Joran Van der Sloot: “I think that I would not have made it in the United States.” Joran, That’s Because there would be No Cover Up

 

Joran Van der Sloot continues to taunt the family of Natalee Holloway and shove it in the face of America of what he got away with. Who would really want to go to ARUBA that would allow this to happen?

Joran Van der Sloot may have said the first truthful words from his mouth since Natalee Holloway disappeared in Aruba over 2 1/2 years ago, “I think that I would not have made it in the United States.” Joran, that is because this crime would have been investigated like every other missing persons case and there would have been no cover up to protect you. Like every other missing persons case in the US where the suspect last seen with the victim is guilty.

Joran_VDS_1208

Yes, this case would have been much different in the US; however, you will always be known for what you did no matter the preferential treatment that you were provided. Also, Aruba will always be known as the place where Natalee Holloway went missing and was killed, while being provided no justice by Aruban officials. Aruba should be ashamed of itself. You purposely botched the investigation and then botched the prosecution.

Yes Joran, you can thank your lucky stars that you had dady’s friends help. However, that does not change the fact that you have a much more important day of reckoning and judgement ahead that will make all this pale in comparison.

They would finish me off in the US, Amigoe: 12/8/07

Joran, by now nicely shaved, on his way to the supermarket, while enjoying his freedom.

ORANJESTAD – Both lawyers had assured that after days of isolation, Joran van der Sloot would not want to say one word to the media.  Especially his parents are concerned.  On Friday afternoon, a few hours after his release, while walking back home from a supermarket in Noord with his younger brother, he was still willing to give a first reaction.  People in the supermarket have already been whispering: “he’s back”, “What has he endured”, and “It’s such a nice family”.  He doesn’t seem to be worried to walk over the street.  “I think that I would not have made it in the United States.”

It’s obvious that the 20-year old young man, who is still on Justice’s list of suspects, has not got over the adventure of the past days yet.  He has been detained for 15 days, and most of the time in isolation.  “I was in a cell that could hold 15 men, but I was alone.  I was allowed kick a ball so now and then and they indeed gave me the Bible.  I would have preferred contact with others.”

The interrogations were heavy.  “It’s not that they bothered me all the time, but every time I was interrogated, it was long.  I didn’t have anything to tell them.  I have already told them everything once and I was silent till the last minute.”

The arrest in his dorm in Arnhem was a complete surprise.  He planned to move to Amsterdam, due to the location of his school.  He hadn’t planned to go to Aruba for Christmas. “I really thought that it was over; that one day I would perhaps have to go to Aruba for the closing of the case.  But I have never thought that I would be arrested again in the Netherlands.  It turns out that they have nothing new here.  I still do not understand what they wanted.”

Van der Sloot hates the fact that he had to miss part of his studies.  He wants to go back soon.  He’s not sure how long he’s going to stay on the island.  “I’ll spend some time with my parents.  Despite everything, Aruba is a special place.  I’m going to take a plunge in the swimming pool right now.”

He will not get in contact with the brothers Deepak and Satish Kalpoe that were released a few days earlier.  The friendship seems to have cooled off ‘for years’ already.  Yet another effect of the case, agrees Van der Sloot.

According to rumours in the media, Van der Sloot has taken a plane to the United States yesterday evening.  The journalists concluded this from his presence at the airport.  Nothing is further from the truth.  He was there to see his American lawyer off.  He will stay for the time being in Aruba. 



If you liked this post, you may also like these:

  • Joran Van der Sloot, What I did on My Christmas Vacation
  • Joran Van der Sloot, ‘On the Record’, Part III
  • Joran Van der Sloot Returning to Aruba for Christmas Vacation
  • Joran Van Der Sloot going “On The Record.” Keep talking Joran, keep talking…
  • Joran Van der Sloot, “Girls Come and Go”.




  • Comments

    229 Responses to “Joran Van der Sloot: “I think that I would not have made it in the United States.” Joran, That’s Because there would be No Cover Up”

    1. brenda on December 10th, 2007 10:06 am

      I read this sad news (that the coverup will continue forever) on another Internet news source over the weekend and feel badly for Natalee’s family.

