RSSRita Cosby; Trouble brewing on Aruba, when it comes to a possible boycott. A Tale of Two Guests
The question and topic of whether there will be a boycott on the island of Aruba due to the Natalee Holloway investigation, or has some have felt the lack of an investigation is beginning to take center stage. The cable network shows have been out in force on the issue. Last night on The O’Reilly Factor Bill O’Reilly questioned whether Aruba had an obligation to present what they are doing and in a competent fashion or risk potential boycott. Also Rita Cosby on ‘Live & Direct’ had Catherine Crier of Court TV and Ruben Trapenberg, Aruban government spokes person.
When discussing the investigation and the decisions made by the Aruban courts, this discussion was not even close. Catherine Crier was salient points that need answers while Ruben Trapenberg seemed to either not have the answers are just made references to talk to others. One wondered at the end of the interview why Ruben was even there?
CRIER: Absolutely. And secondarily, I’ve got plenty of leads for them. Let’s just charge them with rape. We’ve got their own words to confirm that particular felony.
COSBY: Why do you think they have not charged them with rape?
CRIER: I’d like to know the answer to that question. I don’t know.
And I keep saying politics, politics. Please don’t let it be that.
However, when Ruben Trapenberg is asked to address this issue we get the following:
COSBY: Let me bring in Ruben Trapenberg. Ruben, you can maybe answer this for us. Why not charge them with rape? You have Deepak Kalpoe
announcing in his own words that they all had sex with her. You also have on the other hand, you have Joran and his statement that we heard from Beth Holloway, saying that she was going in and out of consciousness. Those two together sound like someone who did something against her will.RUBEN TRAPENBERG, ARUBAN GOVERNMENT SPOKESMAN: Could be, Rita. I am not the legal expert here, so I’m not going to go into details of the case. One good place to check is the FBI. They’ve been here with our local authorities since day one. And the reason that they put out that statement is that because people have been going around, unfortunately, saying that nothing is being done and calling for a boycott and because nothing is being done. And that’s why the statement was released.
Then when asked by Rita Cosby as what was being done in the investigation so that it just does not appear to be a gratuitous ploy to preempt a boycott, Ruben still has no answers.
COSBY: But what is being done? Give me some specifics because a lot of people think the statement, as Catherine was just saying, is sort of a gratuitous, Let’s just throw it out there to try to preempt a boycott. He was quick though to reference the F-16′s.
TRAPENBERG: Again, I’m—I’m we’re not the ones doing the investigation. There is an investigative team, and the right person probably to talk to would be the chief general Dompig. He is the one in charge on the case. Now, what has been done? Remember, way in the beginning, we had F-16s even flying in here on the island. We had teams from the FBI for many, many days on the island. We had teams from Texas, teams from all over the U.S., and local Aruba search teams checking out every rock on this island. And they didn’t check it once, more than once. So I mean, what else can be done? What else is being done right now can only be answered by the investigative team. I don’t have those details.
One of the most telling comments in quite some time was Catherine Crier’s one when she made the point that because the judges were not elected by the Aruban people was exactly the reason why the Judge’s were actually “accountable to the wrong people”.
TRAPENBERG: Absolutely. And Catherine is saying about politics. Politics has nothing do with the legal system here, and that’s—I don’t know how it is in the U.S., but here—you know, our judges are not elected. They don’t have anything to do with it. It’s a totally separate legal entity. They do what they have to do. And as much as the prime minister tried to get involved to feel that—let them feel that they’d have the total Aruban support—and I mean the Aruban people and the Aruban government — but still, the government is not the one doing the investigation.
And you know, when you hear talk about a cover-up, how are you going to cover up something when you have—when you’re working with the FBI? You know, it’s uncalled-for.
COSBY: Catherine, do you believe there’s politics? He said there’s not.
CRIER: Well, he says there’s not—they aren’t elected judges. You’re right, they’re not responsible to the people, they’re responsible to the politicians and the upper echelon and…
COSBY: So in other words, they’re accountable to the wrong people.
Posted October 11, 2005 by Scared Monkeys Aruba, Beth Holloway, boycott, Missing Persons, Natalee Holloway | 70 comments |
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70 Responses to “Rita Cosby; Trouble brewing on Aruba, when it comes to a possible boycott. A Tale of Two Guests”
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I have always believed the reason the Aruban Government has been so evasive ( including Trapenberg) is because there is no investigation, it is all pretense.
Does anyone else think it is strange that the only time we hear from the “authorities” in Aruba is when the “B” word is used. Say the word “Boycott” and they all apear and talk about the investigation. I agree with Marci, there is no investigation. Except when anyone utters the B word.
Good Lord
and i thought catherine crier claimed to be a lawyer. you’d think she’d know the difference between common law and civil law systems
You say – “One wondered at the end of the interview why Ruben was even there?”. The same could be said as to why BHT was on every talking head show everynight for 3 months when there was nothing to be added to the story.
commonsense, do you have children?
me: who cares?
commonsense,
are you from aruba? because you always defending the arubian government. you act like the have not done anything wrong. they bungle this investigation at very begin. now we know why, it is one big coverup.
