe the searches are not over for the VDS home. I don’t know how it’s done in Aruba but if it’s like in the USA the detectives have to list specific things they are looking for on the request for a search warrant. Then they can only check for those things on the list. So maybe…just maybe the Dutch may have seen something or discovered something the last time they were there that interested them as far as evidences are concerned. Something they might put on a new list for another seach warrant.

      Same goes for the Kalpoe home. The first time there they only looked around. But who knows what they may have seen that they could put on a list for a new search warrant there.

      I’m hoping they do another search.

    103. 10061906 on May 22nd, 2007 10:51 pm

      I’m going to apologize in advance for the length of my next posting.

    104. boywonder on May 22nd, 2007 10:57 pm

      Isnt Joran the little Addonis? Thanks for printing those articles Maggie. It made me laugh to think of the “liitle girls” hanging at the house. Dont they call them bReZah sLETjUs in Holland??

    105. 10061906 on May 22nd, 2007 10:59 pm

      With what we know today; try this scenario.
      Aruba’s police force numbers almost 280 officers…please tell me why they additionally need this if Aruba is such a safe and happy island?
      (Visibility Team See the ATV’s and the police vehicle.)
      If there is such a low crime rate why does Aruba need this?
      (Security Guards) Sounds like a guard with a walkie talkie to me.
      If I wanted to set up a porn video studio, I definitely would need this.
      Camera Systems
      And then this bunch of gibberish.

      This really sounds like a front for something else.
      Why do the female tourist seem to be harassed around the Holiday Inn and the Excelsior?
      Why do the following males attempt to make out with the female tourists around the Holiday Inn and The Excelsior? Why was Beth uncomfortable at the HI?
      Joran van der Sloot, Deepak Kalpoe, Michael Dompig, Geoffery von Cromvoirt,
      Andreas ? Freddy and another only identified as AB. Could this be the attorney?
      Who has the contract for the video cameras at the Holiday Inn and Excelsior?
      Why does Michael and Geoff tell the female tourist they are police officers. Why does Michael brag to the female tourist that his father is the police commissioner?
      Why does Joran flaunt the fact that his father is a judge or lawyer?
      SO PSYCHOLOGICLY you female American tourist will feel safe.

      Why was Natalee and her roommates room change to the lower level room where access is not required by electronic key? (Patio door) Someone at the patio door may have been a VCB beach security guard doing a little peeping tom in ground level rooms.
      Why were quite a few of these males seemingly only accosting Natalee?
      And why would Deepak on the first night he sees Natalee say that she looked like a slut, dressed like a slut and danced like a slut. I recently chaperoned a Senior prom: none of the young ladies that I saw looked like a slut nor did they dance like one.
      What about the other MBHS females were any of them given the same title?
      How come Geoff’s picture appears in Holiday Inn Rooms. We can compare ads and identify the décor as to which hotel it is.
      If I had to put my money on a Lion, it would be on W v C and his associates. He must know Van der Straaten from the Netherlands. They were both police there. I would like to know why WVC left the Netherlands to set up his security business in Aruba. How and who signed the contract for him to install the security cameras in the Holiday Inn and Excelsior. Is he the head of security in the Excelsior? What is his link to Paulus Van Der Sloot or the Prosecutors Office. His daughter is an ALE officer and his son, who works(ed) for him at one time impersonates police. Even has a nice Aruba Police Tee Shirt. IMO there is/was an Emplyee Service Room at the Holiday Inn where drugged female tourists on their last night on Aruba were brought to and the Lions took their liberties.
      The episode at the rocks were probably not police; they may have been VCB beach security guards. Check the picture again.
      It is very easy to find out when a guest will be checking out.
      So two of the biggest scams to win over a female tourist.
      One of the pimps gets sexually aggressive with a female. She doesn’t like his advances.
      Another pimp steps in between, tells the other pimp off and suddenly the second pimp is the girl’s hero. He may buy her a drink and start up a conversation. Hopefully he can get her drunk enough that she agrees to go back to the hotel with him. They can share a cab because he just so happens to be staying at the same hotel. Once back in her hotel room, or his, he may order room service and slips the tourist a date rape drug. She is moved out of the room to an Employees Only Service Room. You could place some one in a laundry basket and no one would question what you have in it. You can imagine what happens. Once finished she is returned to her room and usually does not remember what happened. These pimps don’t just drop them anywhere on the beach. Too much explaining if they recovered there. But in their own room, nothing would have seemed to have happened or be out of place.
      The other routine is where Guido comes in. The girl may be losing and all of a sudden a lucky charm appears and he helps the tourist regain some of the money she lost.
      (Joran helped Ruth recoup some of her loses. “I liked Ruth better”)
      The ending is similar except instead of from a club, this starts out at the casino.