      Gotta agree Joran would not have faired well had he commit his crime on U.S. territory. If I understand correctly, even if evidence is found in time that incriminates him/his cohorts, nothing can be done once the case is closed. Am I correct?

      I wish there was something I could post, but am truly at a loss for anything other than WTF??!

      No way would I travel outside of this country other than going to Canada. Too scary if anything were to happen. With the lack of credibility in Aruba and other countries’ police forces, how could anyone feel any sense of safety for themselves and their loved ones? My son wants so badly to travel overseas with some of his highschool friends for a trip associated with the drama department, but I am not going to let him for several reasons (one being money)…but mainly because if he were to have something bad happen, there is no guarantee justice would ever be served.

      I guess this means the boycott of Aruba must also be a forever thing….

    2. Deetch on December 10th, 2007 10:17 am

      Piece of human garbage

    3. Carpe Noctem on December 10th, 2007 10:26 am

      Dearest J-Bo,

      Here is your GOOGLE KEYWORD OF THE DAY:

      ‘ZIGZAG’

      I shall now attempt to use it properly in a sentence.

      When walking from my house to Ling and Sons,
      I will be doing a ZIGZAG dance like a mf with his pubes set on fire. I’ll do it so a sniper can’t square up, & get a decent shot plugged right
      up into my a$$ho.

      Eat chit and die Sloot, your day is on the horizon,
      you little punk a$$ b****. You better never forget that! U sadistic, psychotic, gang-raping, murdering, innocent teenage girl butchering son of a bitch.

      Your day will come soon. -j4n

    4. Sharon Chicago on December 10th, 2007 10:28 am

      I am so glad he gets the message we do not want him here. Our media, the American people rose up against him, against his lies, against Aruba’s lies….let that roach hide on his infested island crawling behind the drug lords there for protection, or in the Netherlands where they encourage prostitution and drugs… He fits in really good there….

      God will not be mocked, He will have the last say in this…and justice will come forth for Natalee

    5. ldstlou on December 10th, 2007 10:41 am

      No shit Sherlock, you definately would NOT have made it here. After writing your book you better be looking over your shoulder in Aruba too!!

    6. brie on December 10th, 2007 10:48 am

      You wouldn’t of made it in the US…justice would of been served and you would have been in the slammer.

      Joran thinks we would of finished him off…you mean like you finished off Natalee…doesn’t mean that couldn’t happen to you in Aruba or the Netherlands.

      You hate the fact you have missed your studies….since when was school ever a priority…We hate the fact that Natalee never a chance to even continue her studies. This would be her 3rd year of college.

      Why don’t you give the Kalpoes a call…don’t you need a ride…so I guess you’ll hang around Aruba for a while, steal from some tourists so you can go to the casino, check in with Carlos ‘n Charlie’s….find out the latest on what’s happening with the pimp club and discuss your next victim.

    7. Sharon Chicago on December 10th, 2007 10:53 am

      Joran in his own mind may feel very comfortable/cockie at this point with being arrested and the verdict is “no new evidence” to hold him….

      Kind of like ha ha ha I told you I was innocent..and now this makes me look good by them arresting me with no new evidence…

      With this attitude he will be more cockie, more talkative, more assured in his mind that he will not get caught…but he is wrong wrong wrong…

      Loose lips sink ships and he will sink his own and will get caught…in due season

    8. Carpe Noctem on December 10th, 2007 10:54 am
    9. nurturer on December 10th, 2007 10:54 am

      If these whispered comments “What has he endured”, and “It’s such a nice family” are true, then are we to conclude that the Van Der Sloot’s have the Aruban public’s sympathy?