Commonsense, you said last week you weren’t coming back to this site. Liar, liar, pants on fire. If you’re so tired tof BHT, turn off the tv and stay off the computer.
Very nice commonsense. I wonder though…why you haven’t posted on yesterday’s site where it shows Beth DOES know things you and others keep touting she knows nothing about. No comment for that?
I can not believe anyone is questioning why BHT was on T.V. everynight concerning her daughter. That is her child that she loved dearly and spent countless hours teaching her everything from her ABC’s to how to drive a car. A mother worries about her child before it is born or when it is in the next room sleeping, how dare you question why she is on every T.V. show in the world. I wonder why Joran’s dad made the comment he would do anything for his son…..anything but giving him what every parent owes thier child, MORALS.
This “investigation” has been a fiasco from the start. In a U.S. court, Joran Van der Sloot would stand a very solid chance of being convicted of murder based on circumstantial evidence. Many Arubans seem to be more concerned about their little hedonistic tropical paradise than the life of a human being, and that’s deplorable! As a former parent of teenagers and a person who has seen two neighbors lose daughters to murder, I support Beth and the Holloway family’s continued aggressiveness in attempting to find the truth! Lord knows, the Aruban authorities haven’t done anything but botch the investigation! A boycott, in this poster’s mind, might wake these people up from their “drug induced” slumber.
I have a theory. Just a theory. The Aruban police, Judge and lead investigator are covering this thing up because Joran’s dad has something on them. Something on all of them. He is blackmailing them. So they have a choice. To look inept and play stupid. Which makes the entire US angry that nothing is being done, or to come forward with the truth and have to deal with whatever secrets someone is blackmailing them with. It is the only thing that makes sense. I just have a hard time otherwise believing ANY judicial and investigative system is truly this bad. At the very least these guys should be tried for rape. Any comments on my theory?????
And so life goes on in Aruba. Just like in the US and anywhere else in the world.
To those who strongly believe how an investigation should be conducted and strongly believe and say they have proof that or believe my government is corrupt–> I believe that you guys watch to much CSI, Law and Order, Judge JUDY, Judge Joe brown, Judge Hatchet etc etc etc.
My friend Scott, I don’t know if comonsense is or is not from Aruba, but I am and I SURE do defend my government 100% and my Island ofcourse. It’s very easy to make up your concluision based on what you see on your media (which I believe is pure lies and gossip) or internet surfing (sittin behind a PC) and truly tell your self what is and what isn’t true in this case. And beside you are at least 2000 miles away from it all. It’s not only you Scott but many many more who also write their comments on this blog or any other blog on the net.
Arubans don’t bother with the Holloway case anymore due to the continuing Arrogant atacks by Beth, Jug and also Joe Mammana. The Aruba dont just bother with the case because that’s the authorities’ job to do that. Life, believe it or not, does goes on the island. People do keep coming and going.
Las weekend (7 and 8 October)their was 2 concerts on the island. On friday was the concert of Peter Frampton, where during the concert He gave a speech, cheering the Aruban people and it’s visitors whith words like ” don’t you guys ever leave anyone put you down, you are to special and wonderfull to allow that, the positism always overcomes the Negativism”.
On Saturday was the concert of Queen. Both concerts where part of the International Aruba Musical Fest 2005, a tourism activity which takes place every year. The succes this year was beyond expectations, believe it or not.
People from all over the globe Especially from the States, Europe, Latin America and even Australia came to the island to see the beauties of the island and it’s people and to be a part of the Musical Fest. As usually Hotel Rooms were/are fully booked.
Lot of tourist were asked, especially US-tourist is why did they come to the island even though they knew about the Holloway case. The overall answer was that There’s a big difference between people with common sense who come to Aruba to experience the island and it’s people personally and people who choose not to come, because their opinions and choices in life are based on what people tell them, in this case the US media and talk show hosts.
Sooooo Life does goes on In Aruba as it does in other parts of this world.
Like it or not!
I agree with Catherine Crier- I think politics are involved! Isn’t that why voting is so important to us ‘people of the United States?’
We vote on those we the people want in office and who do things ‘good for the people…’ I think when appointed officals are involved, it leaves more room for corruption, which I think happened in this case. Don’t get me wrong- I think it happens in our own country every day but not to this extent.
Commonsense should be drawn and quartered.
1. The Aruban government has NOTHING to do with the investigation. Dompig, Janssen, etc. are responsible for the investigation, NOT the government. Here you can read more about the (Dutch) Public Prosecution Service:
http://www.om.nl/?p=pg&s=10
2. Aruban judges are not responsible to the people AND they are not responsible to politicians (unlike some American judges…); they are 100% independent (Trias Politica).
3. And according to Aruban law, you can only detain a suspect for a limited period of time. (There’s a maximum amount of time that a suspect can spend in police custody and pre-trial detention: the fact that JVS was released last month, had nothing to do with hurricane Katrina).
4. Why no charges? Because there’s still not enough evidence. There are no real confessions (and even a confession is not enough, according to Aruban law). There’s no body (‘no boy, no case’). There are no witnesses.
