RSSAruba: One Sad Island
Its not just us saying it, from the pages of Diario. One would have thought they would have taken a concerted effort to make things right at this point.
Help the ATA … Create your own island slogan.
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Comments
307 Responses to “Aruba: One Sad Island”
JUSTICE FOR NATALEE
JUSTICE FOR NATALEE
JUSTICE FOR NATALEE
Geez–What part about that don’t you understand, Aruba?!
BTW–Your cover is blown, Aruba. Bigtime.
Any symbolism with the ’shoe’ in this cartoon?
Whose shoe is that supposed to be? md
Well at least others are starting to realize you can perfume that pig, but I like the one about putting lipstick on a pig, too.
The logo could be a big fat stinkin pig with lipstick
Now just for the slogan…
The appropriate logo for Aruba would have to have some visual reference to a sewer, probably with lots of contaminated syringes (to represent the drug trade). If you can work in trash in and on the beach, so much the better. Not to mention people keeling over in C&Cs, the casinos, bars, etc.
“Aruba … the land that justice forgot.”
thank god nothing bad ever happenes here…
why do you people have such a grudge on aruba
be willing to bet there is much much more to this story
How about ONE DISGUSTING ISLAND, or ONE PATHETIC ISLAND…ONE DEMENTED ISLAND….oh i could keep going….
has anyone heard from carpe????I hope hes okay!
How is 1906 and where is Carpe?
It will be surprising who all is connected with this Aruba story. Connections probably run all the way to Boston and New York, cities don’t mind having tourist conventions with Aruba included.
Great cartoon. Aruba rebuilds and thing still fall apart.
molly (in Houston)
Island from Hell
How about ONE PERVERTED ISLAND…ONE LYING ISLAND..ONE UNSAFE ISLAND..You know there is a saying”we hear what we want to hear and disregard the rest….so how about “ONE STICK YOUR HEAD IN THE SAND ISLAND”
2.
Dicon boso ta core bai? Boso bin yudami!
Why are you people running away? Y’all come help me!
The shoe is supposed to be people running away i guess.
________________
SM: Crioyo - I just read in Amigoe that the Soul Beach Festival will NOT be returning to Aruba this year. Have you heard the same? I believe the article states it will be held on another Caribbean island. (klaasend)
ONE DEMONIC ISLAND….ONE LOST ISLAND…
The island hell won’t have
Caution: you are about to enter
Pigs Island
…I just can’t figure out why Oduber insists that we keep replacing this sign….
those monkeys keep knocking it down….
Besides, he’s not fooling anyone………….
“Somebody get me the ladder! You know the rules:
We must keep up our appearances for those that can read!
The rest of them? Well, they know they’re not happy.”
Once Happy Island.
One Crappy Island.
FUBARUBA!
(Someone uses “Once a Happy Island” as their sig line.)
Crioyo - Thanks for translating the caption. Think you’re right about the outbound shoes.
2006: 13 murders in Aruba that we know of. Almost triple the homicide rate for the U.S.A. See page 16 of the Murder & Crime thread.
I think that could be Ruebens shoe.
Wow!!! Did you see that?
Cioyo… you need to report another siting…
Van der Sloot just drank his Orange Juice and
ran through the airport knocking down our new sign!
That guy is amazing… he broke EVERY letter!
(Hey Crioyo! Just kidding ~~~~ Smiles at ya)
@msmarple: New Orleans is a very peaceful place to live http://edition.cnn.com/2007/US/01/09/new.orleans.ap/index.html
“Aruba the only Island where you can drug, kidnap, rape, murder, dig your own grave and dig yourself back up again! That’s what you call one crazy Island!!
Re: #19….Fl…New Orleans is not a peaceful place to live and the citizens who want peace are in the face of the politicians fighting for it….that is not happening in Aruba.
The number of murder cases in 2006 for Aruba is 6:
January 2006: A.P.
April 2006: D.D. and R.C.
June 2006: I.R. and F.D.
December 2006: M. mcA. (will be tried as accidental death)
All those who committed them are in detention already sentenced or awaiting trial.
You are right Klaasend, the Soul Beach Festival has been moved to the Dutch island of Sint Maarten, eventhough it attracted a large group of tourists and locals, it did not generate profits for the island. The organization only required almost over 100 complimentary rooms in different hotels. This was announced a couple of months ago.
Personally, I think the caption that Crioyo just gave is the best!
After the pimps took the “happy” out of the island in 2005,
Oduber is left to pick up the pieces.
He cries, “Dicon boso ta core bai? Boso bin yudami!”
And, then… changes into his military suit…
What the !?!?!?!?!?!?
Hey Oduber:
Take a hint from New Orleans! If you were going to call
your militants, you should have done it sooner…
Too late now
Whatsha gonna do Bad Boy?
#22…MF…I hope that I can copy and paste the 2006
Murders and Crime in Aruba…lets try…this information is
available on this site along with much more information:
Note: we believe there were 13 murders that we know of, on Aruba, in 2006. The dates of those included in this count are in red font.
01/06/2006 - “An American couple is raging on Aruba. The couple was robbed yesterday … The Americans victim had become of a overval, where the robbers thousand dollars, credit card and the drivers license of the man buitmaakten. The victims were treated brutally with violence and incurred thereby light wounds.”
Amigoe.com 01/06/2006
Posted 9/14/2006 at M&C thread by msmarple, credit BFN
* * *
01/06/2006 - “A report which is circulating in Holland caught Diario’s attention, related to a declaration from the High Command of the police in Utrecht. Among other things, it is mentioned that with suicide cases, it is desired for all these cases, that DNA tests be conducted on the bodies.
“Two unsolved cases were illustrated, in the first instance the victim committed suicide but it resulted later after the test, that this was not the case.”
Diario 01/06/2006
Posted 08/14/2006 at M&C by msmarple; from LCD
* * *
01/12/2006 - Date of message board post: ” … there was a couple mugged outside of our resort while we were there …” They apparently were staying at Mill Inn Resort.
http://tinyurl.com/t6ujk
Posted 11/16/2006 at M&C by bleachedblack
* * *
01/23/2006 - Man found dead on boat near the Marriott.
From Bon Dia 2006 “Year in Review” issue: http://tinyurl.com/y2efz2
* * *
01/23/2006 - From a message board post dated 02/02/2006: “On the third night (still with many of the problems unresolved) the villa was broken into while we were sleeping. The thieves were actually in two of our bedrooms while we were asleep!!! We lost everything that was not in the safe in a different bedroom … ” They were staying at Villa Alexandra.
http://tinyurl.com/y36nhu
Posted 11/01/2006 at M&C by bleachedblack
* * *
02/12/2006 - Alberto Augusto Peral (Peralta?) apparently killed by a gang.
From Bon Dia 2006 “Year in Review” issue: http://tinyurl.com/y2efz2
* * *
03/20/2006 - The ship Rachel S arrived in Aruba the Sunday of Carnaval Grandi with a dead person, Bernard Ramsaran, on board, and a local autopsy determined that the man died of natural causes (heart failure). However, an autopsy conducted in his country of Trinidad - Tobago disclosed that he died of traumatic asphyxia; e.g. strangled and choked. The body had visible marks of violence. As Diario asks, how did Aruba miss this one? (Interpol is investigating as a High Seas case.)
Diario
Posted 8/28/2006 at M&C by msmarple, from Getagrip. Update posted 9/13/2006 by Anna. Also 9/13 by Appeals
* * *
03/??/2006 - American tourist robbed and beaten in an alley in San Nicolas.
From Solo di Pueblo 2006 “Year in Review” issue, A section, Starting on Page 16:
http://tinyurl.com/y4uhlb
* * *
03/??/2006 - Dave Billy Aubert, 20, a local, killed in a hit & run.
From Solo di Pueblo 2006 “Year in Review” issue, A section, Starting on Page 16:
http://tinyurl.com/y4uhlb
* * *
04/05/2006 - Dinesh ‘Pitbull’ Djoegan, found on/in Guadirikiri cave. His body was mutilated, crucified, and set on fire. Death initially ruled a suicide and/or overdose. SM has photos. There were convictions in this case.
Amigoe
Posted 8/10/2006 at M&C by Anna; credit to SunFreak2. Update posted 8/19 by msmarple
* * *
04/18/2006 - Raul Croes attacked, killed in a restaurant by a man with a machete.
Solo di Pueblo
Posted 8/10/2006 at M&C by Anna; credit to leslie
* * *
05/23/2006 - Enrique Reynier Loefstop, 51, beaten to death by his(?) son, with a baseball bat. Apparently an altercation over the son’s drug use.
From Bon Dia 2006 “Year in Review” issue: http://tinyurl.com/y2efz2
* * *
06/??/2006 - Igor Richardson killed outside Las Vegas bar, San Nichols.
From Solo di Pueblo 2006 “Year in Review” issue, A section, Starting on Page 16:
http://tinyurl.com/y4uhlb
* * *
06/??/2006 - Man beaten with baseball bat at Malboro Ball Park.
From Solo di Pueblo 2006 “Year in Review” issue, A section, Starting on Page 16:
http://tinyurl.com/y4uhlb
* * *
06/??/2006 - Couple detained for something about a baby. What does “doodslag” mean? Couple’s initials: FCEF and FAPD. “Circumstancio poco strano.” Could this be the “Baby D” case? Ferdinand Alexander Dijkhoff? (See 12/16/2006)
From Solo di Pueblo 2006 “Year in Review” issue, A section, Starting on Page 16:
http://tinyurl.com/y4uhlb
* * *
??/??/2006 - 33-yr-old Colombian man sentenced for molesting an 11-yr-old mentally retarded girl. Dates mentioned in the article are November 2005 and June 2006; cannot determine when the incident(s) occurred, however this case is not listed in the SM 2005 Summary.