    10. brie on December 10th, 2007 10:57 am

      Diario has an article mentioning Natalee and Joran

      And pictures on more car accidents-more totalled vehicles

    11. Vicki on December 10th, 2007 11:27 am

      Please understand that ANYTHING written in AMIGO is by renHO, a friend and sleeping partner of sweatsloot….its all lies. What the ppl there are saying WTF??? we HATE his guts. Everyone in that family are LIARS…Do you realize IF there are any AMERICAN tourists and they see him, they want to PUKE. Disgusting. HE IS SO FREAKING UGLY…He is a cross dresser just like KOEN, a bed wetter…a complete joke..If he come to the US I want to know. I personally will be there to meet his plane…He makes one want to VOMIT…I pray he egts the creeping crud…justicefornatalee@gmail.com if you want to help…

    12. Donna on December 10th, 2007 11:33 am

      No, Joran would not have made it in the US. Unfortunately for Natalee, she spared the US of this predator of young women. I believe Joran was destined for college in Miami.
      Support the boycott and pray for Natalee’s family.

    13. nurturer on December 10th, 2007 11:38 am

      “I think that I would not have made it in the United States.”

      The statement confuses me a little. Does he mean he would have been found guilty of something? Or, is he talking about professional success?

      If it is the former, I think it is his knowledge of what happened, speaking for itself.

    14. Pat in Alabama on December 10th, 2007 11:46 am

      From Beth’s book page 152:

      “There are many, many locations on the island that we are not allowed to search. The luxurious homes up on the hilltops surrounded by very high walls are a concern for us, especially the ones with barbed wire around the top. We’re told some of those are the mansions of the big drug lords. Others are brothels for the elite. And we can’t go up there. We do get close enough to see where helicopters land.”

      There have been so many conflicting stories from J2K and police, weird videos, pictures, tips Natalle was seen alive and later tips she is dead, I am not inclined to believe much of any of it; just misinformation to try to get Beth to give up. Deepak’s statement that if they found her Joran would get 15 years is more in line with kidnapping and rape than murder. I wonder if Natalee could have been at one of these houses mentioned above and then taken off the island?

      Many here have asked the question why Aruba is willing to take a such a financial hit for PVDS and boys, and have further speculated there is a much bigger picture. From looking at the VDS lifestyle, they appear to do okay, but they aren’t living like kings, so who is paying them and the corrupt officials, and the lawyers and everyone else – it has to be someone with a lot of money and something to hide. What can’t be bought can be held through threats – as in “how would you like to see a loved one wind up like Pitbull?” Mr. Mos, is this what happened to you, or were you in on the coverup from the start?

      PVDS, Joran, Deepak, Satish and others. You are entering the most dangerous time of your life. When this is all officially declared over by the end of the year, you will be fair game. From angry Americans? No. You are in danger from the very people who are above you and are now protecting you. You are a liability to their operation. Once this is all declared over, they can murder you and your families and claim it was angry American vigilanties. The only problem is, they will never be able to figure out who did it – you know the drill. Do you think if that happens that anyone is going to then come forward to expose what is going on? You would be wise to escape to a friendly place while you can and then tell all you know – including where Natalee is either alive or dead. Those who are in the US are in the very most danger of all, but not from those of us on here venting about what we would like to do… there is a much more real threat. PVDS, I don’t think you are stupid, but you’re sure in deep. Time to sweat.

    15. Amsterdam 020 on December 10th, 2007 11:55 am

      repost @ brenda:

      By the way, should the public prosecutor of Aruba decide to close this case by the end of this year, that doesn’t mean that the investigation cannot be reopened at some point.
      However, this will only be done if new serious evidence is found.

      It is possible that someone is convicted for murder (or manslaughter) without a body present however there must be hard (and not only circumstantial) evidence that the suspect killed the person who dissapeared.

      The fact that both Joran and the Kalpoe brothers saw Natalee last and lied during the investigation is of course suspicious but just not enough. And I doubt it would be in a US jury trial.

      Pursuant to Dutch criminal law, there isn’t a statue of limitations on crimes which can be punished with a life sentence. I’m not sure if Aruban law stipulates the same.

      Should the prosecutor decide to prosecute either Joran and/or the Kalpoe brothers and they would be acquitted by the court, the prosecution cannot prosecute them again and bring them before the court again for the same crime.