5. If Natalee’s family is of the opinion that the investigation is not being done, they can file a complaint with the Common Court of Justice of the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba. Why they don’t file a complaint? Probably because they know the prosecutor is still doing her/his best to solve this case.
Natalee is still missing. Beth Twitty wants answers. I understand how frustrated she is. I understand how frustrated Americans and Arubans are. I am also very frustrated. But we can’t and should not blame the legal system there, we should understand that the Aruban government has nothing to do with the investigation and there is no reason to think that the Aruban Public Prosecution Office is not doing its best to solve this case.
The only question we can ask is: are they amateurs? Have they really bothed the investigation from the beginning? We don’t know. We don’t know the details and we have to keep in mind that there was (and there is still) no proof that Natalee is dead!
I hate it when Nancy Grace, Bill O’Reilly, Dr. Phill, etc. want to boycot Aruba without good arguments.
I’m not a big fan of Greta van Susteren, but at least she still tries to be fair and balanced. She wants to help Beth Twitty and she still keeps asking good questions and she doesn’t jump on the “boycot Aruba”-bandwagon. There’s still an ongoing investigation and Catherine Crier should shut up because she doesn’t have “plenty of leads” for the Aruban investigators.
Commonsense,
Your just a forum troll.
commonsense? What a joke. More like nonsense.
http://64.69.33.211/nh/siframes.html
Here is again guys.
Truly I cannot believe how nite after nite day after day these talking heads can make so much out of a NON STORY! there has not been any realy evidence since about day 2 and there is no story – other than following Beth around with her enterage and making money for the greedy cable news shows. This whole case has made me truly suspect of anything I will ever see on the cable shows again – truly a disgrace.
and anyone who seriously boycotts Aruba should question how often crimes go unsolved everywhere!
This case is starting to take on the identity of a three ring circus. Remember when the alligators are nibbling at your knee caps you will then remember that your main objective was to drain the swamp. I thought the reason that Natalee’s parents went to Aruba and all the investigations and all the searches, was to find Natalee. It would appear that everyone is now getting into the act and pointing fingers and boycotts, etc. Has anyone given any hard thought and posted any logical possiblities as to where she may be located and how she got there? I don’t think so. Remember that within forty days you will have interviewd the perpetrators and predators will dispose of their victims usually in an area that they know well or feel comfortable placing their victims there. Comments are welcomed.
What Commonsense is urging is just what the Aruba government would like to see … the Holloway Twittys going away and giving up the quest for justice. Hey, they might even buy the family a drink at Carlos ‘n’ Charlies….
Well, it isn’t going to happen. And I support a boycott while the Aruba government continues to spit in the faces of the American people … and in the faces of its own people, for that matter.
Did those two security guards ever get their jobs back? No? While little Joran and Daddy got off the island as soon as they could … and this little scumbag of a spokesman says WE are the problem? It’s the Aruba government that is inviting a boycott.
Commonsense: Ruben Trapenberg does not have a missing child, Mrs. Twitty does and I would hit all the newscasts possible all over the world to keep the case alive, but Aruba wants to make it dissappear just like Natalie, that will never happen, Nosense!
Trapenberg says: We had F-16 flying, right! like they are going to see a buried body or under the water, pretense, pretense! WE had Eque Search, WE???? WE had the FBI, WE????? The voluntaries came to help Mrs. Twitty find her daughter, Aruba did not bring them. They never turn evidence to the FBI, what is ignoramus Trapenberg talking about?
Oh, pleaseeeee! Come on! The Godfather and the father took care of this all right, during those first ten days, the LE in Aruba stinks, and so does Karin Jansen, the mute prosecutor, the judges, the police, the politicians, they all should hang their heads in shame!
Trapenberg knows very well the FBI was denied access to participate, Texas Equusearch was sent on wild goose chases, and the victims parents was never allowed to sit in on the court proceedings. It was all scam by the Aruban gov’t – nothing was done. The F-16 fly-over was a fiasco because they didn’t even search the Van der Sloot property – it shows the connections the Aruban gov’t has with the Netherlands. However, we all know the general public saw right the charade. Thank God the MSM (Main Stream Media) and independent web bloggers like ScaredMonkeys are keeping this tradegy alive, otherwise the Aruban gov’t would have completely ignored it. A public travel boycott is really the only way to get any type of action.
Leave commonsense alone,
he is doing the best he can with his simple island education.
Oh yeah, Crier and Cosby, Arubans should elect their judges so they’d be “accountable” to the people. Maybe they’d choose one like Judge Thomas Schroeder of Becker County, Minnesota, who let convicted sex offender Joseph Duncan out after he posted 10% of his $15,000 bail, leaving Duncan free to kill the Groene family and sexually abuse little Shasta and Dylan for weeks before he finally murdered Dylan.
Sheesh! Haven’t we screwed up in this country enough that we ought to know we don’t have to room to tell anybody else in the world how to do ANYTHING?
What is it with you guys. Either you don’t understand it or you’re just not willing to understand it. I think it’s the first.