      In Natalee’s case I believe that someone from C and C’s called Joran to come over and get Natalee.. Did they need an attractive blonde for a porn shoot? Or did Joran have intentions of grabbing Ruth. But Ruth had gone back to the hotel so he settles for Natalee.
      Natalee probably knows Joran and also Geoff from the other nights. Geoff does his routine again and Joran steps in.
      Its now closing time and Natalee is offered a ride back to the hotel. She goes back in to tell someone where she is going. Buy now what ever they gave Natalee is now working on her. She is led out of the club and into Deepaks cab. Joran reassures her they will go back to the hotel were they are both staying. Joran does take Natalee back to the Holiday Inn. They go around back to the service entrance and place Natalee in a laundry basket. They take her to the service room. While there; doing what they have done at least 20 times before, something bad happens. Either they are too violent or Natalee may go into cardiac arrest…something bad happened???? Deepak and Satish had already left. The intention was to probably leave Natalee in the lobby or just in the hall. Other tourist would see her passed out and think she just had too much too drink. But now something bad that happened would show if she were to be found. Joran take her out of her; you brought her get her out. Paulus at about 3:30 to 4:00AM goes to pick up Natalee and Joran; just like he originally said. But of course not McDonalds. Later he trys to distance himself and Joran by saying he picked up only Joran at 11:00PM. Natalee was still at C and C’s.
      They return to 19 Montana and look up the interaction of drugs and alcohol.
      They place her in one of the other son’s bedroom. The one Anita says was not searched. There were two computers at the residence. Joran did not have one. On family desktop and Paulus’ laptop. Later as a cover we see him in the patio with his or his father’s lap top. By the way if he did not have a computer then whose computer does he watch his favorite porn site?
      During this time Joran trys to keep his father out of the picture and the father gives his son an alibi. Follow disgusted mom’s post. #31.
      Now as to where Natalee could be. The crypt, cremated or the gold mine ruins. I don’t believe she got to the sea, because everyone wants to look there. Burial anywhere on the Island is difficult because of the geology. No one has checked the crypts or the mines. However; if you wanted to make sure a body would not be discovered; you bury it in a familiar place where you have total control over anyone finding it. What you seek is not hidden, its in plainview. Natalee could not be found because she is far from where they have been searching. Cremation 25%. Burial on the Island 10%. In a crypt 20%. In the sea 5%. Now were are back to the patio area at 19 Montana 40%. Off the island in a coffin 0%. Slave market 0%.
      Three clues I believe are here. One. the backhoe worker was not permitted to finish the work. Two. The priest or the secretary protested too much, especially to DJ and then when DJ called Dave. Third. The moving van.
      Dirty hand knows and IMO if any one of these suspects gets as far as the courtroom; the whole house of cards collapses. If this is true and can be proven, then Aruban tourism will be just a page in a history book or a Beachboys song.
      I don’t think we will be eating crow for a long, long time minnesotadad.
      PS The bartender at Maambo’s was probably a plant to get everyone thinking that Natalee was taken to “THE LION’ DEN”.
      Who has control over video tapes of Natalee in the casino where the times don’t match the scene. Who was trying to provide an alibi for PVDS? Who can make a lobby surveillance camera disappear?
      On the list of VCB projects; the Holiday in and casino does not appear. However Maambo’s bar is covered by VCB.
      Sometimes there is truth in lies; you just have to look a little harder to find it.

    106. Carpe Noctem on May 22nd, 2007 11:03 pm

      No Anita,

      You dilapidated old cow… you seem to keep forgetting.

      At first it was

      an all out search for the mysterious 2 security guards

      that your sex addicted, pathological lying, alcoholic,

      date-rapist, murderer of son and his two friends SET UP!!!

      Then… after 10 days, when your idiot of a son had enough

      time to practice his lines & get his new set

      of lies down pat,

      THENNNNN it was an all out search for the

      ones that killed

      Natalee Holloway.


      Andre Santos PV:

      “When I told Joran that they had arrested

      the two security guards, he was very relieved.”


      Aruba and the date-raping / murderous

      Van der sloot & Kalpoes!!!

      HEY, The only

      way to die faster…

      is if you were to

      do it yourself! -j4n

    107. Pearl on May 22nd, 2007 11:18 pm

      I have to say that I do not believe that the ALE ever “botched” this case, only because – this would imply that “errors” or “mistakes” were made and the chilling fact that stands out to me about this case is that there seems to have been clear work going on to obstruct any collection of statements, or evidence.
      Therefore, imo, the ALE did not botch the case at all.

      The Ale seems to have been intent on NOT collecting evidence, NOT ALLOWING EVIDENCE to survive, and seeing to it that certain records and statements pointing to the guilt of Paulus, Joran, Deepak and Satish were systematically destroyed.

      But they could not destroy all the statements, and with all the records of statements being kept in the public record, it became increasingly difficult for those involved in the cover up to erase everything, even though they tried to do so.

      The systematic manner in which statements and evidence were destroyed / or never collected, was matched by the manner in which they chose to NOT follow up on information they had immediately at hand – yet, chillingly seemed to jump like blazing “cowboys” when it came to searching and seizing objects from two innocent Black men whom they knew could not have had any involvement at all in Natalee’s disappearance.


      Then compare that to all they did NOT have, yet CHOSE as a course to then “build up on” and “follow”…knowing that every false scheme would lead to nothing, while failing to take immediate actions on those situations that they knew would lead to PROOF POSITIVE OF THE CRIMINAL ACTS THAT TOOK PLACE, were systematically IGNORED.

      These actions and conduct of the ALE do not add up to “botched”. This was no series of “errors” or “mistakes”.

      What took place, (imo) truly adds up to: deliberate willful acts of CORRUPTION and COLLUSION to OBSTRUCT JUSTICE FROM EVERY SEEING THE LIGHT OF DAY.

      The focus was never on finding Natalee.
      It was always on hiding her from her family, keeping her from ever going home, and dismantling her truth so as to deny her any justice.

      The plan was to carry on, “business as usual”, except an amazing woman came into the picture, and her name is Beth, and her love for her precious Natalee refused to ever abandon her baby to that island and the contemptable deeds of those who took her precious child away.

      And an amazing man stepped forward named Dave whose love would not allow him to leave his baby behind.

      Their spouses and family and friends continue to stand with them, and they have won the friendship of many more people as more and more people learn of the horrible torture that all of them were put through, and continue to live in.