    16. LilPuma on December 10th, 2007 11:57 am

      14. Pat writes: “PVDS, Joran, Deepak, Satish and others. You are entering the most dangerous time of your life. When this is all officially declared over by the end of the year, you will be fair game. From angry Americans? No. You are in danger from the very people who are above you and are now protecting you. You are a liability to their operation.”

      Wise words and very true.

    17. SUPER DAVE on December 10th, 2007 12:13 pm

      sounds like sloot jr. is blatantly admitting his guilt to me ! hans mos was brought in just to further cover up this murder for his friends the
      ditch family.

      evidently they are not worried about burning in hell. they sure will make a good fire , especially the lard ass !

    18. brenda on December 10th, 2007 12:16 pm

      Thank you Amsterdam. That was very, informative. With all of the crazy rumors surrounding this case, I was in a blurr over what the truth was re: prosecuting/reopening.

      One thing the same here in the USA is the double-jeapordy thing. Once aquitted of a crime, a person cannot be tried again for the same crime. Too bad if more evidence is found in the future in that particular situation. Puts pressure on the police to be certain their facts are straight and good the first time around.

      Also wanted to say something another poster alluded to with Joran stating “he wouldn’t have made it in the USA.” As is normal with Joran, he is saying more than he means to. I believe he was subconciously admitting he wouldn’t have gotten away with it. Let’s all hope this little do-do bird starts to brag….and those he brags to manage to survive long enough to tell someone else who is not part of the Vander-mess click!

    19. Miss-Underestimated on December 10th, 2007 12:22 pm

      Carpe. Very visual picture when reading the post.
      LOL

      Joran you self admitted yourself.

      He knows that justice would have been served here.

    20. JusticeforNatalee on December 10th, 2007 12:35 pm

      Joran, you would be IN JAIL in the United States because LE
      would have completed a competent investigation replete with

      TIMELY COLLECTED FORENSIC EVIDENCE.

    21. minnesota dad on December 10th, 2007 12:40 pm

      Amsterdam 020,

      Can you help explain why the KLPD and ALE have refused to develop a timeline for Paulus Van Der Sloot for the night of Natalee’s murder?

      Can you explain why search warrants for Paulus Van Der Sloot’s home and property were amended on site?

      Can you explain why Karin Janssen, a close friend of Paulus Van Der Sloot’s, provided Paulus Van Der Sloot with a letter stating he was no longer a suspect in the case while not providing a similar letter to the two black guys that Paulus and his spawn tried to frame?

      Can you explain why there is no record of Paulus Van Der Sloot’s witness statements – despite media reporting at the time stating that he was brought in as a witness — not a suspect?

      Can you explain why the courts double layered the ‘legal onion’ for Paulus by stating that he was 1) no longer a suspect, and 2) awarded him $30,000?

      Can you explain why no one in Aruba will positively identify who the gentleman is sitting at “third base” at the blackjack table hitting on Natalee Holloway? Come on…a cook from a local restaurant???? Make me laugh Aruba!

      Can you explain what Paulus was doing at 4:00am on the night of Natalee’s murder?

      Can you explain why Paulus changed his story to 11:00pm the prior evening that he was out on the town?

      Can you explain who leaked the aerial photo of the furniture truck making a delivery to the Van Der Sloot residence just weeks after Natalee’s murder?

      Can you explain where the mattress from the Van Der Sloot’s home is currently? Can you explain why all ‘blood evidence’ needed to be sent to Holland for analysis….but the blood soaked mattress was not (within hours they declared the blood “dog blood”). What a Dutch joke that is!

      Could you explain why Judge Smid, a friend of Paulus Van Der Sloot’s who STAYS AT THE VDS HOME WHEN HE VISITS FROM CURACAO, was allowed to rule on any items from this case?

      I could go on and on. For ANYONE to claim there is a lack of evidence is a joke…period. There was no attempt to obtain evidence and when there was….the evidence disappeared.

      Paulus Van Der Sloot is your perp. Aruba has done everything to protect him. While MOS will close the case against the boys….I know that this case was never “opened” as Paulus Van Der Sloot was always covered for throughout the case by his buddies in Law Enforcement, the Prosecutors, and the Court System. The conflicts of interest are way too overwhelming to ignore and the consistent actions to make sure the case got covered-up are beyond obvious.