I don’t believe that there is any investagation into the Natalee Holloway case. I believe they are protecting Paul and Joran Van Der Sloot. Chief Dompig and prosecuter karin will let Aruba go down the tube before they will Prosecute the 2 Van Der Sloots. All they do is bluff and they think they are pulling the wool over our eyes and we will forget all about the Natalee Holloway Case. We wont.
I understand it ARUBA is AN EVIL PLACE I WILL never go there. how cruel to let something happen to a girl and then ignore it. they condone it completely.
thats evil. just ignore it and ridicule the media and beth twitty for bringing attention to it. FACE IT ARUBA you just may grow up over there if you acknowledge the facts. the fact being NATALEE disappeared from your island and you can’t or won’t figure out why.
What a travesty of justice! And to the poster who compared Beth and Ruben-give me a break! She is defending her daughter’s honor(which is a shame that she must even have to do this-WHO IS THE VICTIM HERE?) and what is Ruben defending? He is defending people who have no scruples or common decency or respect for human life.That’s quite a difference, I’d say.
I have to say it again and again, as there’s no other conclusion possible, Aruba is neglecting the people that matter most: the Americans, foremost Natalee and her family. Ban Aruba! Out with Arubans if that’s their attitude!!!
When the alligators are nibbling at your kneecaps you will remember that your main objective was to drain the swamp. I thought the orginal intent was to find Natalee. Now this case is turning into a three ring circus with everyone discussing every aspect of the case with no leads as to where is Natalee. The media hounds are out in full force. Talking and talk is all they are doing. Beth loves the limelight and eventually “my little girl was molested and raped is going to wear off. Okay: the Aruban Government is corrupt, yes they botch the case deliberately, yes lets boycott the ABC islands, all the search areas are red herrings. The hell with Joran and his friends and father because that is were they are going and they will never have a peaceful day in their lives. Lets concentrate on finding Natale.
One last comment. Remember that “within forty days of an investigation you will have interviewed the perpetrators and that most predators will dispose of a body close to where they live, have visited and/or are comfortable with using that location.
“Ruben Trapenberg, Aruban government spokes person.”
I thought Ruben was promoted to be the “airport spokes person”. As for him saying FBI involved from day one. what a load of crap! He knows the FBI was not allowed to participate, only observe. He knows as Beth Twitty said, NOTHING was turned over to the FBI. An Aruban police official flew to Quantico and left nothing with the FBI…. what a joke. I want to know WHY the FBI has not put out any official statement as to these facts. Why is the US govt pussy-footing around with Aruba?
Aruba is shaking in their boots….. worried about boycott, and they should be. It is too bad the Aruban people are the ones to suffer the results of a reduction in tourism. But only then perhaps they will stand up to the Dutch who run that island and demand answers and justice for Natalee.
To Commonsense: Ruben Trappenberg, you mean the Airport spokes person? Not sure why he was even asked about the Holloway case anyway. He is just a “talking head” spewing out irrelevant bits fabricated information.
it’s a small island, and people like ruben & the goverment of aruba prove that there is alot of inbreeding happening on that island
Let’s see, Dompig tells us that they know what happened but the “Powers that Be” stopped any real investigation. Tapenberg tells us that there is some kind of investigation going on, he has no idea what, but it makes no difference because they won’t find anything. The Arubans want us to shut up and keep sending our money and daughters down there. Just how stupid do they think we are?
I am constantly being more and more surprised by the misinformation and conclusions being drawn by those who have no way to know the real truth here… and I don’t pretend to know either.
However, I was in Aruba at the time this happened, and I can tell you that it was a major concern for the people on the island from Day One. It was all anyone could talk about, and the hotel employees were constantly running to televisions to watch the local news, watch for updates, etc. Front page news every single day. There was no effort to hide the situation from anyone, and the locals tried very hard to help find Natalee. Visitors were fully aware of the situation and were also very helpful.
By the way, the divers were sent back initially because there was no way to zero in on a place for them to begin. A plan was needed first, as there is a lot of water and many dangerous areas for diving around the island. It is a small island, but is packed with many different types of terrain and many unreachable places.
I truly believe that no one wants this solved more than they do. The government may have made some mistakes, but not as badly as many in the US think, IMO.
The 3 last seen with Natalee didn’t point out anyone specific, but mentioned seeing a security guard in a black shirt come up to her when they “dropped her off at the Holiday Inn”. The particular security guards were “locked up” because one of them had been caught with articles which had been stolen from the students from the Holiday Inn. The vague mention of a “security guard” in a black shirt turned into these 2 men.
As for Ruben , he is a spokesman for the island… from a Public Relations background. I don’t believe he is trying to avoid answering things, but really can’t or doesn’t know the answers. He is frustrated and it shows. There is a very definite separation between the judicial system and the government there, which has caused a lot of the feelings of secrecy and coverup. I think we Americans have shown very little willingness to try to understand exactly how their justise system works. It is different from ours, so it is corrupt and doesn’t work???