From Bon Dia 2006 “Year in Review” issue: http://tinyurl.com/y2efz2
* * *
06/23/2006 - Unknown, unclothed woman found in trash pile; Bon Dia prints graphic photo of corpse.
Posted 8/13/2006 at M&C by msmarple; update posted 8/14 by msmarple
* * *
06/??/2006 - Male corpse found floating offshore; reportedly a fisherman, wrapped in tarp. No further detail available.
Diario ?
Posted 8/22/2006 at M&C by lexie. Update from Hotshot via msmarple posted 8/29
* * *
06/24/2006 - U.S. tourist “bothered” by “false polis” attempting to exchange sex for a “fine” for an undisclosed, not revealed, offense.
Amigoe
Posted 8/28/2006 at M&C by msmarple, from LCD thread
* * *
07/27/2006 - Gang rape and cell phone taping of 16-yr-old girl at school. Tape was uploaded to internet. Girl’s parents not pressing charges; polis make no arrests. Girl was sent to live with relatives on another island.
Diario
Posted 8/14/2006 on LCD by sandy leiva on LCD; to M&C via msmarple
* * *
08/21/2006 -British woman reports attempted rape.
Diario
Posted 8/22/2006 at M&C by SunnyInTx, from Refugees Unleashed (RU)
* * *
08/21/2006 - Local female attacked at her Wayaca home by two men who hold knife to her throat; rob the house; demand to know where the woman’s husband, a polis officer, keeps his gun.
Amigoe
Posted 8/25/2006 at LCD by Sharon; at M&C 8/25 via msmarple
* * *
08/29/2006 - Diario reports the arrest of a man for attacking a female tourist at a restaurant.
Posted 10/17/2006 at M&C thread by msmarple; posted on LCD by SunFreak2 10/16/2006
* * *
09/03/2006 - U.S. tourist with 4 other people including 3 females, was assaulted by the bouncer and 5 patrons at Cafe Bahia. The tourist had 3 ribs broken and his left shoulder was fractured. Tourist says some of the patrons who attacked him were from the Curacao racing team.
Posted 10/16/2006 at M&C thread by 2NJSons_Mom
* * *
09/18/2006 - Diario reports that a public employee working as a bouncer at a night club battered a tourist who subsequently required medical attention at the hospital. The bouncer was arrested and fired. The tourist returned home. This may be a follow-up on the 09/03/2006 incident at Café Bahia (above).
Posted 9/14/2006 at M&C thread by msmarple, posted by klaas and Easywriter on LCD 9/18.
* * *
09/??/2006 - Mysterious death at Tanki Leendirt (near “Euro Kitchen”?) of chef/cook of Eagle Hotel. Cause of death unknown.
From Bon Dia 2006 “Year in Review” issue: http://tinyurl.com/y2efz2
* * *
09/??/2006 - Man convicted, sentenced to 24 yrs for killing of Pino Suarez. No indication of when this crime occurred. Suarez may have been one of the unidentified men found dead earlier (see 01/23/2006 and 06/??/2006).
From Solo di Pueblo 2006 “Year in Review” issue, A section, Starting on Page 16:
http://tinyurl.com/y4uhlb
* * *
09/??/2006 - Pascualito Geerman found dead at Baco Prins. Cause of death not noted.
From Solo di Pueblo 2006 “Year in Review” issue, A section, Starting on Page 16:
http://tinyurl.com/y4uhlb
* * *
10/??/2006 - over 3,000 kilos (over 6,613.8 lbs) of drugs seized.
From Solo di Pueblo 2006 “Year in Review” issue, A section, Starting on Page 16:
http://tinyurl.com/y4uhlb
* * *
11/14/2006 - Bon Dia reports death of Igmar Camallo. Polis investigating; cause of death not known; disposition unknown.
Bon Dia
http://www.cspnv.com/archivo/pdf/Nov/14/A-14-11-06.pdf
Posted 11/14/2006 at LCD by leslie;
* * *
11/15/2006 — A woman lodged a sexual assault complaint against Ramon Lee, Minister of Labour, Sport, and Culture. Prime Minister Nelson Oduber stated, “It’s a very sensitive matter and I regret the way everything is now in the media. I also regret the fact that I had to hear the woman cry again telling her story on several radio stations today (Friday, editor).”
Amigoe.com 11/15/2006 and 11/27/2006.
Posted 11/16/2006 and 11/27 M&C by msmarple
* * *
11/16/2006 - “We have no alien necessary that ounce come say how unsafely our island is. An Aruban who such call things, calls I to a country traitor, lets stand to an alien who gives a bad name to Aruba abroad. That is still more terrible. That says to minister Rudy Croes (MEP) of justice on remarks of Jorge Pesquera, director of Aruba Hotel and Tourism Association (AHATA).”
This is a rough translation, from a Dutch version of Amigoe.com.
Posted at BFN by PearlinUSA on 11/16/2006
* * *
11/17/2006 - Date of post on SM LCD; a screen shot of a SM Front Page post by an Aruba resident (excerpt):
“Carlos ‘n’ Charlie is the worst place to go. Of course they wait for the girls who are spending their “last night in Aruba” - night. This date raping or gang raping is going on for a long time now. The local victims don’t even go to police, cuz they’re too embarrassed about the situation.”
Brought to M&C thread by dkpen 11/17/2006
* * *
11/24/2006 - Diario reports that Pedro Arthuro Gomez-Torres, 39, was murdered at the Bongo Bar in San Nicholas. He worked at Valero Palm Beach.
http://www.diario-aruba.com/2006/11/24/
Posted by Leslie on M&C thread 11/24/2006
* * *
12/04/2006 - Diario reports that Hoben Mayron Bayne was killed outside of Carlos & Charlies. Occurred during the night of 12/02/2006-12/03/2006.
Posted by Grande at Truth4Natalee (T4N), and by klaas and msmarple on M&C thread 12/04/2006
* * *
12/16/2006 - Diario reports that Ferdinand Alexander Dijkhoff is accused of killing his four-month-old baby. (He was convicted.)
http://www.diario-aruba.com/2006/12/16
Posted by msmarple on M&C thread 12/16/2006; subsequent posts by Leslie and Florida on the LCD clarify the man’s name.
* * *
12/27/2006 - Diario reports that the body of Carlos Arturo Moreno Castro (Carlos Moreno) was found on the beach. He was minus an ear. 20 kilos (44 lbs) of cocaine are somehow involved. Polis do suspect foul play.
http://www.diario-aruba.com/2006/12/27/
Posted by klaas on M&C thread 12/27/2006.
* * *
12/27/2006 — Diario reports the apparent suicide of Brigitte Christine Katelaan, 37, a producer for Tele Aruba. Death by hanging.
http://www.diario-aruba.com/2006/12/27/
Posted by klaas on M&C thread 12/27/2006.
Mere
Thanks
MF, when Soul Beach Festival moves to St. Maarten, you don’t think they will have to comp those same or more rooms, or is it that Aruba can’t take the hit of having to give rooms away to promote tourism, if your tourism is down and then you got to give it away, it is costing to do business,,,,but in a very flourishing business/tourist arena comping is away to bring in more money to the secondary businesses (casino’s, food service and shops), Unless of course, you have no other business.
#26…I just copied the information…there are a number of smart monkeys who have been reading and researching for weeks….and compiling it to the “Murders and Crime in Aruba” thread. This does make one think twice before buying a ticket to Aruba.
Mere re #25 this is just the thing that you need to fax to Ms. Rice in Washington. It is enough to open everybody’s eyes…..chris
Aruba is a thug ridden island.That no american family should ever visit.They Aruba have spit in the face of american familys everywhere.
#3 Miss-U. The pig would have to be deceased before it would get any publicity and have it’s photo in the newspapers.
ONE OSTRICH ISLAND ONE WAY ISLAND
How far is Aruba from the Bermuda Triangle?
Oduber:
Which was the most infuriating for you?
The rape victim’s crying or the fact that it was on the radio? Or both happening at the same time? (post 25 11/15)
You run a pretty tight ship, there, don’t you? But, it looks as if there is a leak!?!?!?!!
January, 2007 - Camilo Romero - T.V. Cameraman -
Another - Death by Hanging
Or was that TWO leaks?
Maybe they should have listened to Croes:
“Anyone going on the internet, communicating with the aliens, will be considered a traitor” per se (post #25 11/16)
The cartoon is right - everything comes right back to you…
afterall, you are the Big Hog on the Top of the Ladder at the Pig Sty…. nothing gets past you.
Justice for Natalee
Boycott Aruba
May Natalee’s Spirit HAUNT them for the rest of their miserable lives. May the MONKEY’s Haunt them for the rest of their miserable existance, UNTIL we get JUSTICE for Natalee.
Thank you for giving me the chance to clear the misunderstandings:
01/06/06: This was a robbery that took place.
***
01/06/06: A report from the Netherlands, where in the Netherlands it has happened that a case was considered a suicide, while in reality it could have been a murder. Not a murder case here. Only a decision to do autopsy on suicides.