      Shame on Aruba. And big time shame on the Dutch for playing along with the program. Corruption Rules in the KLPD as well as Aruba!

      MD

    22. JusticeforNatalee on December 10th, 2007 12:42 pm

      Joran, you are sickening.

      “Van der Sloot hates the fact that he had to miss part of his studies.”

      NATALEE IS MISSING HER ENTIRE COLLEGE CAREER; IN FACT,
      HER WHOLE LIFE!

    23. EURobert on December 10th, 2007 12:43 pm

      I hope no girls will get raped and go missing in A’dam with him settling down there…

      Btw has the boat arrived at Aruba yet… Like to hear some more news about that!

    24. brenda on December 10th, 2007 12:43 pm

      Yikes Min-Dad..he was only answering a question for me. Doubt he has all of that information.

    25. katablog.com on December 10th, 2007 1:00 pm

      Amsterdam: There are crimes that the three thugs could be currently prosecuted for. Apparently Mos is saying the Kalpoes could be charged with making a body disappear. Why he thinks that isn’t worth pursuing, I’ve no clue. I believe the Kalpoes would roll over with a 6 month prison sentence hanging high over their heads.

      Next, Joran could be prosecuted for rape based on his own first statements and his mother’s statements to Greta and Beth.

      How about kidnapping?

      None of these charges would prevent any of them from later being charged with Natalee’s murder and it indeed might get them talking. If nothing else, it gets them off the street.

      Refusing to prosecute a perp for a known crime, regardless of the length of the sentence is merely an excuse.

    26. Miss-Underestimated on December 10th, 2007 1:10 pm

      E-Robert

      Thanks for the update.

    27. minnesota dad on December 10th, 2007 1:11 pm

      Brenda,

      My point was simple. We are now seeing Mos, and Internet apologists claiming that there “just isn’t enough evidence to prosecute” in preparation for the closing. This statement is a sham and we all know it.

      Amsterdam alluded to that sham statement – “there just isn’t enough evidence to prosecute”. Sorry if I was harsh Amsterdam, but those of us that have followed the case from the first week in June 2005 fully understand who got covered for, who had overwhelming conflicts of interest, and who the ALE and prosecutor attempted to frame (remember the two black guys that Janssen said there was overwhelming evidence???…she should have used the word EXPLOSIVE and I would have believed her!).

      MD

    28. nurturer on December 10th, 2007 1:12 pm

      It is simply amazing to me that the Aruban people just don’t seem to be concerned that they have three rapist/killers walking around on their streets.

      Is this a case of people living in a bubble?

    29. JusticeforNatalee on December 10th, 2007 1:23 pm

      JQK stated that the Persistence is due to arrive Wed.
      They have had rough seas to endure.

    30. Kloothommel on December 10th, 2007 1:24 pm

      @katablog.com on December 10th, 2007 1:00 pm

      HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA 6 months for making an body dissapear, you must be kidding me, that would probably only get them 2 week’s of gardening.

      To get 6 months of jail in the dutch/aruba system you’ll at least have to rape someone.

      The dutch system is way to soft, but that’s something we just have to live with.

      The average penalty for murder is 6.6 years minus 1/3 penalty reduction for ‘good behavior’ will make 4,4 years in prison minus pre-arrest will max it out at 4 years for Joran.

      That’s not accounting for the fact that Yoran was an mi nor at the time of the ‘delict’ will even shorten his punishment.

      I would be amazed if he would spend longer then 2 years in prison if ever convicted.

      And that’s why i don’t believe in all these conspiracy theorie’s, now he has his name smudged and has to look the rest of his life over his shoulders.

      If he was really guilty he would have confessed cuz then he would be trialed as an minor, get an juvinale sentence, and have his penalty stricken from his record when he turn’s 18.

      I do believe he knows who did it but is pressured in to not telling the thruth.

    31. Mike on December 10th, 2007 1:24 pm

      #25 Katablog,

      EXACTLY!!!!!