      If the ALE had ever “botched” this case, there would be room for the allowance that “mistakes” were made, but how can we possibly believe that ANY of this is the result of “mistakes” when clearly, FULL FORCE was targeted at the innocent black security guards yet, only a handful of detectives were available to take statements from the prime suspects, in the months of this so-called “investigation” when clear patterns of inconsistencies and deliberate acts to obstruct the investigation were readily present within 24 hours of Natalee being reported missing.

      Was there some kind of “shortage” on investigators, when you consider all the repeated HELP that the FBI continued to offer over and over again? Yet, we seem to find a pattern of certain names of certain detectives who handled certain suspects in this case. Why? Was there no other detectives on the entire island who knew how to ask questions particularly when the FBI was right there ready and willing to offer assistance but repeatedly denied access? That’s not a mistake. That’s purposeful.
      They didn’t want the FBI.
      They only wanted to USE their presence in an act of trickery to give the appearance of running a transparent “investigation” when anything but transparency was taking place.

      This was not botched.
      This was purposeful.
      This was intentional.
      And that is exactly why the criminal acts did not end with the murder of Natalee.

      This is what makes this case so fraught with such cruelty and heartless disregard for the victim – Natalee, and her beautiful family members who also became victims in this savagery.

      Aruba must eradicate the corruption and restore integrity if it is to EVER recover from the damage and harm that has been done on so many levels.

    108. JusticeforNatalee on May 22nd, 2007 11:31 pm

      You are correct and I meant PURPOSEFULLY botched as in COVER-UP.

    109. Carpe Noctem on May 23rd, 2007 1:23 am


      “And why would Deepak on the first night he sees Natalee say that she looked like a slut, dressed like a slut and danced like a slut.”


      Cuz Dirt-Pock Kalpoe is a CLASS A. numbnut loser,

      Weasel boy doesn’t get out much!

      He’s never had even 1 girlfriend in his life.

      This bozo gets a ‘hummer’ when he watches

      Sally Fields dressed up in a habit

      playing THE FLYING NUN.

      LOL :-)


      We will not forget

      about Natalee.

      Day 723

      She is loved.

    110. Richard on May 23rd, 2007 6:22 am

      1006 (#105) … The fly in the ointment, so to speak, is that Beth reviewed the videotapes from the Holiday Inn. None of them shows the three returning Natalee to the hotel.

      This is one of the strongest proofs of the cover-up. As Beth herself says, within 48 hours of her landing on the island the Aruba police had proof positive that the alibis of the three were a lie. A total lie. And yet the ALE allowed them to remain free.

      Even the three have confessed to lying.

      I know that few people are prepared to consider that Natalee may have been taken off the island. I have no proof that this was the case … not even evidence. There is no crime scene, as far as we know.

      I still think, however, that Aruba would know that, if this had happened and if the American public found out, their tourism industry would be destroyed forever and ever, amen.

      People might “forgive” an isolated crime IF THE PERPETRATORS WERE SWIFTLY PUNISHED. This apparently is why Cape Verde (with some four times the population of Aruba) moved so quickly in that horrific case I posted here some time back.

      But taking an American girl into sex slavery? Would anyone allow their family to go to Aruba after that?

      I’m not ruling it out….

    111. Richard on May 23rd, 2007 6:47 am

      I don’t want my comment about “forgive” to be misinterpreted. What I mean is, let’s say that it became known, say a month after Natalee vanished, that the three who drove off with her were arrested and would be tried for kidnapping, sexual assault and homicide or murder charges.

      Had this happened, few Americans (I think) would conclude that Aruba was an especially unsafe place to go.

      But the obvious cover-up is what has spawned that belief.
      And that there is a cover-up, I don’t think anyone can plausibly deny. My point was just that I think something darker is at work than an “isolated case.”

      I believe that ABC is running a series showing that the slave trade is alive and functioning today. I saw this article this morning … it doesn’t conform to the idea of human trafficking that prevails, but certainly does stretch one’s ideas about what goes on.

      Trafficking is a multi-billion-dollar business in Latin America ….


      Human trafficking victim speaks at NHS
      Advocate Reporter

      NEWARK – In high school, Theresa Flores was an upper-middle-class teenager who did well in school and ran track.

      But underneath that Flores kept a secret: She was a victim of modern-day human trafficking, held at night as a sex slave in her suburban Detroit town.

      Flores, who is now 42, spoke to around 600 Newark High School students about her experiences Tuesday as part of a human rights campaign started by three Newark sophomores as a class project.

      “You may have a sister like me, a mother like me, a daughter or a friend,” Flores told students. “I was leading a very normal life, but that was on the outside.”

      Flores published her story, “The Sacred Bath: An American Teen’s Story of Modern Day Slavery in the U.S.,” in late March. Her goal is to share her story across the country and to show people human trafficking happens across the country in the most unlikely places.

      Flores said her story began when she was date raped at 15. She accompanied her rapist a few nights later in hopes of getting back photos she found out were taken during her attack.

      From there, she was raped by a group of men related to her original attacker, and those men eventually sold her to other men, binding her with threats against her life and the lives of her family members.

      “I was living a nightmare and afraid for my life,” Flores said. “They beat me into submission and broke my will.”

      Flores’ horror story ended when her family moved away, and she didn’t tell anyone for years.

      “I didn’t trust anyone,” Flores said. “I just wanted to have a normal high-school life after that.”

      Flores said she decided to write her story as a way to let go of what happened to her. She said never intended to publish the story but decided to as a way to shed light on human trafficking in America.

      Flores said she knows friends and teachers were aware something was wrong when she was in high school but never reached out to her. Not publishing her story would be the same type of inaction, Flores said.