***
01/12/06: As it was descrobed it is a robbery that was posted by a person. No murder case here. Notice the ‘apparently’.
***
01/23/06: The man that was found, there was an autopsy done and he died of a heart attack, not mentioned in this small article.
***
01/23/05: Robbery that took place, not a murder case.
***
01/12/06: A.P. was killed by a choller now in costudy.
***
03/20/06: Person killed on a ship that was later
transported to Aruba. Not a murder case in Aruba.
***
03/??/06: Not a murder case, but a robbery.
***
03/??/06: A traffic accident where the driver ran away. Driver later arrested for leaving site of accident.
***
04/05/06: D.D case where the man died of overdosed when drug capsules in his stomach broke, he died in the arms of his friend. His friends were all convicted for destroying an object, since after dead, a corpse is considered an object and jail sentences can go up to 6 years.
***
04/18/06: RC was killed with a machete outside a restaurant by person with a criminal history; sentenced to life in prison.
***
05/23/06: The 51 year old that attacked his mother dies of an overdose, by using a bad drug called ‘burrundanga’ that made him aggressive and then stops the heart.
***
06/??/06: I.R. Murder case.
***
06/??/06: Marlboro beating; problem with Mansurs, no murder case here.
***
06/??/06: Baby F.D. Killed by his father, when he slept on the baby. Was tried as ‘doodslag’ aka murder. Mother was initally detained.
***
??/??/06: Not a murder case, man was sentenced for indecency.
***
06/23/06: This was the body of a woman (Illegal) that drowned when wanted to swim to coast on the northern side of the island. Many have drowned this way and their bodies never found. Other that came with her and manage to swim to land, told her story. Picture was too graphic as her body was pinned onto the rock with all the trash that washed ashore.
***
06/??/06: Same case. No murder here, sometimes DIARIO is not that reliable when they printed that the body was a man instead of a woman.
***
06/24/06: Not murder case here, a possible robbery or rape for money attempt.
***
07/27/06: Not a murder case here; a problem that started by some kids at a school when they accused each other of taking naked pictures and passing them around, the media dropped the case, when it became clear that it was an attempt of one of the kids to put others in problem as the 16 year old was the mastermind of those tapes. No charges. That the mother was embarrased of her daughter behavior and left the island, I cannot confirm that.
***
08/21/06: This is not a murder case, if true it is a rape attempt.
***
08/21/06: This is not a murder case either; if true it might be a robbery.
***
08/29/06: Not a murder case; report of police arresting a criminal.
***
09/03/06: Not a murder case, but a fight that broke between a group of tourists and another group that came to Aruba for a Racing event. The fight took place in front of Bahia Restaurant. The bouncer that tried to stop the fight also got involved and was later arrested.
***
09/18/06: See above. No murder case here.
***
09/??/06: Death at Chef was not known by the time of the report. He died of a heart attack and was under influence of drugs. No murder here.
***
09/??/06: Case that took place in St. Maarten back in January 2006.
***
09/??/06: P.G. died when a wave pushed him off the rocks into the rough seas, witnesses say. Friends say he was fishing and could not swim. Not a murder case here.
***
10/??/06: Report of ALE seizing drugs. No murder case here.
***
11/14/06: I.M. cause of Death was heart attack; known heart problem. Not a murder case.
***
11/15/06: Not a murder case; a sexual relationship gone wrong.
***
11/16/06: Not a murder case here; a minister’s reaction of Jose Pesquera’s political statements.
***
11/17/06: Not a murder case: a biased posting by a person who want to promote gang raping and wants to believe to know what happens in other countries better than what happened next to him.
***
11/24/06: Same case as 01/12/06.
***
12/04/06: Accidental death when victim broke his neck when he felt on the pavement after being punched by a person that wanted to stop a fight. The guy will be tried as assault with deadly consequence; maximum of 8 years of jail.
***
12/16/06: Same case as 06/??/06. Already sentenced.
***
12/27/06: C.C died by drowning. He did not miss any body part (ear), just another mistranslation. The article stated that he had earrings on, not that he missed an ear. He was not connected to the drugs that were found earlier at that same place, but the ALE first considered that option. Not a murder case here.
***
12/27/06: B.K. committed suicide. Had personal and financial problems in the Netherlands. Not a murder case here.
Over 700 people dies every year on the island. But you do not have to link them all to murder.
And if Soul goes to St. Maarten, good for them. They know the quantity of tourism they need.
And Patti, Croes was talking about a group of local people that send false information abroad only for their agenda. Including Milton Ponson that sends e-mails around to people that support any ‘boycott’ against Aruba. Not about telling the other side of the story or giving facts.
I hope you do boycott the island, your posting are just hatefilled, I doubt you will have fun here anyway.
You people are something.Try looking up crime sprees on a weekend in Kingston or Port of Spain.Even the Virgin Islands isnt so safe.Most of you folks have never been to Aruba and never would have gone there anyways.I have been there 10 times and would like to move there.So I hope your boycott works…just long enough for me to get a preconstruction property at a good price.Less Americans the better anyways!
Yeah….may the monkeys Haunt them & ride their backs til they’re face down in the dirt.
MF:
Perhaps the hate is inevitable when you post to a board
as MF…?
You ever think about that?
Oren:
Obviously you are an opportunist. You will fit in well
with Aruba…. they like opportunists and predators.
Good Luck.
Why is it someone is telling me what a wonderful place Aruba is when I have seen cover-up on TV. Get real Aruba is an awful place. American lives are of no value if it interferes with the Dutch on the island. I know Natalee goes with Joran and pimps does not return. He is involved period. The Dutch just plain let Joran get away with it. You people visiting Aruba and had good time are probably so ugly pimps wouldn’t bother you. Some people are plain dumb too, that would account for some wanting to live there.
Maybe some want to hang out at the crack shacks, who knows?
#34 So move there, Oren.
I bet there are a lot of property deals on Aruba now –due to its
well-deserved bad image.
MF,
We hate injustice. That is what we hate.
We hate lies and we hate coverups.
Aruba see tourists as crime targets, they steal & drug female tourists so all the ugly local teens can gangrape them.
Appearance is everything according to Paulus.Why did he go to court and block the FBI from coming into this case? Why did he not allow a full search of his property? Why were people Paulus said he worked with for years and were friends investigating this case? Why did he turn down Tim Miller when he showed up to search? Why did he meet repeatedly with all three suspects while Mickey Johns and Abraham Jones were in jail and get them lawyers? Why was his friend Straten on this case? Why did they call a witness who talked to the police over to their house to ask them what he told the police? Why was his friend Mr King at the house when they came to search, telling people where they could search? Why did he not call his son on that night and say get home, the cops are here looking for you, instead of leading everyone away from the home for an hour on a wild goose chase? Why did he say he took Joran his bag and gave it to him while Joran was walking to the WYndham, when Joran stated he played tennis and put his bag behind the counter and walked to the Wyndham? Why did he say Joran sneaked out the second night and in his police statement he says he gave Joran permission the second night to go to the Wyndham and to be out? Why did Paulus say he picked up Joran at 3 or 4 am the night Natalee disappeared then changed it to 11? Why did Paulus say no body no case to the 3 suspects, then denied saying it? His own son said he did, and the prosecutor said he confirmed to her he did. Why has Mr. Cohen never been on tv again after telling Rita he would look at the casino tape and find out if it was Paulus? he’s been awol since. Why was Paulus on the computer the same night Natalee disappeared, before it was known Natalee was missing, looking up drugs, lawyers and alcohol? What did Deepak mean when he told one of the security guards in prison that the Dutch guy and his father, family got together with them around the pool and made up the Holiday Inn story. That story was told the first night Beth was in town, so it had to be made up before it was even public Natalee was missing. How did Paulus know? Yep, Paulus appearance is everything..
The Aruba Triangle, where 18 year old girls want to sit on a beach at 3 am alone ONLY when they go out with Joran.
Frank told it well on his site a few days ago..
http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/
Joran said he was a 19 year old soccer player from Holland, makes him look like a tourist also.
Deepak says they go out and either Joran or Freddy got the girls, they pick them up go to CnC’s or to the hotel. They’ve all been in the same room having sex with tourists before..
Joran says we’ve done this 20 times before and nothing went wrong.
The Kalpoes were the taxi and Joran could’ve very well said you can share a ride back to the hotel, since I am staying there also. None of the group reported seeing the Kalpoes there that night. Beth says Natalee never saw the Kalpoes till she got in the car. They more than likely did that 20 times before.
Well I think Aruba pretty much started the hate. First by detaining two wrongfully accused men, because of race. Then the whole character assasination of Natalee and her family. Oh and lets not forget, the run around, Dave digging in the filthy dumps looking for his daughter, then denial to have others, like FBI help search. That pretty much describes HATE to me. I hope that wouldn’t fall under the description of hospitality?
Maggie, it is known that Paulus has a larger hand in this than meets the eye, Paulus, Cohen, Dompig, Jaansen and Renfro, VanderStraten, have sold out the entire island for what? We must be close to finding out, that is why we are getting all these visitors. Who is that OLD man that was on the video with Natalee the last night she was ever seen again?
Go, Maggie. Tell it.
Even Joran’s own attorney can’t stand him–can’t stand to defend him.
Antonio Carlo had to clear his conscience and confess to Karin Jannsen that
JORAN PLAYED A MAJOR ROLE IN NATALEE’S DISAPPEARANCE
Wonder if the idiots that post here in rebuttal of the truth get paid by the paragraph or number of words or the number of posts?