    32. Miss-Underestimated on December 10th, 2007 1:27 pm

      Kat

      Remember Beth stating this is HUGE? She was stating a point blank fact.

      This is beyond the three suspects, the path has lead to Paulus, Smids, Vocking, etc.

      BTW, if they have aloe on the island, why do some woman over there have such bad skin?

    33. Richard on December 10th, 2007 1:41 pm

      “I didn’t have anything to tell them. I have already told them everything once and I was silent till the last minute.”

      Thus spake Joran of the Ditch. If it weren’t so sickening, this would give us all a good laugh.

      You didn’t have anything to tell them, scum? How about your statement on the Greta vS blog that someday you’ll tell what really happened on the beach, BUT NOT NOW? If not now, when?

      And how about Daddy vd Scum’s statement that if he spoke up, a lot of innocent people would be hurt? (How can INNOCENT people be hurt, anyway?)

      In retrospect, it seems clear that the cover-up was in full swing by June 2005, when the FBI arrived on Aruba. Remember, Nelson Oduber first opposed letting the FBI in at all, saying that the case would be solved in a week.

      (Eat crow, Oduber?)

      Then he reversed himself.

      Here’s my question. If Oduber had for one moment wanted the case to be solved, why didn’t he say something like: “You FBI agents have lots of experience in this sort of thing. You take charge.”

      Instead, the corrupt and inept Aruba “law enforcement” types were allowed to do their thing. The FBI chafed at being allowed only to sit there and listen to the incompetent interrogations in Papiamento, which they didn’t understand anyway.

      And so on, and so on, and so on….

      Now, this raises questions. Why is it that the FBI were brought in only for show?

      Seems clear as crystal to me … Oduber knew, or had an inkling, that something big was involved.
      But he knew how the American media would react if the FBI weren’t allowed in, and there were no results.

      So he used them as stooges. And in June 2005, neither the FBI nor the rest of us knew what lies, evasions, and denials lay ahead. I’m sure the FBI assumed at first that Aruba was acting in good faith.

      My point? If Aruba, then or now, had wanted the case solved and had wanted the economic damage from a boycott eliminated, all it had to do was to ask the FBI to take charge.

      It didn’t.

      Doesn’t it seem obvious that this wasn’t done precisely because Aruba dared not allow a solution?

      If you agree, then what reason could there be for this? Fears of driving off tourism? Come on, the continued cover-up in Natalee’s case is ITSELF the reason that tourists have stayed away from Aruba. It’s the cover-up and the ensuing publicity, and even Aruba must realize that those of us who call for a boycott will not go away.

      Solving the case is the best thing Aruba could do for itself. Why won’t it do it?

      Because, in my view, it dares not let the truth be known. And the only explanation that makes sense to me is that it knows, or has good reason to suspect, that Natalee Holloway was handed over to drug lords or their emissaries, taken off Aruba alive, and put into sexual slavery.

      That doesn’t prove she is still alive, but it is possible. (It is also possible that she was murdered when her captors knew that the case was too ‘hot,’ and that she wasn’t some anonymous Guatemalan (just for example) about whom nobody cared.

      I might well be wrong, but nothing else in my eyes justifies the continued cover-up. Had the FBI been allowed to do their job, they might well have uncovered the truth.

      Had Beth and Dave not been so determined, then the two security guards would have been convicted, imprisoned, and that would have been the “official story.”

      That won’t happen now. And we won’t abandon Beth and Dave in their search.

    34. Richard on December 10th, 2007 1:43 pm

      EURobert, it was said on another thread that the search vessel was delayed owing to bad weather, but that it should be in the area by Wednesday.

    35. Richard on December 10th, 2007 1:52 pm

      Pat in Alabama (#14) … I invite you to consider that in South America, where trafficking is a major hazard, it is estimated that one woman in sexual slavery can, over the course of a year, bring in $500,000 for her captors.

      That’s right; half a million dollars.

      I also remind readers that some months back, the private island of a drug lord in the Caribbean was raided. I don’t recall the exact amount of money that was lying around, just waiting for use, but I BELIEVE it was $90 million.