      “If I’m quiet now, I’m doing the same thing that they did,” Flores said. “No American survivor has come out to talk about this, and that was more important to me.”

      Even though Flores has decided to share her story with strangers, she said she still doesn’t share all of the details with her family members or friends because she fears too many wouldn’t believe her story.

      Flores said she also wants to shield her teenage daughters from her horrible history.

      “They just know something horrible happened to Mommy when she was about their age,” Flores said. “I don’t want them to think differently of me.”

      Flores encouraged students, who were clad in human-trafficking awareness T-shirts, to reach out if they suspect some one they know is being victimized.

      “Ask them, ‘Can I help you? Is there something in your life that you need out of?’” Flores said. “A lot of times you meet a human-trafficking victim, they are weak, and they don’t know what to do.”

      Brandi Harris, one of the students who organized the high school’s anti-human-trafficking campaign, was excited to have a speaker address students.

      Brittany Harris worked with her sister, Brandi Harris, and classmate Patrick Haren to develop the campaign as part of a human-rights project for their sophomore English class. They group started by posting fliers, making announcements and selling T-shirts and strings to raise awareness about human trafficking.

      Brittany Harris said Flores contacted them about speaking to their school after reading about their campaign online.

      “She wanted to share her story,” Flores said. “It’s kind of hard to believe.”

      Brandi Harris said the group originally wanted to have a speaker as part of their awareness campaign, but didn’t think the campaign would be large enough or that they’d be able to arrange one.

      “It was fate,” Brandi Harris said.

      Haren said he was glad to have a speaker because he believed it would pique students’ interest in human trafficking more deeply.

      “It’s different when you hear about it from some one it happened to,” Haren said.

      Because of the success of the students’ campaign, which raised nearly $300 for human-trafficking groups and was featured on the anti-trafficking campaign Web site Not For Sale, the group said they’re already planning a more organized awareness campaign for next year.

    112. Rastus on May 23rd, 2007 9:11 am


      “kickin in the head, a little”

      That’s good. Disengenuous, but good. I hope you have more pleasant dreams.


      If being a troll means one who has a different opinion than the group think on this board, then I will gladly call myself a troll.

      Long live FREEDOM OF SPEECH! You folks seem to support it — well until an opinion contrary to your own is expressed.

    113. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 9:24 am

      110 Richard: I don’t see any fly in the ointment: I know that Beth said she reviewed the Holiday Inn tapes from the LOBBY: What I said was Natalee was taken to the service entrance. This is usually in the rear of a building, below ground level and does not always have video surveillance. And if in fact there were cameras there; by her admission about only the Lobby tapes; she did not see any others. Therefore if Natalee were brought in the building; say in a laundry basket, Beth did not have access to that tape. IMO if a type did exist it was more than likely erased.

    114. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 9:35 am

      Carpe: I’m still waiting for an answer to my question:
      That was; what makes you believe that Natalee was shot and especially in that part of the body?

    115. minnesota dad on May 23rd, 2007 9:39 am

      1006 & Richard,

      Guys, I keep this one very simple. The predators, their handlers, ALE, AHATA, judicial branch, etc. have all attempted to make this much more complex than it really is.

      It is very clear that the perpetrators, their handlers, ALE, and even the current Dutch Investigators want to avoid #19 Montana.

      It is clear that everything was done by both legal and judicial means to protect #19 Montana from search and future searches.

      It is clear that PVDS, who lives at #19 Montana has been consistently protected by his friends in ALE and the judiciary.

      It is very clear that efforts were made to alter the crime scene, ranging from changing out furniture, to laying new cement and landscaping in the midst of the investigation. All of this happening at #19 Montana.

      We have seen Joran plant Size 14 shoes stolen from the tennis club’s lost and found on the beach to make it look like he was there.

      We have seen Joran’s belt planted at the lighthouse….just to make it look like he was there. All of this done to point away from…#19 Montana.

      So, Paulus and #19 Montana is where everything took place. Simple crime….with a cover-up executed to confuse.

      Again, you must understand the ‘criminal mind’ of defense attorneys to fully appreciate what they are doing. The goal is to ‘Muddy’ up evidence and create as many diversions to create doubt about the true perpetrators. We have seen it all here – insurance policy accusations, check the MB kids, check Boeti, some guy running around at the fisherman’s huts, Natalee ran off to have Jug’s baby, etc. Aruba has created ALL OF THESE smokescreens to divert from the simple crime that took place at #19 Montana.



    116. disgustedmom on May 23rd, 2007 10:26 am

      Here’s some food for thought.

      All this talk about Joran saying he was a tourist too, staying at the HI too….Why would being a fellow tourist/Joran (albeit a stranger) be more of a thing one would trust than an islander – both essentially being strangers?

      I ask that and for you all’s ponderence on it because I wonder if Joran actually told them he was a tourist at all or if he were somehow a contact made prior to the trip, sort of like a guide to the funner places on the island off the boring beaten path of the travel package.

      My thinking goes partially like this: Past MB graduation classes vacationed in Aruba. Likely, secrets of forbidden fun was passed on to future classes, and I’d venture to guess such secrets were passed to only a trusted elite few who could be trusted to not rat out the secret whereby parents might find out and prohibit their kid from going. I would imagine this would be a very well guarded secret that would not even be mentioned now after something went horribly wrong, so of course anyone who may have had contact with Joran prior to the trip is going to deny it by saying they met him first there as a fellow tourist.