Oren, you’re welcome to Aruba. And I agree with you: the fewer Americans who go there, the better.
In fact, that’s what most of us are trying to do: to discourage ANY AND ALL Americans from going to Aruba.
Lie in the mud with the rest of the hogs if you will.
I don’t know IndyDan, but would you classify an “idiot” as person who says no matter what facts turn out to be or what the actual truth turns out to be, JVDS is guilty of murder? Just curious…
#46 Most likely by the number of lies they spread. Would they get a bonus when they reach a certain amount? They all seem to be trying to outdo each other.
lol IndyDan Good Question! Prolly all 3 you mentioned & some we don’t know about yet. Yeah we know some people are still going but Aruba as a Graduation or Spring Break Holiday destination is over. This boycott is thinning out the herd of attractive tourists for sure, words out these loser’s wanna drug people for sex.
And Aruba has shown the WORLD:
This is what might happen to your daughter.
(given date-rape drug and killed)
This is what Aruba will do.
(Nothing)
Oh, wait, Aruba WILL do something:
(coverup the crime and trash your daughter)
actual truth? from aruba? hahahaha
you make me laugh!
MF give it up. People will not come
to an Island as hateful as yours! An Island
that treated the mother of a missing (most likely
murdered girl killed by Joran Van der Rapist)
like a criminal.
Hateful people? After that display to
the world during the Holloway Case…
one thing is for sure, the Aruban/Dutch
that could act like that when someone
is at their most vulnerable point -
are FULL of HATE.
ARUBA - ONE HATEFUL ISLAND! - there’s your slogan.
People have eyes. People have brains. People
can see what the Government of Aruba says
never matches what it actually does.
That is why your tourism is non-existant
at this point. In the end, numbers speak,
and yours are through the floor.
Justice every other day i think about that….i’m thinking okay everyone in Aruba knows how these guys (their sons) put ghb in tourist drinks, they rape these girls on vacation for gods sake & Aruba leaders do not care.
They killed Natalee & laugh about it.
They laugh at Natalee’s family.
YoYo:
JVDS is guilty of murder?
——-
Not only is this little carnivore a cold blooded murderer…
You left out the part our about him being a stalking rapist
along with his degenrate of a father.
You never were good with details when they pertain to Joran The Rapist!
-J4N
Hey Carpe!
Glad to see you sir!
Let see…
Let me look at the calendar…
It’s January the 11th, Two-Thousand and Seven
and Karin Jaansen has apparently still not felt
the dire need to find the energy to get her off of
her fat Dutch BON-BON EATIN’ ass to bring Natalee Ann
Holloway’s
murderers to justice!?!?!?
ARUBA - ONE HATEFUL ISLAND.
Your inactions speak volumes to
potential tourists the world over.
THIS IS WHY NOBODY IS COMING.
-J4N
hiya Mayan Moons,
Good to see you as well!
Hi, IndyDan, You are prolly right. Ca-ching!
molly (in Houston)
Carpe:
I just wanted to draw your attention to the fact that we have another American missing in the Carribean:
Joel Gove went missing as he was hiking on a trail near
a sulfur mine on the Dutch island of Saba.
When asked by the family if they could post “missing”
signs around the island, the officials said that they
could not. The Government Officials of the island
stated that it would be bad for tourism.
We received this information, this morning; and, to my
knowledge, he has not, yet, been found.
Our thoughts and prayers go out to his family and friends.
We pray for his safe return.
What an odd coincidence that not one but two people who work for television networks in Aruba turn up dead in one week. Both hanged. Anyone ask Peter if he had contact with her on his investigation of Natalee’s case in Aruba?
Ms. Mayan:
I think that it is more than just a coincidence. After the first hanging, we were suspicious, especially after the statements made my Croes. But with two dead by hanging in little more than a week is just way to weird to be coincidence.
That is especially alarming to me as, if it is true, it is an indication of the authorities power to, not just cover up a crime but also to shut people up. People that very well may have been speaking out against the injustice either in the things that they were saying or the things that they were doing.
It is very sad.
I wonder if this has been the status quo for so long in Aruba that they are calous. They don’t seem at all concerned. Sad, but not at all suspicious.
It’s late. I only wanted to make sure that Carpe was aware
of the news in Saba.
Go get ‘em, Carpe!
It’s good to see you back.
Night.
Thanks Patti & Mayan
I was not aware of the tourist on Saba.
Two hangings is mind boggling… and not very likely
a coincidence. A young woman hanging herself outside
the patio of her apartment WAS A STRETCH.
Two hangings… something is WRONG. VERYYYYY WRONG!
I guess it’s a DUTCH THANG, huh? :rolling eyes:
Aruba makes me sick.
http://tinyurl.com/ygq79p
-J4N
I wasn’t aware of the tourist on saba either.
wowser’s freaky pic thar Carpe!
I’d like to be holding the strings in Dompig, Sloots (hell there’s to many to name) during you mofo’s vacations a$$holes.
You hurt Natalee & it makes me angry.
You’ll get what you got coming one of these days boys.
#33 MF,
What on earth are you talking about?? I know English is not your first language but the title of that thread is Murder AND CRIME in Aruba. Not all of those are supposed to be murders. Some are just as you state, and only other violent crimes. No one said every crime listed there was a murder as that would be far more than any dozen we documented, now wouldn’t it?
So what exactly is it you think you have cleared up? We have clearly marked the various robberies and room invasions as just that and the murders as what they are as well. You have just verified that these other violent crimes did happen for us, lol, thanks but we don’t need your help as we have already found these examples.
No one ever said ALL of those were murders! That would be about fifty! But they are all either murders OR other violent crimes committed in the tourist district or in restaurants or bars or other places frequented by tourist or of interest in some manner to tourists.
We by no means attempted to document every crime for that would be just about a full time job there as so much of it for such a small island. We only listed the very few that would reflect on tourists and tourism and their safety as the papers are daily crammed with all manner of other crimes that we do not have time to delve into. Tourist safety is what we are most interested in.
But we do stand by our count and until someone demonstrates otherwise, will continue to do so. Just saying the things we listed as robberies were not murders is just plain peculiar for we never said they were murders in the first place. I don’t understand your point in saying what we called a robbery was not a murder.
And for 2005, we were right on the money, right in line with the official count given by Aruban Law Enforcement. We used the same method and technique for 2006 so I think we could expect the same result.
Again, I am trying to be very patient as I know English is not your first language but you seem to have totally missed the entire point of that thread and misread just about every entry. How can you suddenly be having so much trouble with English? I have never noticed it being that difficult for you like this. Maybe you should go back and do that before posting next time especially if claiming to respond to something. Murder AND CRIME, get it? Some are murders and some are other crimes. But the total for the year I will await some official count if you don’t mind for as I said, we used the same method that resulted in an accurate count for 2005.
And some things have still other points of interest like the man Aruba said died of natural causes in April and yet his family had autopsy performed off island only to find out he was strangled. The point was not where he died (on the ship) but that somebody in Aruba lied about the cause of death and we took that from an article about Interpol so I think I will take their word for it before I do anyone from Aruba.
And suicide is considered a violent crime in this country as it involves the taking of a human life even if by the person themselves. Guess we lack Arubans’ tolerance and also tend to think burglary and robbery violent crimes as well. That would be unlike one of the hotel workers as reported to have told tourists that it was just poor people taking things to sell for money. Well, DUH! That is how that usually works.
Some of those room invasions were pretty scary, too, with the people in the room sleeping! As I said, we by no means attempted to list all crime, just the very small portion of it that involves the tourist.
You see, we have been lied to so often that we no longer can trust Arubans as a source and must seek third party verification whenever possible. But I would never go back there and yes I have been twice in the past. It is no big deal and certainly nothing special. Less attractive than other islands in the region in fact. But it is the hateful way that Americans have been treated there that mosts repulses me because I don’t pay people to insult me or my fellow countrymen who fall victim to their crimes.
Aruba was already lying about the disappearance of Max Devries long before Natalee Holloway disappeared. They got away with that, or so they think, and so tried to run that scam again but accusing Beth of doing what they wrongly accused his mother of doing, too, fake insurance claims. It is not that easy to do such a thing in the first place as they just won’t pay in the absence of a body for a very long time, usually seven years, and also Max’s family donated all they received to a Children’s Hospital in Michigan, hardly the acts of a scammer.
But the locals believe everything they are told and so took it for granted that this really was about insurance. Ir so the game is played out. The officials lie and the locals pretend to believe them just like partners in a d dysfunctional marriage.This is the way they were accustomed to treating Americans who are victims of crime. Well, this time they didn’t get away with it and many people have had their gut-fill of all the lies and hate and apparent jealousy from Arubans.
I know I have for as I said, it is nothing special and certainly not any place to endure any grief over seeing. Not worth the time it takes even by air as there is just not anything there that cannot be found closer, safer and more pleasant. Seen one island in that region, seen them all but most are much prettier than Aruba and have better vegetation and are much, much cleaner. Parts of Aruba stink, literally! And the decor is so 1980’s! Or was last time I saw it, dated and dirty.
So thanks for your effort MF but next time if you will read, you might save yourself all that bother. It is both Murder AND Crime, not just murder.
.
The Saba story is heating up; the family of the missing man is calling on the FBI to get involved. Another triumph for the Netherlands Antilles … and a direct comparison to Natalee is made.
You can be certain I’ve been sending this story to Dave Holloway and Beth Twitty since it came out.