P. van der Sloot was NOT a bigwig on the island, athough he certainly knew many in the judicial system. None of the people I know on the island had ever heard of him. He was a judge-in-training who had flunked his final test just prior to this happening. The government was keeping him on the job until his contract expired in mid August, I think it was… and then word was that the family might return to Holland. Contrary to what many have said, their house was not upper class. It was probably considered to be upper middle class, but the fact that it had gates means nothing. Gates are used around many homes in Aruba to keep the wild goats out of the houses, as they often keep their doors open for the breeze.
And… P. van der Sloot sweating means nothing in Aruba. It is laughable that so much was made of that. It is very hot there, and many work up a sweat just sitting there. I do know this from personal experience… It is very close to the equator and is HOT.
As for the overall behavior of the students, I was told by the a friend who is a hotel manager of a nearby hotel that they were reprimanded quite a few times while at the HI for their loud and obnoxious behavior during the nights around the pool, and running in and out of rooms. There was a lot of drinking and room-hopping going on, but I am wondering why no one ever mentioned that Natalee was missing until time to leave for the airport? And why the silence from all involved?
One more thing that happened while I was there… they don’t get Fox News there… only CNN. On one of the first nights Juran was in custody, there was a news break around midnight that “an unidentified source not involved in the investigation” said “it had been overheard” that Juran had said that “something bad happened” and there was a chance that he would lead them to where the body was. Within a very short time on the island, it was reported that the person talking was mistaken and that no such statement had ever occurred.
So many things were so different there at the time than they are being interpreted now… four months later. It is surprising to find so much hate and animosity toward the 3 suspects, as they have not been proven guilty of anything yet. They are still suspects, but there has been no evidence found. They did not want to press lesser charges on them as that would make it impossible for them to bring more serious charges later if the evidence happened to be found.
A boycott seems very unfair to the good people of Aruba, and I don’t think a boycott will do very much harm to the island anyway. About 40% of the visitors are repeat visitors who know the island and won’t be affected… If anything, many are outraged and may go just to show support for the island and the friendly and caring residents. I do not think it will make any difference in how the investigation is handled other than to possibly land the wrong persons in prison just so that the case can be “solved”. That would be the most likely outcome of a boycott… not what most clearminded people would want, I hope.
All of the sharing of ideas on here is a wonderful thing, as long as they are shared as just that… ideas. None of us know the facts. I know some things firsthand from being there, but I wouldn’t have a clue what this case is really about if I had been depending on Fox, Nancy Grace, and Rita to tell me. By the way, unfortunately for the Arubans, the only cable news show they get is Nancy Grace… Enough said.
Rafael Says:
Leave commonsense alone,
he is doing the best he can with his simple island education.
ROLMAO
What Thomas Schroeder did is known by the people of Minnesota. There is public outrage. His chances of being a judge much longer are non existant. This is the difference. We have problems but we work to clean them up. In Aruba they work to cover them up,
Here is the deal. I am a married man in my 30′s. I work in law enforcement in a suburb of Chicago. I am not an islander. I do have 2 kids. Here is what I see – a lot of you guys have fallen into a catagory of believing everything you are told, without questioning the validity of the facts. Let me explain. There are some major things that have happened with this case, that I find both shocking and excellent.
The cable news media has taken this story from day one and ran with it. Why? My guess is that it was a slow period right after the Michael Jackson case. MSNBC, Foxnews, and CNN all copy each other. They cover the same stories night after night. Greta and Nancy Grace will pretty much follow each other every night. The fact she was a young, white, blonde girl helped with this media attention. No doubt.
Here are some things that I find fascinating about this case -
1) The fact that for three months, and now recently again, everynight the family shows up on television. And for the most part, they have nothing to say at all. Just the same things every night. “You know, we are going to have searches by the lighthouse again” (Have you noticed how many times BHT says “You know” in an interview?). Here is the problem. The interviewer takes the families word for everything they say as the truth, and never have followed up with tough questions. Everytime the question of the chaperones comes up, BHT will change the question. No one ever asks why.
2) Then there is the out an out lies. BHT says her daughter was drugged because she was in and out. That sounds like a drunk girl to me. Where is the proof of a drugging? The audio on Dr. Phil showed that Deepak was not too familar with the date rape drug. He called it esctacy. Wrong drug Deepak. No one ever questions BHT or Jug on what they say. That is so frustrating. “You know, Natalee was a virgin.” How do you know??? Prove it??
3) Then there is the date rape. First off – lets see any proof of the transcripts that BHT refers to. We have seen none. I for one cannot believe every word she says. She is too angry. She seems to want to see the three kids and Joran’s dad go down instead of finding out what happened to her daughter. It’s like she wants to “win”.
4) The cover-up conspiracy theory is just that – a theory. There is no proof at all. Yet so many of you guys on this board want to believe it. Why? Cover-ups and conspiarcies are made for the X-Files. Do you really think that that many individuals have no hearts and souls, and would let this happen with no feelings of guilt? All these people in the government know, but not one person would blow a whistle? Think about it.
5) Say Joran left her on the beach after sex. That sounds like something a 17 year old boy might do. Have sex and leave her since he will never see her again. Is that a crime? No. Could somthing have happened to her after he left? Yes. That is the direction they should look at.