      But see, the tourist thing doesn’t make sense to me. Joran was alone traveling as a tourist? And somehow he was trusted even though he was more than a stranger to them than an islander would be…and islander who could be more likely to be able to be found and dealt with should anything need reporting? And it seems, if only because it hasn’t been reported otherwise, that Nat and her roommates were the only girls on the trip who had involvement with persons not from their class. I find that odd. Almost as if they knew in advance of Joran via other past class tripsters. Of course, this would not be something they would share even now since doing so would not help solve this case. But it would be interesting to know who might have had contact with Joran prior to the trip if any such contact had been had, and it might serve to explain why Natalee got in the car with Joran in the first place. From there, who knows where this could go.

      I’m going to propose another idea to ponder in my next post.

    117. disgustedmom on May 23rd, 2007 10:30 am

      #114. Just thinking about guns and being shot in general here…what about a Stun Gun? It would leave a mark that would create a need to hide a body too?

    118. disgustedmom on May 23rd, 2007 10:48 am

      Here’s my next thing to ponder:

      What about that ground floor room anyway?

      I heard 2 tales about that room. I heard Natalee switched to it while her friends were already in it (don’t know who she switched with) and I heard that Natale and the other 3 girls all switched to it from another room they had all shared together. Don’t know which it is, but it doesn’t really matter with what I am currently pondering at this juncture…which is…

      Why the ground floor? Some say to bypass the lobby. Why would the MBies need to do that? They wouldn’t as far as I can imagine. So what about so non-hotel residents could come and go freely? I don’t think so, because I travel and I have stayed in so many hotels it’s ridiculous and I have never once seen any hotel employee question any person coming through the lobby to the room areas. In fact, it’s rather scarey that they don’t.

      The ground floor is neat of course, in that you can take a short cut to the outdoors, but what else is it good for? It could be quite handy for not having visitors on lobby camera. Now why would this be important? It wouldn’t be for the MBies…but it could be for the visitors.

      But if I imply the visitors wanted to remain anonymous, then I have to ask, why? I’m inclined to think it’s just a precautionary tactic because said visitor is perhaps helping tourists find other things to do that is on their travel itenerary in case the tourist get in trouble. So now, how the girls got that ground floor room becomes important.

      How did they come about it? And were they the only ones from the MB group with a ground floor room?

    119. Pearl on May 23rd, 2007 10:59 am

      Oh, 115, MD….you are a morning cup of CLARITY!

      Nice job, MD, and how utterly true and accurate!

      This is not complicated.

      It is so simple, the three year old next door wants to know: WHY DIDN”T THEY GO TO “THE HOUSE” RIGHT AWAY?

      Again, MD – you are more refreshing than a morning cup of java!

    120. minnesota dad on May 23rd, 2007 11:00 am


      As most Scared Monkeys readers know….I am dead set on PVDS being brought back into this case and put away for his crimes. Even the AHATA shills that come here to protect J2K stay mysteriously silent regarding Paulus and #19 Montana.

      Having tracked this case from approximately June 2nd, 2005…ALL paths and tracks lead to the doorstep of #19 Montana and PVDS.

      Cover-up…I’ll give you cover-up!

      On June 19th, 2005 – It is documented that PVDS was brought to the police station AS A WITNESS and questioned regarding what he knew.

      Paul van der Sloot was questioned Saturday night, said Police Superintendent Jan van der Straaten.

      “He was questioned as a witness, no more or no less,” van der Straaten told The Associated Press. He declined to elaborate.

    121. minnesota dad on May 23rd, 2007 11:07 am

      The software truncated my post……I ended with this:

      PVDS was questioned as a witness on 6-19-2005. Based on known documents that are ‘in the file’, there is no 6-19-2005 witness statement from Paulus.

      There is, however a 6-23-2005 SUSPECT Statement.

      So, Aruba and Dutch Investigators….please explain the “Case of the disappearing 6-19-2005 witness statement of PVDS”. That statement would have been chock full of timeline information – both for PVDS and J2K. As all were still trying to figure out their stories/alibi’s for the evening, I would be quite confident that Paulus’ witness statement would be full of lies.

      In Aruba, lieing as a witness = jail time. Why is there no 6-19-2005 witness statement? Why does Paulus’ ‘on the record’ history in this case begin on 6-23-2005 when he was arrested as a suspect. Lieing as a suspect does not equal jail time in Aruba.

      Dutch Investigators – when you throw this case out as ‘cold’ in two weeks, please provide an explanation for the missing witness statement of PVDS from 6-19-2005.


    122. minnesota dad on May 23rd, 2007 11:18 am


      It has been stated as FACT by the Aruban courts that Paulus Van Der Sloot had two meetings with Natalee Holloway on the night/morning of her mysterious disappearance.

      However, in reviewing known case documents from the Dr. Phil hearing, there has only been one suspect statement made by PVDS – that statement was made on 6-23-2005.

      Dutch Investigators — Why do we have dozens of statements from each of the other suspects in this case, but one….yes only one…statement from the gentleman/suspect with NO TIMELINE for the evening who was seen hitting on Natalee at the casino and who the courts found as FACT had two contacts with Natalee Holloway that evening?