Is it POSSIBLE … the island of Saba is concerned more about its tourist image than anything else? Is that island the summer home of Aruba’s government?
Hey, guys, you’re ALL going down together! (I hope)
Missing man’s family says FBI is needed now
ARTEMIS COUGHLAN, Staff Writer
01/11/2007
TRENTON — The ex-wife of missing Trenton businessman Joel Gove is calling on authorities in the Caribbean to bring in America’s FBI to help search for him on the rugged island of Saba.
Amy Gonzales said that Gove, 47, of the Glen Afton section of the city, left on a Christmas Day flight to the island, which is part of the Netherlands Antilles, a Dutch-held group of islands.
She has accused island officials of not doing enough to find Gove because they are worried about harming their image as a tourist destination.
“There is nothing new,” Amy Jones, an employee of Gove’s West State Street company, Habitat Management and Design, said yesterday.
Gonzales and co-workers are eagerly awaiting the island’s police report on the missing man.
“They’re not finished with their investigation,” Jones said.
Only a couple days ago, officials asked for his credit card records, said co-worker Lynn Ashton.
Once the family receives a copy of the officials’ police report, they can take it to the FBI so they can get involved in the search, Gonzales said.
“They’ve done almost everything they (could) do and they need help from the United States,” Gonzales said.
“There are better resources here.”
On Dec. 27, Gove left the Hotel Elmomo in the morning, bought a bottle of water at a store at the base of Too Far Trail at about 9:30 a.m. and started his hike up the rocky trail rimmed, in part, with cliffs.
Gove, a very fit and healthy man, was last seen at 11:45 a.m. by another hiker who had explored the sulfur mine and saw Gove on his way down, said Gonzales, his former wife and mother of his 15-year-old daughter Georgia.
That hiker said Gove looked fine, he wasn’t distressed or sweating and was very friendly.
Hotel officials didn’t know he was missing until Dec. 30, two days after he went on the hike, when he was scheduled to check out. They found hid passport and other personal items in his room.
Gonzales, upset and distressed about the news, surmises he might have just stepped off the trail.
Others think there may be a possibility that he may have passed the sulfur mine and went on to the hot springs a bit further up the trail.
The case is eerily similar to that of Alabama teen Natalee Holloway who disappeared while on a high school trip to Dutch-held Aruba in 2005.
Gove is a successful environmental consultant and herpetologist who specializes in snakes and turtles.
He is also very philanthropic in that he is politically passionate, is committed to the revitalization of Trenton and children’s welfare.
He has served on the board of directors for Kidsbridge Children’s Museum since 1996, said Lynne Azarchi, executive director of the organization.
To help pay for the increasing costs of the search, Kidsbridge and others have set up a special fund to which people can donate.
Checks or money orders can be sent to Kidsbridge Children’s Museum; P.O. Box 4561; Chambersburg Section; Trenton, NJ 08611.
FL #19 and MF #22 and #33, and any others commenting re. the Murder & Crime thread:
Mortella seems to have clarified the post. If you go to the Summary itself, you will see that those we counted as murders, are indicated by red type for the dates - a nuance that wasn’t reproducable here. In many cases, we read about corpses on the beach, etc., but unless there’s some indication of foul play, it’s just listed - not counted as a murder.
And just to point out a couple of items, MF:
The baby was killed because (a) the father didn’t think the child was his, and/or (b) because the baby wouldn’t stop crying. Diario said (a), another FP poster said (b).
The gentleman who died on ship - Why did Aruba rule it natural causes? There were visible neck injuries! To my way of thinking, that makes it “Aruba’s”. There must have been a REASON to blow the Cause of Death.
So I do not take MF’s version as the last word. Just a couple of nip picks from his post #33.
It’s really hard to get a straight fact out of Aruba. Any FP posters who can help us with translations would be greatly appreciated.
ALSO - for any references to New Orleans or any other city in the United States: The Murder Ratio for Aruba in higher than that for the United States - both as a national average, and for population groups of 50,000 - 100,000. You can see a comparison, and links to the FBI’s crime stats for 2005, on Page 7 of the Murder & Crime thread.
Here is the URL for the Summary of the M&C thread.
http://tinyurl.com/wjjsz
Hello msmarple.
Typical of Aruba, to perfume the pig.
two television employees = two suicides = two murders
Too much coincidence and similarities. What other similarities do they have? Involvement in the Natalee Holloway case?
molly (in Houston)
Some have wondered if the two TV employees could have been working with Peter de Vries on his coverage of the disappearance of Natalee Holloway or some other story that would prove to be an embarrassment to the local Powers that Be. It seems they have much to be embarrassed about.
And even if these are both actual suicides, what a sad, sad and miserable place this island must be for such a high number of suicides. The fatal accident rate must be off the chart, too.
I wish Anna and MsMarple had also done a Suicide Count and a Death by Accident to Tourist as well for weren’t there at least three American tourists killed last year in strange accidents? One a wreck on defective four wheeler with fake helmet and a couple who both mysteriously drowned scuba diving?
Whether by accident, suicide or murder, Aruba is One Morbid Island! Bodies everywhere and left out in the open for all to gawk at and photograph. Not my idea of a day at the beach!
Mortella:
The fact that these “supposed” suicides, that look more like executions, were left out in the open for everyone to see, makes one wonder if this is not a statement… with a very loud threat attached:
DON’T TALK…. or else!!!!
I have always guessed and maybe this is proof that the people of Aruba live under the strangling control of their governnment. Although, many Arubans would never come right out and say it, you can hear it in their tone. They are living in a country that is pounded, everyday, by the drug lords and the pimps and a government, that starts with Oduber and ends with the lowest of all police officers, that make it their job to dish out their own kind of justice on the people, but never on their own.
The lack of an effective and fair justice system results in corruption. These poor people live under two sets of rules and the more the government tries to cover it up, the worse it gets.
There are so many crimes that are committed as favors. There are so many times that the police are paid to look the other way that it is easy to manipulate the system. I believe that Natalee’s disappearance became one of those crimes that was swept under the rug as a payment for the many favors that exist under that corrupt system.
The family of Natalee Holloway want their daughter back. The people of Aruba want their justice, too. And the government of Aruba want nothing more than for us all just to go away… be quiet… get a life… and forget.
We will never do any of those things, much less, forget!
The Netherlands has already said that it regards ALL “suicide” statistics from Aruba as suspect. Given the way things are going in the Netherlands Antilles, why don’t they get a new administration … and hold the current imbeciles to task for what they have allowed to happen?
Patti … your comment about the “strangling control” that the Aruba government has over its citizens is a nice phrase.
Especially in that it probably is precisely accurate.
OUR PRAYERS GO OUT TO THE FAMILY OF:
CAMILO ROMERO, a hero
CAUGHT UP IN THE CORRUPTION OF ONE HAPPY ISLAND.
May he rest in peace.
Richard:
I have, yet, to see The Netherlands do anything. Talk is cheap. Saying that you are going to do something and actually doing it are two different things.
It only makes you wonder: Does The Netherlands hold a hand in this game of corruption? How far does the corruption go and where did it begin? Have there been favors passed on between them, as well; and if so, where does it stop?
You got this hand washing that hand; and that hand washing this…. everyone passing the soap, holding their breath and hoping that someone doesn’t break the chain of silence.
Do we hear The Netherlands? They are a big, powerful country with a big voice. But, even they fall silent.
Take a look at the report that they just completed… their internal affairs report of their peers:
A rather “peachy” report that not only reports corruption, but discloses every excuse for it… A smack on the cheek with a “European flair”.
Get Real!!!
They say the fruit doesn’t fall far from the tree and I suppose, in this case, the fruit hasn’t fallen, yet… we’ll see where it lands.
Boycott Aruba
Justice for Natalee
THANK YOU FRONT PAGE POSTERS!
Check out the latest entry on this thread inside the forum!
http://www.scaredmonkeys.net/viewtopic.php?p=103474#103474
JORAN AND PAULUS VAN DER SLOOT WERE GIVEN PREFERENTIAL TREATMENT THROUGHOUT THE NATALEE HOLLOWAY INVESTIGATION
Yep!
One dirty hand, washing the other.
Thank you, Sharon
Justice for Natalee
Boycott Aruba
This is so sad to see Natalee wielded as iffn some sort of political sword. It rings of 2001…. minus Natalee of course… an election year in Aruba; cease and desists from (2) American states (Pa & Ak); failed coup in neighboring Venezuela…. watching President Bush stand up and make a fool of himself…remember “We support whoever the Venezuelan people should chose to lead them” and then lo and behold, Chavez is carted back on the scene. That had to be pretty humiliating. Wonder where Chavez had been hidden? Aruba maybe? That was my guess then?
Jump to 2005….another election year in Aruba, cease and desists in Alabama and SC wrt Caruba….ploy or bait? The FBI jumped hard and fast…they beat Natalee’s dad down there….DEA…already there… We’re told of possible phone call from Natalee////explains why Charles Croes is so readily available and why Marcia Twitty has taken the MB kids phones from them as soon as they landed.. learned later no such call was ever made, so then how is the magnificent intuition explained…it’s not.. arguments become watered down.
Karin Jannsen visits Bacchus…momentum for Boycott is shut down….That reeks of blackmail…. crime is replayed for Aruba…calls are made… progress does appear to be playing out//// Guido arrested in Holland, case turns cold again in Aruba…reeked of blackmail by Holland…but back to Bacchus or in short, the US.