6) “These kids should be in jail for rape. They admitted it on tape on Dr. Phil” – this is the worst. That tape was so chopped up. But here is the thing that many don’t know. It was done right after BHT confronted Deepak at his work. That was during the whole “I’m saving it for you Deepak. Maybe I’ll come back tomorrow” days. So was Deepak mad? My guess is yes, be was pissed. So my idea is that he started saying stuff like Natalee had sex with them all, and she was a slut because he was steaming mad. Even if what he said was not true. If he told that story to a judge, it would be passable. Why would he be so mad? Could it be because he is not guilty??
No one knows for sure what happened to Natalee, except for the people involved. The Aruban court says that they have no proof that a crime was commited by these guys. So they are free. In America, they would not be held without trial. What if you were picked up, never to be tried, and could be picked up again. Over and over? So don’t say that they would be in jail here. And don’t say that Aruba botched the investigation. The kids were not picked up because there was no proof, or reason at the time to believe they were involved in a crime. Just because BHT says there was proof, does not make it true. Just because she feels “in her heart” that she knows the answer, that does not make it gospel. Pony up your facts. Then people like me can decide the truth. What happened? I don’t know. Should Aruba have to brief the family every day? Hell no! That would compromise the investigation by having the family know the details. That is what court is for – the facts to come out. We do not brief the families daily here in the US. And it is true that the families own investigators and detectives hurt this case. They tried to take over, creating conflict.
And on a final note – “No body, no crime”. This is the most troublesome thing of all. I would tell my kid the same thing. Why?? Every parent would want to protect their kids. And the way I see it, Paul was simply saying that “this girl is missing. You say do did nothing to her. Then you are ok”.
I am not being a jerk here. I simply see things on the other side being in the profession I am in, which may supprise a lot of you here. I respect your views as well. If you have any questions for me – ask. I will be happy to answer them here and let you know why I see things that way.
Go White Sox!!
“One wonders why Trappenberg was even there?” How about to divert and evade? Trappenberg is there to point out that the FBI and F-16′s were involved in the investigation, and that the US was involved in the searches. That was his purpose, to make the media question the involvement of the US in the investigation. Everyone knows they were there, the question is how much were they allowed to be involved. This is just another diversion for the Aruban authorities to not do their job and insinuate that the American entities looked for Natalee and they were not successful, “It’s not whether you win or lose, it’s how you play the blame”. Trappenberg thinks he has a trump card, only it doesn’t change anything that the presence of the US was there. The US was there because of a cry for justice, the FBI can’t reveal what they saw because the deal was that they were merely observers, WHAT they were allowed to observe was showmanship, the Aruban authorities allowed them to watch a clown show in which they ran around acting like they were actually doing something, the end result of the clown show is that they did nothing with the evidence collected and they let information out (that was probably the truth) and then yanked it back in. Deepak himself said if he told the truth about what happened “noone would believe me”, Joran said he would tell the story someday but right now he didn’t feel like doing that. I believe those 3 guys did tell what happened and we have already heard the truth, but politics got involved and decided to protect the wrong party, “something bad happened”. The authorities know just as much about what happened as the 3 suspects do.
scarlettthecreek,
would you want those judges on the case of your missing child? As i understand it, there is quite a movement to change the way sex offenders are dealt with during trials and after release from prison, unfortunately, it is sometimes the lives of the innocent that form the revision of law. The government doesn’t usually anticipate that henous crimes will be committed that require new laws to be put into effect (Shasta is a beautiful little soul whom I pray will still have some kind of a beautiful life after the ordeal she went through) to rob the innocence of a child is the worst crime that is imaginable to me. It has been slow to change I admit, but it is changing. I can’t see a reason however, for judges to come from another island to rule on the Kalpoe’s and Van der Sloot’s case, I believe in America it is called a change of venue. Didn’t Aruba say “Respect our laws or go home” (something to that effect) well, Van Der Sloot’s surely did do that, they left to let Aruba suffer. While on the Island of Aruba and living on the Island of Aruba it should be Aruban judges handling the case of people involved in a case. Maybe they would be more aware of the effect it would have on them and there wouldn’t be so many questions as to why judges were flown in from another island. Were they taking care of their own? In my opinion it backfired on the Aruban’s, they didn’t want responsibility for the outcome, so now they are having to deal with the consequences. Maybe this will change the way American’s are treated in the legal system on tourist getaways. I sure would not want anything happening to my loved ones if I were in Aruba on vacation, I know now the treatment we would receive.
yes Ruben has a new job….airport spokesperson when he isn’t
checking his tickle.com website.
He’s married why does he need that website….it he unscrupulous also?
Looking for intellegent people to converse with….Deepak, Satish, & Joran all had tickle.com websites. Where does he fit into all this
coverup?
The prosecution office has to more forthcoming with info and get better at public relations-yes we know they don’t HAVE to but they should so their own citizens don’t suffer under this veil of secrecy.
To Dave and Steve,
The island education must be superior, because it has helped three kids pull off the crime of the century, and has trained the government to unleash the greatest cover-up in history, right? Get off the soapbox.