      More than I’ve got, anyway.

      Some people think it can’t happen to Americans.

      I’m not one of them.

      Anyone think that some scum might take special delight in having an American girl at their mercy?
      I do.

      By the way, some months ago I posted an article about a girl in Phoenix who ran away from home, met up with some bad characters in a public park, was gang-raped, and was then held hostage in an apartment.

      Her “willing services” were advertised on the Internet. She was not allowed out of the apartment. She was threatened with death repeatedly, abused … and was told that if she tried to escape, her family would be killed as well. She said that that threat broke her spirit.

      None of this is proof of my idea. But so far, there has been nary a trace of Natalee. Let’s see what the water search yields.

    36. Kloothommel on December 10th, 2007 2:05 pm

      @Richard on December 10th, 2007 1:41 pm

      The FBI has no jursidiction whatsoever in this case, any evidence gathered while they would be in charge will be thrown out of court without the judge even blinking so much as an eye.

      Van der sloot’s lawyers would have an field day, such action could even result in an “Openbaar Ministerie niet ontvankelijk verklaring” meaning as much as “Prosecutor’s case and trial is completly thrown out of court and all evidence regarding the case of the prosecutor is illigal and cannot be used again”

      For as youre quistion about he used langauge, all hearings/interogations MUST be in 1 off the official language’s or “Openbaar Ministerie niet ontvankelijk verklaring” is applied again.

      It’s not hte US where suspects may be pressured, if an judge get’s any hint about that it’s “Openbaar Ministerie niet ontvankelijk verklaring”

      Any mistake on behalve off the police and we have an so called “vormfout” resulting in an mis-trial.

      Maybe you get the hint, but the police does not have that much methodes to ‘crack’ an suspect.

      As far as the contradicting statements made by the suspects, it’s just not enough with hard and concrete evidence in other words, “no body, no faul”.

      It’s just how the system works, and an boycot will not result in changing that system cuz it’s layed down in the Constitution.

      For an change in the Constitution you’ll need :

      1. An 2/3 majorty in the 1st AND 2nd chamber.

      2. general election’s

      3. again an 2/3 majority in the 1st AND 2nd chamber for the same proposal.

      So forget it, never ever gonna happen.

    37. truthseeker2 on December 10th, 2007 2:39 pm

      Well, Kloothommel, a boycott may not change a system in Aruba but it will make people pay for what happened down there. You see, it’s about choices. I believe there are plenty of people down there that know the truth and they choose not to come forward. Aruba also made the choice to cover this up hoping it would just go away. It didn’t. There has been no justice for Natalee. If boycotting hurts Aruba then so be it. I get to make that choice.

    38. Miss-Underestimated on December 10th, 2007 2:51 pm

      And how about Daddy vd Scum’s statement that if he spoke up, a lot of innocent people would be hurt?

      Selfish statement at best,,,,what about Natalee?

      Could it be the would be all the wives of the men involved? No one likes to live with a PO’d wife.

    39. Miss-Underestimated on December 10th, 2007 2:56 pm

      ORANJESTAD, Aruba – One of three young men who took an Alabama high school student to the beach during her class trip to Aruba confessed he killed her, police say.

      Deputy Police Commissioner Gerold Dompig told The Associated Press that the man was leading police late Friday to the scene of the crime.

      I wonder if Gerald can elaborate?

    40. brenda on December 10th, 2007 2:59 pm

      Sorry Min-dad, but it is quite clear the type of evidence required for a SUCCESSFUL prosecution was done away with long ago!! So…there just isn’t anything concrete enough because of how Aruba’s “justice system” works. You think Paulus didn’t think of all of this ahead of time (that fateful night)?

      In America, we can interrogate. After reading post #36, it further confirms my feeling that precious little Urin’s father clearly understands this Aruban justice system inside and out. He made damn sure anything pointing to them that could be used in court was eliminated, destroyed, gone for ever and ever. Simply having contradicting statements (no matter how many dozens at this point) is not good enough. The cell and text records, timelines, etc. are apparently also not not enough for the few honest folks in the Aruban justice system to get the job done.