Why or how does the momentum for the boycott get shut down….One of Bacchus’s constituents goes missing, probably murdered…it’s the story of the year and the momentum is suddenly squashed…The FBI would have been all over the Caruba investigation knowing that it originated in Aruba…in addition, the CEO of the bluegreen/???? group was well aware of Peter Mohammed’s memo to conduct a smear campaign and I am certain he would have reported that to the FBI….The details I am certain they could have learned about from such Aruban stand outs as JMansur or CCroes……
So then they should have been well aware of what was gonna transpire before it did…. So then, why no travel advisory on the part of Bacchus’s office////or the FBI. It appears they let it go down but for a purpose I don’t understand yet…(still no travel advisory) So it becomes important to know WHO arranged this class trip, who in MB may know more than they are saying, who profiled Beth and why such attacks on this mother has been permitted on the scale that it has from Aruba….Aruba blackmails by attacking the weapon (Beth) and not the source. Why?
And lastly, the schism between Mountain Brook and Mississippi…sure, they’ve made the tv circuit and said all was fine between them but for anyone paying attention to these boards the last couple of months, will know that this is not so…I’m sure I don’t have to gleen over the several examples provided…Someone needs to get their big butt off all the 302’s and provide some answers.
#5 Blab…you are prolly right…there is more to the story but why the grudge you ask??? Because you’re (Aruba) sitting on the remains of a child that needs to returned home to her mother and father…That is sick and makes Aruba one sad island! Not that it makes the Dutch and some crappy Americans much better…..Especially the ones who run around and try to make political hay out of it. They just look like they’re a part of it and make these boards appear that way as well.
You wanna know something really sad…. Not once did I ever hear President Bush say Natalee’s name. I know they did nothing to help (including Rice) but they could have at least acknowledged her in some public way instead of treating her as if she just vanished.
#80
Thanks for the link.
I think that collection of important points should be sent to Queen Beatrix, Dr. Rice, or Editor in Chief of NY Times.
It should be sent to SOMEBODY in a position of power.
Comments, anyone?
We have two people hung, execution style, in the streets of
Aruba and the words of their king resounding in our ears:
Aruba:
Eat your bread,
Drink your kool-aid
and, please,
just be happy…
Please, Mr. Oduber, do tell:
Where is our Minister of Justice?
And what is it that he tells us to do?
Are we all traitors if we drink from the cup of knowledge?
Are we traitors if we refuse your offer to partake of the
fruit of your badness?
Where are your judges and what have they to say of your conspiracies to keep us from truth?
Does not truth lead to justice?
Mr. Croes: What is truth?
Boycott! Aruba….
I was listening to Tim Miller on a replay of Dana’s show. I think it was from 12/26/ 06, but not sure.
I went from there to a google search on Tim, and I found this http://www.crimelibrary.com/criminal_mind/forensics/texas_equusearch/1.html
It is about a young 12 year old that Tim helped find (I’m sorry, he found her body).
The story made me think how easily it would be to hide a body in Aruba. Simply throw it in the sea. Natalee was probable thrown in the ocean. She may have washed up i.e. the plastic bag (possible taken back to sea or cremated).
We know there were 3 for sure, and possible as many as 10 involved in the initial assault on Natalee. There were many others involved in the cover up (some of which are dead, missing, or in hiding.
If you read the story about the little girl, you realize that even when you know the general area where a body was placed, it can be difficult to find. The Brazos River is very muddy in most places with zero visibility, but the area where they were looking is relatively small, and it still took two weeks to find her body. If they had not been there when the body surfaced, it would have just washed out to sea, and possible never been found.
The speculation about the rock area has me worried, and the horrible things that may have taken place there.
Joran is no mastermind criminal. He is just a punk kid. However, you throw Paulus into the formula, and we have a real witch’s brew, and anything is possible.
I’ll have to go with others - Paulus is your man. He knows it all.
Roy:
The truth about Natalee was tossed into a political arena.
The people involved in the disappearance and those that
protected them are very powerful people in Aruba.
Are we to just sit back and do nothing? The boycott on
Aruba is not against the people of Aruba, it is against
the government behind which these criminals hide.
Now, that The Netherlands has its’ investigation into the
investigation going, Aruba is back to status quo. Are we
to sit back and drink our kool-aid, as well? If you want
the people of your country to boycott against an island of
people that suffer the consequences, they must know the
truth about the corruption that they are asked to boycott
against.
I thought that was what we are trying to do. We want the
citizen’s advisory, yes. But, until we get it, are we not
to honor this boycott upon the same principles under which
the boycott was founded?
Natalee is not the reason for the corruption, she is not the
sword with which we fight corruption, but it is because of
Natalee that the world is able to see the corruption and the
pain and suffering that it has caused.
I say boycott Aruba, and perhaps, for you we say too much;
but the boycott against Aruba must go on and the corruption,
whether it be in Aruba, the U.S., The Netherlands, must be
stopped.
Yep, like Minnesota Dad always says, Paulus is the perp.
Paulus knows who drugged, brutally assaulted, and raped Natalee. After the drugging, brutal assault and rape, Natalee was in bad shape. Paulus called for assistance. I think Paulus murdered her and disposed of her body…or paid to have the body disposed of at the direction of someone higher because they didn’t want the negative publicity brought to the island. The Aruban authorities thought (and obviously continue to think) they could just sweep this whole thing under a rug…it will go away…a teen who ran away etc. Little did they know Natalee has parents who will not give up on finding their little girl.
The negative publicity will never go away Aruba. You can do whatever you want but Aruba…until justice is served…you will be known as the evil unsafe island.
Oh and justice is prosecuting and punishing the true perpetrators….not someone you decide to frame to make this go away! We all know who most of the guilty parties are. Do something. It isn’t going away until you do!
Justice for Natalee:
By your reference to “Someone in Power”, are you referring
to Aruba? Perhaps the one that is the most in power is
Mr. Oduber. As it is, his job to over-see his ministers.
Perhaps, he should also receive a copy of your letter.
Boycott Aruba
Minister of Justice?
Regarding Natalee’s case, wouldn’t Minister of InJustice
be more accurate?
# 86 Amen Patti!
#88, No, I mean someone in the United States.
I wouldn’t waste my time sending it to Oduber.
I was just brainstorming that the “preferential treatment” points should be brought to someone’s attention.
Right On, Lady Justice, write on!
YooHoo Anita, what happened to your camera and lap top? Did you get those back? You said they were taken during a search of your residence, but we know there never was a search. Why did you tell that there was a search? Why Anita? A family is looking for their daughter, Natalee Holloway, who was last seen with your son. Yes Natalee Holloway was last seen with Joran Van Der Sloot, remember he said he will tell us what really happened one day. Why one day? Why not now?
Libby, were you in Aruba that time Nat was missing? Did you ever meet Paulus? Did you see what you refer to? So, I can start a story about you. For example: your dog has been found dead.Someone who doesn’t like you start a rumor that you did it. Next person tells around that you are a dog kiler. Next person says you not only killed dogs but are abusive to your child too, etc ,etc. Got it!!! You don’t know these people at all! You put this in a statement as if it is true. Can you live with yourself if the truth comes out and the these people have nothing to do with what really happened. Ofcourse you can, what the heck with some slender and harrassment more. THINK, LIBBY!!!
You could be the last one…….
__________
SM: But then again Libby was not the last one with NH, nor lied about the night in question either. Nor did she not help in finding the missing NH whereas a certain JVDS was so upset that he left her on a beach that he would lie to his parents.
Oh yeah, did we mention he lied?
R
Miss: He will never tell us so do not hold your breath.
My previous hard copy to Dr. Rice is on its way.
I pointed out new revelations in the case and respectfully challenged Dr. Rice to walk the walk:
Stand up for NATALEE’S (and other young women’s) human rights
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKzwRwxT48Y&mode=related&search=
busy eh, loaded with tourists?
Yo Desiree, it doesn’t take a brain surgeon to figure out who is guilty and who isn’t. There has been lie after lie after lie by Paulus, Joran, the K brother, even some of the officials. If you aren’t guilty, you don’t lie and you have nothing to hide. You think Desiree!
#48 Yo Yo,
You post your ugly messages here with your endless negative spin on everything that is supportive to finding answers in getting justice for Natalee Holloway. You come to a site that is pro Natalee, pro family and make personal attacks towards other posters who are here with nothing but good intentions. You’re argumentative, disruptive and add nothing to the discussion except to attempt to agitate.
My ‘idiot’ post (#46) didn’t mention anyone specifically by name but the fact that you took it personally speaks a lot about how you see yourself. So if the shoe fits, wear it.
Joran VanDerSloot is a criminal. He’s guilty of illegal drinking and gambling, he’s a rapist by his own admission and in my opinion yes, he’s a murderer. If you don’t like that then take your spew over to one of the hate sites where you’ll be in good company with other idiots just like yourself.
When is the deadline for the responses to the lawsuits?
Isn’t it any day?
Weren’t there 30-day time limits?
Big Lou,
Oh we know never him to tell us, even if he did could we really think he was telling the truth, an admitted liar?
Oh Lou someday, maybe soon, someone will crack, and as they say the house of cards will fall.