Go White Sox!
Innocent until proven guilty
From Chicago, common non sense you should know all about crime and cover up. From Al Capone to the Dailey machine, only thing good about that area is the Cubs! Capone was innocent of murder, Right?
John Staton,
I do know all about cover up’s. And THERE IS NOT ONE HERE!! Threre is nothing but statements from the family, without ONE physical proof to back it up shown. Date rape – prove it. Cover up – prove it. Drugging Natalee – prove it. Paul Van der Sloot helped murder a girl – prove it. 22 changes to Jorans story – prove it.
So do this for me John Staton. Give me your theory. What happened to Natalee? Why? What has been PROVEN to back it up. I bet you don’t try. Everyone wants to say I am wrong because I tend to look at things for what they really are. So here is your chance. Are you going to run with it, or back away.
To Commonsense: Saying the island education must be superior, because it has helped three kids pull of the crime of the century. I’m trying really hard not to put anyone down for what they think has happened. But are you or have you gone back and read some of your entries?
Not only is that statement demeaning to the people of Aruba…but its just plain silly. You have every right to your opinions…we all do. But telling Dave and Steve to get off of the soapbox with the posts you have been entering makes me think you find this all funny.
I have a question thats been on my mind for awhile…maybe some of you might know the answer. If the FBI has been in on all of the investigation from the beginning…why they officially told Beth to stop what she’s doing or come forward and said she is misguided…lying…whatever they think. I’ve read quite a few places that the FBI has been allowed to oversee…but not participate. I have no idea if thats true or not…nor do I know if its true that they are being allowed.
Anyone have any CREDIBLE information on this?
As usual i get the feeling everybody on Aruba is guilty until proven innocent. Hang em high silver. Shoot first and ask questions later. Shoot em all and let God sort it out. I know my voice is one in a dessert and no one is interested what i have to say because it’s not what you want to hear. Even if this case took place in the USA you would not have had the proof to hang them. The same as anywhere else. In the USA it’s even harder to get a search warrant to search someone’s house or what ever. You need proof. You can’t just pick someone up from the street and arrest them. In Aruba they picked up Mr J and his cronies (never forget i do think they are guilty of either rape and or murder) but whaever happens you need proof. If you don’t have enough proof you can’t do anything. I hope some day they will find a solution to this case. I even ahve a hope NH is still alive somewhere (and you don’t want to hear my theory on this subject) and will show up somewhere in the near future.
To commonsense: Sounds like you would feel more at home posting at websites sponsored by the KKK/Aryian nation. You will find plenty of company there in which to spew your hatred.
Anyone who hates the VICTIM in all of this(Natalee)and her mom who is devastated and is battle fatigued, should be at Dan Riehl’s blog. You are freely encouraged there to spew venom and demonize the victim in all of this, and her family and friends as well. None of them asked for any of this to happen and do not DESERVE what happened on this “happy little island”. GIVE NATALEE BACK and tell the truth. The truth WILL set you free………
Hi ManMan. You mention even in the U.S. it takes a lot of proof to get a search warrant to search someone’s home. So are you saying it takes more to search their home than to arrest them?
Everyone is yelling for proof. Understandably too. The problem with that is the people who are yelling the loudest are refusing to look at the fact that the proof (if there was proof) was long gone by releasing them. Does that mean we should hang em up? No…certainly not. But putting aside the theory that they are kids and are afraid their parents would be mad they slipped out or whatever is being said…they friggin lied. They not only lied to their parents and friends and police…but they didn’t correct it when someone else was arrested.
But when anyone brings this fact up…what is written is that well…they never said the security guards were black…or they never pointed those particular men out. Ya know? I would agree if when the two men were arrested they immediately went to the police and said we lied. Thats not the case tho is it? No…they didn’t lie at a moments notice…the 3 of them got together and planned a story. Does that sound innocent to you? Now guilty of what…is the question. I doubt very seriously if its guilty of dropping a girl off at the beach…but just my opinion.
So forgive some of us if we choose to think there is a pretty darn good chance they are guilty. As for evidence…obviously it is needed…and unfortunately…I think its been swept away. But you can never really tell…something could pop up.
Sorry for the typo in your name MadMan.
chickadee: you are so right . I stand corrected. Dan Riehl has shown his true colors. That is the perfect blog to post for all of those who enjoy bashing the victims. My theory is that the majority of you who bash victims and enjoy spewing your hatred are either victims yourself, and haven’t dealt with your rage, or you are perpetrators, who fill the need to protect your fellow rapists and murderers. Which category do you fit into?
To all those and chickadee who have read what is going on at Riehl World: Dan has mentioned in one of his comments sections that he is going to start writing for the CTV crime library with Steve huff. I have already contacted CTV through their crime library(you can email them) to protest. For those of you are disgusted with Dan’s latest comments, I would suggest you do the same!
Survivor -
Wrong choice of web sites for me to visit. I am black.