    123. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 11:27 am

      Minnesotadad; I agree with you that 19 Montana has been avoided like the plague. I’ve also been saying that for months. The dunes, the lighthouse, the beach, the fisherman’s huts, the ocean (excuse me the Caribbean Sea) the caves, the land fill, the racquet club, the pond: everything west of route 2a/2b. The St Ana church/cemetery is on that route number. Montana and the gold mines are east of that road.
      Something took place at 19 Montana. Whether Natalee was originally brought there or she ended up there or is buried there. That is what I have been trying to work out from the muddied information we have. I have a problem in that I like to work out a project from (A) and how I arrive at (Z). So sometimes my postings are too long.
      We have a good idea as to who was involved. We don’t know the specifics of why Natalee was choosen. We don’t know where she is.
      Sometimes when you work on a project and when you start from (A) there are a lot of variables that tend to spread out and things get confusing. However if you work backwards sometimes a problem is much easier to resolve. It’s like pouring a liquid in the wrong side of a funnel. Use it the right way and everything comes together.
      At this stage in the investigation it is apparent that there has been a cover up of the highest magnitude. We have the whys, who’s and where’s to be answered.
      Sometimes when a complete theory is presented, whether or not it is 100% accurate; I feel something will fall out that is useful.
      My primary objective IS:
      Using what sketchy information we have try to find where Natalee is today and if possible return her or her remains to Alabama.
      Why? So she and her families can have peace and closure.
      Every thing else then will fall into place and justice will be served.
      Nobody involved in her disappearance is going to talk.

    124. minnesota dad on May 23rd, 2007 11:31 am


      The case of the Karin Janssen letter releasing PVDS as a suspect.

      FROM Bon Dia – January 6, 2006


      However, yesterday the Public Prosecutor notified Mr. van der Sloot for him to drop by their office and come get his good conduct document. This was based on the last case that Mr. van der Sloot brought for damages and prejudice.

      A couple of weeks back, van der Sloot started a case where he asked for damages and prejudice for his arrest and the days that he was imprisoned. During the treatment of the case Mr. van der Sloot’s attorney, Mr. Swaen, showed the judge a letter from the prosecutor that dealt with the case of van der Sloot where the prosecutor said that Mr. Paul van der Sloot could not obtain any case documents because he was no longer a suspect.

      On the basis of this letter, the attorney told the judge that the prosecutor let it be known that the case against van der Sloot was over. The judge said in his decision that he is in agreement with the attorney.

      Given that the prosecutor herself said that Mr. van der Sloot is no longer a suspect, which according to the judge can be looked at as the prosecutor saying that the case is over, since the prosecutor will no longer pursue the case. This signifies that Paul van der Sloot will soon start working as a lawyer in Aruba and the case he brought forth against the Public Prosecutor will not go forward since he obtained his good conduct document, which is the document he was missing to be registered as a lawyer.”

      OK, so let’s get this straight.

      1) Joran is a minor. My guess is that even under “Dutch Law – Aruban Style” a parent of a minor can receive access to the files through the minor’s attorney.
      2) Even if 1 isn’t the case, Paulus, through Joran’s attorney can obtain any document he wants for review. It is fallacy to think that Paulus could not get FULL access to the court files through Joran and Joran’s attorney.

      So, why the facade of providing a letter to Paulus stating he couldn’t get documents because he was ‘no longer a suspect’?

      Seems pretty obvious to me. The letter provided Paulus with the ability to get a ruling from the court stating he was no longer a suspect — which adds a legal layer to this onion. Paulus then goes to the court and adds an additional layer — receiving $30,000. Paulus gets greedy and finally the courts turn on him — releasing that in fact there was adequate evidence to arrest him as a suspect.

      So Dutch Investigators….why aren’t we retracting Karin’s letter? Why aren’t we reversing the ‘void’ order from Paulus’ black robed buddy from Curacao???


    125. minnesota dad on May 23rd, 2007 11:49 am

      1006 –

      I think the crime is simple.

      I really think that this was a bunch of punks that did some incredibly stupid things that night.

      Predators being stupid, cost a life.

      When a key predator is the son of a defense attorney, this is what you get. Spinning, blaming others, insurance scams, ran off with a boyfriend to have Jug’s baby, a MB kid killed her and disappeared her in the five hours before leaving, etc. etc.

      Combine it with Aruban Tourism concerns and the cost the case could have there, arresting and releasing the two black guys six months later for lack of evidence/alibi’s was the terrible decision made on that island.

      Those first ten days and the cover-up decisions made cornered Aruba into increasing the cover-up and broadening the lies in order to protect and cover for the prior moves made.

      Where Paulus and other accomplices got rid of the body to is where I struggle – and most of your theories I could support (cremation, crypt, gold mine shafts, etc.). I could live with any of them.

      It all comes back to Paulus Van Der Sloot. Bring him in!


    126. Pearl on May 23rd, 2007 11:53 am

      120, 121, 122 …. Bingo!

      Clarity is a joyous event!

      Minnesota dad, again, your clarity rings like a liberty bell crying out for Natalee Holloway to be set free!

      Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding!

      Eight clamoring bells crying out for justice, until the end of May 2007.

      Imagine: records in the Aruban courts indicate that Paulus Van der Sloot – the man who LIED TO BETH and Polis about having any knowledge of NATALEE or of his son having taken Natalee away in a car with Deepak and Satish, has a BIG CONFLICT in his LIE-statements made and what is on record in the Aruban courts.

      Interesting MD, how those “LIAR WITNESS” statements have vanished, right along with JORAN’S LIAR WITNESS STATEMENTS, while only DEEPAK AND SATISH’S LIAR WITNESS STATEMENTS REMAIN.

      Uh oh.

      That does not look good for Deepak and Satish.

      Minnesotadad, do you recall Arlene Ellis Shippers commentary – if any, on OBSTRUCTIONS OF JUSTICE?

      Do you think there is any allowance for OBSTRUCTIONS of justice in Aruba’s judicial system for the likes of PAULUS, ANITA, and the gang of co-conspirators who were implicated by their own lie-statements, and/or criminal conduct – and / or references to such conduct by Karin Janssen?