@Miss-Underestimated:
That was on december 26th (2nd Xmas day or boxing day). That means that *all* shops are closed. People spend that day with their family, nothing unusual actually. Watch the title of that movie: “everything closed on 2nd day of Christmas)
Oh and Desiree, you don’t have lies in place before it is even announced Natalee is missing….and you don’t refer to Natalee as “a body” when you supposedly left her alive and well on the beach begging for sex without a condom. Just in case you don’t know what I am talking about, I’m referring Paulus’ statement…no body no crime…or I don’t know where her body is. Also, you don’t refuse to allow a search of your home. I could go on and on and on. I have followed this case since it was announced on the news she was missing. I have said from the beginning who is guilty and that they will get away with it. Everyone has a right to their opinion as to what happened…this is mine. You don’t like it, then don’t read it.
Indy: the hate sites probably have already kicked that butthole yoyo off their sites. it has nowhere to go. it’s own family (if it has one) doesn’t like it either. it could possibly be one of the suspects or one of their perverted friends.
Watch the monkeys in the back at Carlos ‘n Charly’s @ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYw0Km7ifJQ
(move slider to 1:52)
It is probably Anita. We are on to her husband and kid…
Justice For Natalee -
I liked that collection of important bullet points
so much… I wrapped it up with a pretty
bow on it & sent it out in one of my
worldwide media targeted blasts.
Signed: Natalee Holloway’s Freebirds
……….
I think Mayan’s post from earlier this morning
pretty much caps the way I feel about things too.
It struck a chord with me.
She said:
——–
“You hurt Natalee & it makes me angry.”
——–
That pretty much says it all, right there.
I would only like to add…
To the guilty…
When you hurt her, you broke her family member’s hearts.
You broke her many friend’s hearts.
You broke our hearts. (SM FAMILY)
You broke my heart.
We will hunt you down,
even if it takes 10 years
to ferret your ass out!
…and we’re gonna bring an END
to your breakin’ hearts game.
That is a promise,
you can count on that. -J4N
http://tinyurl.com/y493g3
Carpe,
Good to have you back.
Patti (#79), there are reports that one brother of Paulus van der Scum ranks high in the Dutch government. Whether that is relevant, we can only surmise.
But the Dutch went to Aruba, picked up documents, returned home, and announced that they were going to study the case.
Must be slow readers, wouldn’t you think?
109 - Richard….
I believe the Dutch are not going to do a thing.
As I have adamently proclaimed…this case CAN NOT be solved without reversing the judgements made to isolate and protect Paulus from this case. Aruba has done everything to make it as hard as possible to get at the Perp.
If the Dutch had an iota of sincerity….or morals…they would have reversed these decisions in the first weeks after they were sent there to review the case.
The Dutch are just another ‘time delay’ in order to carry this thing until May 2007. ALE could only stall for so long. Bringing in the Dutch was the perfect cover….they come in, grab files, and then go silent for six months.
This is all part of Cover-Up 101. When you have a legal problem, you just keep stalling and delaying until those harmed get frustrated and just say ‘the hell with it’. In addition…with time, the media goes away.
Again, the Internet is the great equalizer for lawyers, judges, and governments that choose to be corrupt. Never again can they work their cover-up magic without it being exposed on the Internet for all to see.
Board up those shops Aruba…..md
INVESTIGATORS’ BOMBSHELL CLAIM: NATALEE DIED AT JORAN’S HOUSE - AND ARUBAN AUTHORITIES COVERED IT UP
In a sensational new development in the Natalee Holloway mystery, Aruban police now believe the Alabama teen may have died at the home of prime suspect Joran van der Sloot.
And island officials protected him by refusing to let cops search the entire property, charges a Dutch investigator.
Noted crime reporter Peter De Vries also claims that Joran’s attorney made a dramatic bid to “clear his conscience” - secretly telling prosecutors that his client DID play a leading role in Natalee’s disappearance.
De Vries, host of a popular investigative TV show in Holland, focused on the murder of 18-year-old Natalee, who vanished on May 30, 2005, after leaving a nightclub with Joran and his pals Deepak and Satish Kalpoe. And his findings dispute the leading theory that she died on the beach after she and Joran were dropped off there in the early morning hours.
Courtesy NE
Patti: It’s a double edged sword that I myself have trouble with. I want a boycott as much as anyone but to see our leaders buckle like they did begs many questions. I’m not referring to a boycott of the lines which has manifested itself (voluntary grass roots)—of which 3 measley states would endorse—-I’m talking about something along the lines of Cuba or iffn it must be voluntary, let it go national….. but that was cut down at the knees and I have to ask why? If Jannsens visit to Bacchus was to demonstrate a positive move towards solving this case, then why all the actions from Aruba to demonstrate otherwise…. No she is black-mailing her sorry butt out of having to do her job……so then, the question in my mind is what are (WE) not disclosing that would prevent this child from coming home.
I’ve no doubt that Dave and Beth would not have allowed their child to go on a trip where danger could possibly have come to her. But the numerous insinuations out of Aruba has for whatever reason, put this case in a dead-lock. So that crap, in my estimation, needs to be put to rest, so that these parents can have their child back. I’ve played the blame game as much as anyone here but I’m not above pointing it back at ourselves.
It’s more than Joran’s a liar, K2 are liars, Jannsen’s a liar, Nadira and Anita are liars and Paulus is some sort of evil genius…That is bulls*** and anyone with half a brain knows it….Paulus is a loser, perhaps a perverted one. And prolly involved in the crimes against Natalee as much as anyone. His will come but not just by continually pointing at him… Aruba, Holland, and apparently some in the US would luv nothin more as it drags this case out basically forever, until it is simply a story with no ending and no repurcussions. My fear is that some of these clowns have been coaching the Holloway’s and Beth on how they should act and behave and then break their promises. That’s quite a list with some surprising names.
So how do we break the dead-lock? If Aruba is blackmailing Bacchus, our current administration, or even persons in Mountain Brook, it seems to me that that needs to take a backseat to bringing this child home to her parents and serving justice. I don’t care who slept with who, who partied at raves on a previous trip to Aruba, or even the totality of everything I suspect, simply that Natalee is brought home….I’m here and have been for a very long time so please don’t ever think that I don’t care….I just run on a tangent that’s a little different than everyone else’s.
The above article was published on Dec. 14.
It has a lot of good info in it:
——-
The crime scene is now believed to be Joran’s house.
Natalee died there.
Joran’s own attorney thinks he’s guilty.
Joran was protected by Aruban officials.
The search of the VDS property was blocked.
There was a coverup in Aruba.
——–
All important info for the American public to read.
——–
To any Aruban reporters, tourist officials, VDS family members/friends, etc. reading this board, take note:
American tabloids have a HUGE audience. They are placed near the checkout lines in supermarkets where people either read them or buy them. LOTS OF PEOPLE.
Many, many Americans are aware of the COVERUP in ARUBA.
JUSTICE FOR NATALEE HOLLOWAY
Richard:
Well, I think that Minnesota Dad has it right… but we’ll see. All we can do is keep the pressure on them. IMO, the Dutch are just part of the game, but they have already committed themselves. Besides, with all the letters that the queen has received, I doubt that she could ignore the pleas that are coming from folks that have no other agenda other than to receive justice for a girl that should never have disappeared in the first place.
And then to disappear at the hands of the likes of Joran & Company is like pressing a jagger right into the heart of the American people… There is absolutely no excuse. Joran’s father knew that and now all of Aruba knows that.
Holland, they will soon find out how determined those with broken hearts can be. You may be able to trick us into looking one direction, while you do your dirty deeds in another , but the disappearance of Natalee Holloway will be uncovered. Sooner or later, the prosecution of those responsible will be carried out and for Joran & Company, it is only a matter of time.
Optimistically, I hope that Holland is taking this time to assess the damage and come up with answers for the many hard questions that will face them, once they report their findings. I say that because there will be quite a few key positions left unfilled once their decisions are announced. There are bound to be arrests made and I would imagine that The Netherlands will have to do some shifting around to fill those vacancies. There are alot of people that were involved with the cover-up of this crime and an honest assessment will cut a big chunk out of Aruba’s justice department. They have to be concerned about the islands security.
That is my opinion of what should happen, optimistically; but at the same time, I, just like many people reading this have been tricked and fooled so many times that it is hard to believe that this is anything more than just more tricks.
Personally, I think that Holland has no other choice. They see the same as us and to turn a blind eye or to ignore the evidence will only make them look bad. So far, The Netherlands have not been tied to this case of lies, deceit and corruption and I doubt that they want all this pain, fueled with anger pointed into their direction.
The perps are scared. They don’t want even their own people to know the truth, much less speak it, whether on T.V., or over the waves. The Minister of Justice has gone on record as saying that anyone using the internet or communicating with the “aliens” shall be deemed a traitor. Those are very powerful words for a minister of justice and it is obvious that he meant it as a threat. Does Holland support the actions of this man? I doubt that they will… but I cannot hold out any promices.
Perhaps it’s time for Aruba to suffer the consequences of its actions just as we all have to. The rules that aply to us, must also apply to them; and Holland know that.
There is no excuse for the crime that has been inflicted against this child that was celebrating her high-school graduation on her trip to Aruba. There is no excuse for the cover-up that followed. There is no excuse for the pain and the suffering that the Aruban authorities inflicted upon the family by concealing the body of Natalee and there is no excuse for them returning her to her home. The life of the boys, whether there was one or a hundred, is not worth the pain that this government has caused the family and the countless friends of Natalee Holloway.
Again, they are the innocent ones, the victims. For Holland to ignore their cries would be tyranny. I would hope that the tyranny would stop there.