Also, just because someone disagrees with you, does not make them evil. No one can be right 100 percent of the time. I believe the PROVEN facts. You listen to BHT and believe her. She has changed her story so many times. She is not the victim. Natalee is. Do I want justice for Natalee. Yes. But there is no proof presented that Joran or the brothers killed her. That is why they are free. Not a vast x-files like conspiracy.
Linda,
You need to read the whole thread. I was addressing it to the two yahoo’s who, because I disagree with them, assumed I was from Aruba, and was being insulting to the Aruban education system. That kind of childish behavior is not needed.
To non sense the mouth. Time and space limit what can happen, observed sightings limit when and where. Further, the actions of known cohorts (especially Freddie) and reports from competent individuals gives the full picture. Using the rules of logic given to us by Aristotle then increased by others gives us the ability to extrapolate to the most probable. Obviously, non sense you lack the education and/or intellectual ability to deduce. The time line from when the put the drugged Natalee into the car until 4:AM when Joran told his father what happened while sitting in Paulus’s car 2 entire miles from their house limits everything. If you read my priors you will see what kind of place Aruba is, who actually runs it and prior reports of the activities of the P.I.M.P.S. rape gang (Freddie, ie Loco Man Pimp) was the leader. Those are gang signs they are giving in all of those pictures and they are real. Time (10 day delay) nine days following the meeting where Paulus instructed the 3 perps of the single lie that they were to tell the police gives all the time needed to destroy the proof which you demand. If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, quacks and has feathers, it is probably a duck!
I liked the post by Marilyn, she had a few good points from the perspective of someone who was there at the time. I cant help but hold the chaperones somewhat responsible. It seems there were too few, or they didnt exercise the appropriate level of discipline.
For example the National Youth Leadership Forum held for HS students who come from various backgrounds and stay in hotels, has strict rules about room hopping (sent home immediately) and head counting. I realize this is a more formal event than a graduation party, but …
I woud like to know how many chaperones were at C&C’s that night and why werent THEY taking the kids back to the hotels>
Gabriel Leo,
Arubans should care about the case when one of it’s citizens most likely murdered a young tourist!! I bet you will start caring when we stop going to your island!!!
Regarding Maggiemae’s remark that Arubans should care about what happened:
They DO care. They care about what happens on the island and want this case to be solved. They are not fools!
We have, however, started to become the “ugly Americans” in the eyes of many in Aruba and around the world, and someday our money won’t be enough to make other countries want to put up with us. The people who know and like Aruba will continue to go… those who would be involved in such a ridiculous boycott should go elsewhere.
Marilyn,
You are the voice or reason and reality. Good post.
TO Marlyn;
Finaly a voice of reason in this mess. verry good post, my compliments
common sence
another voice of reason in this mess. very good post’s – devils advocate – but you’re right in a lot of what you say
Common sense:
You’ve been singing this same song for weeks – its a bore. There is no amount of evidence, circumstancial or otherwise, that would satisfy you – kind of like the judicial system in Aruba!
Pat,
I feel for you. There is plent of evidence that will satisfy me. First off, let’s make this real easy. The confession that BHT keeps referring to – was it signed? If you read other forums, you will learn how there was sheets of paper thrown in front of Joran all the time to sign – confession sheets. He never signed on, proclaiming his innocence. Was one of these false confession sheets what was translated to Beth? Very well could be. There is no evidence, physical or other. Why would I be so quick to judge? There is tons of theories out there. Natalee was drugged! Where is any proof of that? Have you read how many people like these kids? I have. Best said in an earlier post – for a country that relies of tourism, they want this case solved, but they have souls, and will not send an innocent man to prison to make this case. You need proof. There simply is none right now.
just passing through , my goodness you are all very passionate people i love to read what you all have to say thanks
FIRST, LET ME SAY THAT I THINK A BOYCOTT OF ARUBA IS A GREAT IDEA. WHO IS TO SAY THAT NATALEE WILL BE THE LAST YOUNG GIRL TO GO MISSING THERE. LET ALL OF THE UNITED STATES BOYCOTT THAT PLACE. THERE ARE MUCH BETTER PLACES TO GO THAN TO A PLACE LIKE THAT.
I COMMEND BETH FOR ALL FOR EVERYTHING SHE IS DOING TO TRY AND FIND HER DAUGHTER. THINK HOW YOU WOULD FEEL IF IT WERE YOUR CHILD. HANG IN THERE, BETH AND DON’T GIVE UP ON THOSE PEOPLE.
THE OTHER COMMENT I HAVE IS; PLEASE, PEOPLE, STOP CALLING VANDERSLOOT’S FATHER A ‘JUDGE’. HE IS A ‘JUDGE WANNABE”. I HOPE HE AND HIS WIFE ARE PROUD OF THEIR WONDERFUL RAPIST/MURDERER SON. HOW WILL THEY FEEL WHEN HE DOES THIS AGAIN? DOING HIM A GREAT FAVOR, DON’T YOU THINK? ACTUALLY, I FIRMLY BELIEVE THAT THERE ARE 4 PEOPLE, NOT 3, INVOLVED. I THINK THE FATHER IS IN AS DEEP AS THOSE SCUM/TRASH BOYS.