    127. Pearl on May 23rd, 2007 12:00 pm

      Boom! 125!!!

      Funny how the TRUTH has the impact of an explosion as it shatters all the lies, collusion and corrupt depravity displayed.

      Again! The clarity sobering when you consider the level of deviousness displayed, the criminal collusion that went on, and continues.


    128. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 12:09 pm

      I have dealt with a few psychos in my life and one thing stands out with them.
      They will tell the truth in a lie; but will add so much unnecessary information that the real truth them becomes obfuscated.
      Joran dropped off Natalee at the Holiday Inn Front Lobby.
      Paulus then has to take Beth specifically to the front door of the Holiday Inn. Taking her there to show specifcally where Natalee was dropped off. Show her what the front door looks like.
      This IMO means that they did take Natalee to the Holiday Inn but it was not the front lobby she went through.

    129. Richard on May 23rd, 2007 12:20 pm

      Not saying you’re wrong, MD … but I’m not so certain that this is such a simple case. The cover-up has gone on for too long and too many are involved. Let’s hope we find out.

      Meanwhile, what we can do is promote the “boycott Aruba” movement. Aruba Tourism Authority will be in New Orleans at the end of June (see the post on a higher-up thread).

      Stand up for Natalee in New Orleans!

      No justice for Natalee … no tourism for Aruba.

    130. Pearl on May 23rd, 2007 12:27 pm

      Once the Holiday Inn surveillance tapes – immediately revealed INCONSISTENCIES between WHAT Joran, Deepak, and only hours later – Satish stated in their many many lies as “witnesses”, the attempt was then made to suggest that the HI VIDEO SURVEILLANCE TAPES were broken!
      This occuring while HOTEL EMPLOYEES concured with the sruveillance evidence that the WITNESS STATEMENTS BEING MADE by JORAN, DEEPAK and SATISH WERE ALL FALSE, and that NO DROP OFF EVER HAPPENED.

      Then, the “We dropped her off right in front of the hotel lobby” LIE…. MORPHED FROM…

      We dropped her off RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE HOTEL LOBBY ENTRANCE ( MD – another LIE-WITNESS-STATEMENT that is missing), to…

      We dropped her off ahead of the lobby,
      next to the lobby,
      across from the lobby,
      behind the lobby,

      then to be morphed into…


      only to become….


      Van der Straaten was quoted as telling the press, AFTER KNOWING FULL WELL THAT NATALEE WAS NEVER BROUGHT BACK TO THE HOLIDAY INN – that, “she could have come through another way..” while knowing full well, that she was never even dropped off, because she was NEVER BROUGHT BACK TO THE HOTEL AT ALL.

      May 31, 2005
      Satish Kalpoe

      ‘ …we got bored…and we all agreed to go to THE HOUSE…’

      ALL PATHS LEAD TO THE VDS, Dutch Investigative team.

      Dutch Investigative team: Give honor to knowledge and justice, by demonstrating integrity for TRUTH!

    131. mary on May 23rd, 2007 12:47 pm

      Ok after reading something on another post somebody please clarify something for me. If the first night Beth arrived on the island was the sake night that she went to the VanderSUCKS house and they took her to The HI to show where they dropped off Natalee(keep in mind 1006′s thoughts of the patho liar telling truth in lies) And since have said they got together and made up the lie then how did they know to make up that lie when,if they had nothing to do with the dissaperance at this time would not she was missing. Answer that Joran I know you look at this website you to k2

    132. fred on May 23rd, 2007 1:14 pm

      just because one hasn’t seen a leaked piece of evidence doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist does it? Why would a blogger feel entitled to view documents in an on-going investigation? I do not understand the sense of entitlement if you are a blogger and not a family member.

    133. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 1:18 pm

      130 pearl: I said earlier SERVICE ENTRACE. not the lobby.
      Read 113.

    134. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 1:21 pm

      minnesotadad: 125 Richard 129 Okay I agree; However I don’t believe Paulus or his position is powerful enough to warrant and island wide cover up. Something else they were engaged in at a different level, if exposed would explode in everyone’s face. Starting from Oduber down. You know sh-t flows downhill.
      So a judge’s son rapes someone and kills her. Arrest the son and convict him.
      Isn’t that what happened to Kennedy’s nephew? The girl he killed with a golf club?
      But say some of the senators watched this act either in person or on tape
      and +++ ==== cover up

    135. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 1:23 pm

      Mary 131 Exactly; you answered your question.

    136. Pearl on May 23rd, 2007 1:52 pm

      133…. In my heart, I have come to firmly believe: ALL ROADS LEAD BACK TO THE SLOOTS. Their first course of action (by Paulus, Joran, Deepak and Satish) was to obstruct,deceive and mislead. I believe that they know exactly where THEY PUT HER and LEFT HER, and it did not include being brought back to the Holiday Inn hotel.
      If you recall, hotel employees referenced a review of TAPES, (to the best of my recollection).

      124: Minnesota dad, again, clarity is a beautiful thing indeed and you make good logical sense that slices through all the balogna, and serves up TRUTH plain and simple.
      You are so very right! This is NOT complicated.

    137. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 2:08 pm

      132 Fred: If I may quote again: “You do not need to see a grain of sand in your eye to know it is there.”

      Also if you if you go back to June 26, 2005.
      Shango and Paulus’ attorney said the same thing.
      Paulus waved the right not to testify against his son.
      Which came first: The chicken or the egg?