This is a case of an innocent child that did nothing wrong against a whole army of men that conspired to keep her from her family because of the actions of their sons. The many involved in the corruption are all educated men, fully aware of the consequences of their actions. How sad that they threw their careers, their livelihoods and their reputations upon the line for a few bad men… but they did and not even Holland can take it back for them. All the lies, the deceit and the corruption that they caused, will forever haunt them for the rest of their lives… and Holland will take no part in it.
On the other hand, if Holland sides with the dishonest ones, then the whole world shall know that the country that we read about, that saved many of the broken and tatterred ones fleaing Germany in the day of the Nazi’s, sold out to a group of powerless tyrants from the island of Aruba.
Let us pray, everyday, that the strong will prevail over the weak. Let us pray that good will always triumph over bad. Let us pray that the ones that pride themselves for saving a nation has the power to reach back and save a child.
Holland, we take refuge in you.
Roy:
You and I have spoken about this before and believe me, I know that you care; perhaps more deeply than many of us can even comprehend.
The last time that we talked, we were discussing how we could save the people of Aruba in all of this. We all agreed that it was too dangerous to place people in Aruba to help the people understand and be aware of the many reprecutions that are emminent against their government. We talked about the boycott in terms of Aruba being a small island in the hands of a tyrant and we questioned our own humanity… Now we have two dead in Aruba.
Roy, all we can do is what we do. You were right then and you are right now… but it is too late to turn our back on Aruba.
I agree with you about Natalee. There is nothing worse than knowing that she is there, still, after all this time; but what is it that we can do to negotiate her return? Is that what you are suggesting, that we lay off the boycott and negotiate? And, what then? We leave Aruba in the hands of who?, the same ones that did this to the Holloways?
I don’t know what you want… I don’t know the answers, all I know is that, to back down from this boycott while the Dutch are still investigating, is not the answer. We must be strong as we await their decision… and pray that they help us bring Natalee home.
In the meantime, let’s continue to discuss our options and if there is a better answer, I am sure that we will find it. As for running a tangent, I believe that we are all guilty of that; but, rest assured, I have never looked upon your posts in that way… ever.
I guess under IndyDan’s rule of law, Texas will now be one giant prison that houses all of the underage drinkers and all those that fill out their bracket every march. Can you fit about 75 million people in Tx? Spare me your diatribe. Asking for proof or significant evidence - crazy talk, huh? Oh, that’s right, all the evidence against JVDS was destroyed or lost right under the nose of 13 FBI agents…
yoyo, I think your string broke.
On any given night, U.S. jails are filled with DUIs and underage drivers - at least until somebody bails them out.
I personally wouldn’t set foot in a bar or casino crawling with packs of local teenagers. Red flag for me, and sufficient reason not to go to a place like Aruba.
Teenagers should have more suitable places to go.
Nothing against teenagers - used to be one - but it’s a whole different mind set.
The FBI showed up. Aruba said “No Thanks.”
No evidence because 9? 10? days passed before the cops made a move. That’s what made us so angry.
Then the spin machine set in. Can’t believe what was done to this family. Or to the DeVries family.
msmarple - huh?
Are you saying it’s OK to drink underage in the US, as long as it’s not in a bar? Where is it “OK” for someone under 21 to go drink? Saying that JVDS is a heinous criminal for drinking and gambling underage is silly, wouldn’t you agree?
#105 FL,
Why? What does that video have to do with anything? Those last three girls look fairly professional and like someone Carlos and Charlie’s might hire for entertainment. I see nothing amiss with their performance at all.
There is one girl just before them up on the bar in a short skirt and the one with the camera tries for a shot up her skirt. Big Whoop! Does that give anybody the right to drug, rape and kill her and make her entire body disappear from the face of the earth?
Seems a pretty harsh sentence for drinking and dancing on a bar to me. No one has the right to so much as touch another human being against their will no matter what and that includes their being in a state that would render them unable to give permission.
But thanks for pointing out this attitude. For sure, everybody, stay away from Aruba for if you have some drinks and dance on a bar and somebody sees your panties and you are wearing a thong, you are dead meat according to FL.
And why call these girls monkeys? More likely Arubans. But the same applies to them, too. Just because a girl is having fun doesn’t give anybody the right to do anything to her. Females are just as entitled to sexual expression as males in case you haven’t heard and evidently you are a bit behind the times like about a century on that one.
#75 Too many messages coming out of Aruba. Like Bulldog. All the public and sensational deaths are a message. Now there is the THREAT from the Minister about communicating with ‘aliens’. Look out Arubans. You are in deep doodoo. Your finances are in danger and now your lives are in danger.
molly (in Houston)
Thanks Justice For Natalee, good to be back.
#94 Libby,
I can sure live with myself calling JVDS a rapist for he said so himself and likely a murdered for why else would he lie like a dog.
Speaking of which, it was a paintball gun he used to kill his dog and that is not a story I started but Arubans told on him for that one.
Why would they lie when Natalee could have still been alive and could have been rescued? Why tell all those ridiculous and childish tales about what she said unless they knew she was never going to surface to call them on all that stuff they made up. And just how could they be so sure that no Natalee was going to ever surface??? Had to be very sure of that to tell those whoppers to her family and law enforcement.
And that kind of thing is called circumstantial evidence. Based on that, they are guilty as hell and have brought on themselves anything said about them by lying at a time it could have cost an innocent girl her very life.
You think! For doing that alone and framing the innocent security guards they deserve the scorn of the civilized world for the rest of their lives. And that is before we even get into what they did with and to Natalee! Of course, that civilized world would not include the Island of Aruba where predators like this are allowed to roam and prey on the young tourist girls on their last night on the island. That is not civilized behavior.
I wish I could do more to make their lives as miserable and wretched for the rest of their days for their lying and obstruction of justice alone. Just imagine what I would like to do if they truly are as guilty as I think they are. And no, I have no regrets whatsoever for they deserve far worse than anything I can possibly do to them.
Ms. Marple:
Yo Yo is a muffin, ignore her.
LOL
Hey Patti -
Great point, I know what you meant.
…and it was even more
enjoyable with the Freudian
Slip!
#115
“And then to disappear at the hands of the likes of Joran & Company is like pressing a jagger right into the heart of the American people… There is absolutely no excuse. Joran’s father knew that and now all of Aruba knows that.”
—-
That’s perfect! …because everytime I think of Joran & Paulus Van der Sloot - The Unpunished Aruban Rapist/ Murderers of Natalee Ann Holloway -
I make a face as ugly as a JAGGER…
Mick!
-J4N
Desiree:
Have you read your papers lately? The prime minister of Aruba has made a public statement saying that anyone that is caught going on the internet and communicating with the aliens are to be considered traitors. Since then, two people that work in the television industry have been found dead.
I have asked you to join us in our boycott against the corruption of your government… and you have declined. Now you have returned. What is it that intrigues you? Are you not aware that your life could be at risk by your, meer, presense here? Desiree, if you are not with us in our plea for justice on your island, why would you risk your life to badger us?
You and I have talked before. I know that you are not happy with the things that are happening on your island, but if you want to change it, I’m with you. But, please, don’t risk your life for nothing… the pleasure that you get from argueing with us is hardly worth the risk.
Please, go home, pray for justice. Pray for liberty and pray for your freedom against all those that oppress you and wait… soon, it will come.
That’s love talkin’ and if I were you, I’d listen.
Hey Carpe!
Don’t pick on me… I’m just tryin’ to keep the faith.
Good to see you back…
yoyo # 119
If it is against the law to drink under , it’s against the law. My personal opinion is that the age should be 21; it is hard to enforce whatever it is, wherever.
But there is no “where” that is appropriate or legal for underage drinking. Technically, not even at home.
But JVDS, for example, had a VIP pass to C&Cs. Why? How?
And he was able to gamble. Don’t say he didn’t play for money - papa says he made two trips to the bank to deposit son’s winnings.
Same with Satish - he was what, 16?
Of course that doesn’t make them criminals de facto. I do think it’s criminal that parents and various establishments allow/ignore these restrictions, and that there’s not even a slap on the wrist for the offender.
And according to JVDS, he drinks a LOT when he drinks. I don’t think his odds are very good - when he starts driving, which I guess he does now? Aside from everything else - drinking and driving statistically catches up sooner or later.
And there ARE more appropriate things that teens, especially those still in high school, should be doing, than gambling and drinking.
JVDS - supposedly at casinos until 2:00 a.m. on 05/31-06/01/2005? Out late two school nights in a row? (The only two nights in his life we know about … ) Is this typical for teenagers in Aruba?
Well, whatever - I still wouldn’t want to spend time at a casino or bar with local teenagers - in the U.S., Aruba, anywhere. Not my demographic. I expect most ADULT vacationers would say the same. Possibly your tourism industry people should consider the consequences of not enforcing Aruba’s own laws.
I am sorry - in my Post #127, some of the characters I used didn’t “fly.” In the first sentence, I am trying to not specify an age for legal drinking:
“If it is against the law to drink under (whatever age), it’s against the law.”
Hope parentheses work … left and right arrows don’t!
Correction:
Excuse Me:
It was the Minister of Justice or Injustice,
which ever you prefer.
ooops!
Another idea for some of the conspiracy theorists in here.
I always had this idea in the back of my head that Paulus (assuming he’s involved and then ofcourse is the clean up crew) put Natalee’s remains under the natural bridge and blew it up. He couldn’