    138. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 3:17 pm

      I found my answer:
      10: Shango Says:
      June 26th, 2005 at 3:43 pm
      The fallen judge agreed to sing because he can hum any tune. He needs to sing for his son, or see the end of his Babylonian offspring.
      Paulus Van Der Sloot waived his right to not testify against Joren because he is untouchable either way.

      Monday June 27, 2005
      Fox News
      The lawyer representing Paul van der Sloot said that on Sunday (6/26/05) that his client has waived his right not to testify against his son. Under Aruban law, parents have the option to refuse to testify against their children. In waiving that right, Paul van der Sloot is essentially agreeing to take the stand.
      Shango posted that statement on Sunday June 26th, 2005 the Attorney’s release said Sunday; Fox news is Monday June 27, 2005.
      So I have to give some acknowledgement to Shango’s riddles.
      How would Shango know what was going to happen on Sunday June 26, 2005 unless????

    139. alma on May 23rd, 2007 3:47 pm

      ok when was Shango’s riddles written who is the author Somebody elaborate.

    140. U Know Who on May 23rd, 2007 3:49 pm

      Ok Freddie I think they are on to us You must call my Dad!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    141. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 4:23 pm

      139 Alma; Where have you been? Shango posted to SM starting in June 2005. If you get Dave’s book the Shango riddles are in the back along with Dave’s interpretations.
      Just Google SHANGO

    142. alma on May 23rd, 2007 4:38 pm

      Ok so this Shangos Riddle was written about Natalee

    143. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 5:31 pm

      It is interesting to note that Joran went to kindergarden at guess which school. St Anna. Right around the corner from Montana. So Paulus and Joran are no strangers to the church or the cemetery. And probably the priests, secretary etc. etc. etc.

    144. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 5:56 pm

      You gotta read Joran’s book. This guy is a loose cannon and well just read it. Anyone that has been following for the past two years will understand.
      IMHO His subconscious is on a guilt trip.

    145. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 10:41 pm

      Joran can’t seem to get anything straight. When discussing his night at C and C’s he bought Natalee a shot of Bacardi 151. That is his favorite drink. That’s what he orders.

      Excerpts from his book
      From day 1 he drank whiskey-coke as his favorite drink, he does not like beer.

    146. 10061906 on May 23rd, 2007 10:54 pm

      I had asked if anyone knew where in the states Koen was living. I got shot down. But per Joran’s book..
      Koen is as old as Joran . Koen is a shy boy who does not talk a lot to girls and he is a very quiet boy
      - Sander is 2 years younger and the opposite of his borther
      - they used to live on Malmokdrive but after the father sold the insurance company they moved to the US

    147. anonymous on May 24th, 2007 8:34 am

      Fishermen’s Hut/ Boat Houses.. shed like buildings

    148. 10061906 on May 24th, 2007 9:09 am

      116 disgustedmon: read the excerpts from Joran’s book. The answer to your questions lay within the gibberish.

    149. 10061906 on May 24th, 2007 9:32 am

      Does anyone remember what I posted concerning the geology of Aruba. I mentioned that the beaches were artificial, imported and were only 18 to 24 inches deep. That in order to bury Natalee at night in such a short time frame, they would need a back hoe. Burial at the Fisherman’s Huts would have resulted in a grave of only 2 feet deep: much too shallow to prevent an animal from digging at it. Yet the cadaver dogs never had any hits. Interesting that the V D Sloot’s property had some yard work performed and a back hoe was required. Also the backhoe operator was released before the patio/concrete work was finished. IMHO’; if Natalee is buried at the Van der Sloot’s, it is because they were forced into burying her there. And; as long as King and the rest keep restricting the ground searches, she will remain hidden. But as an aside; murderers usually bury their victims in a place that they are familiar with and have easy access. Hmmmmm.
      Does anyone recall the date when the back hoe was used.

      Also Natalee’s room was just across the alley from Maambo’s Bar. Interesting that the bar tender at Maambo’s, said they took Natalee to a place at 17 Noord.
      “Lion’s Den” But that address has a phone referencing a dentist???
      Could he know that the Lion’s Den is at the Holiday Inn and the address at 17 Noord is a red herring.

    150. 10061906 on May 24th, 2007 10:03 am

      Was this a slip of the tongue by Van der Straaten when he initally said that even though Natalee did not come through the lobby door; maybe she came through SOME OTHER DOOR?
      Maybe the Service Entrance in a laundry basket?

    151. disgustedmom on May 24th, 2007 10:49 am

      1006, Re: #149

      I have a busy few days, but I will read the excerpts this weekend. I’ve read some, but I’ve not devoured them, so to speak.

      Question to ponder….when Deepak says THE HOUSE…what does that mean? I don’t think he meant Joran’s house because he would have said YOUR HOUSE. What is THE HOUSE?

    152. glad2bAmerican on May 24th, 2007 6:02 pm

      FYI still stuck on salt/chlorine
      Embalming fluid solution does not contain large amounts of salt not to say Natlaee was embalmed though!Just curious

      Embalming fluid
      Solution zinc chloride l gallon
      Solution sodium chloride 6 oz to pint = 6 pints
      Solution mercury bichloride l oz to pint = 4 pints
      Carbolic acid (pure) = 8oz
      Glycerine 24 fluid oz
      Mix the glycerine and carbolic acid then all the other ingredients, when clear solution of 2 gallons results which, proper amounts for a body weighing 150 lbs

      Also they had a funeral director at their disposal so why bury her in their yard…embalming or preserving only lasts a little while and the body starts decomposing and in unsantitary.

    153. Sebastian on May 26th, 2007 7:08 pm

      Carpe Noctem, are you Micky, the security guard?


      SM:   Are you a Van der Sloot or Kalpoe?   (klaasend)

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