      Say what you want, but all one has to do is look to the retarded statement Joran just made about what would have happened to him in the USA to realize there is NOT enough of anything for Nat’s loved ones to do squat.

      If Joran is brought to trial now and not convicted, he is free FOREVER!!! I say let’s bide our time and let the idiot say something that WILL lead to the type of evidence necessary to put the little piece of crap in a cell for however long is possible. (sorry to talk down to crap like that)

      At least a few want justice or they wouldn’t have brought the “great Urin” back from his cozy place of rest (college). That said, the JUDGE said their wasn’t enough evidence. Apparently, they need a video tape of a rape/murder occurring or something similar.

      (Hey, if you’re a drug smuggler, raping tourists, or human trafficking…appears Aruba is the place to go!!)

    41. Kloothommel on December 10th, 2007 3:02 pm

      @truthseeker2 on December 10th, 2007 2:39 pm

      Well, Kloothommel, a boycott may not change a system in Aruba but it will make people pay for what happened down there. You see, it’s about choices. I believe there are plenty of people down there that know the truth and they choose not to come forward. Aruba also made the choice to cover this up hoping it would just go away. It didn’t. There has been no justice for Natalee. If boycotting hurts Aruba then so be it. I get to make that choice.

      ————————————————

      That me be true, but youre also hurting people who have absolutly nothing to do with this case (inc. fellow americans cuz a lot of hotels on aruba are (partially) owned by american’s)

      By showing youre will to harm innocent people doesn’t that make you just as bad as the suspects????

    42. MBS on December 10th, 2007 3:10 pm

      I just wish someone or something would wipe that smug look off Joran’s face.

    43. Richard on December 10th, 2007 3:15 pm

      If the FBI were to have no authority, why did Aruba invite them down in the first place?

      Other nations have also drawn on their services.

      Methinks you sound like yet another apologist for Aruba.

    44. Kloothommel on December 10th, 2007 3:20 pm

      @brenda on December 10th, 2007 2:59 pm

      You are spot on the case and at the heart off the problem which all boils down to : “No body, no faul”/

      There is simply no physical evidence that’s links them physically to the crime, they will simply not get an conviction on this evidence, no mather how much circumstantial evidence surfaces.

      Unless somebody produces some hard evidence, this case is over and closed as just another missings person’s case.

      ——————————————-

      slighty off-topic.

      I for someone would never ever let my kids at that age to such an place for vacation without any guidance from an adult.
      And i’m from the Netherlands, i suggest Spain to all you people, cuz the Guardia Civil ain’t nice guys.

      P.S. Same goes for Mexico etc etc etc

    45. 10061906 on December 10th, 2007 3:22 pm

      Central Bank gave a stern warning to the government. It will foreclose and evict the new Aruba ministers building if the payment is not received by next week. After paying Oduber and his associate ministers’ salaries, there are no more money left. The tourism and cruise ships have shrunk by 65% this winter. ALE did not get their paychecks either
      Can anyone verify this?

    46. brenda on December 10th, 2007 3:25 pm

      Referring to post #41, I am astounded to read you would say anyone “hurting” innocent Arubans who are not responsible puts those boycotting in the same category as those who raped and murdered (be it involuntary or not) Natalee Holloway.

      How can the Arubans be as innocent as you suggest if (and I am quoting you) “I believe there are plenty of people down there that know the truth and they choose not to come forward. Aruba also made the choice to cover this up hoping it would just go away.”????

      They are guilty of coverup if what you say is true, so since we are not in a position to determine which of them are innocent and which are not, we must go with boycotting all of them. Trust me…if the Arban population truly wanted justice for Natalee, they’d have been causing quite an uproar.

    47. 10061906 on December 10th, 2007 3:25 pm

      #36 kloothommel;
      Thank you for the info. It was well known that the laws were made for the accused not the victim.
      But I know how to get the laws changed quicker.
      How about a massive recession caused by economic boycotts.

    48. Kloothommel on December 10th, 2007 3:32 pm

      @Richard on December 10th, 2007 3:15 pm

      Being somewahre on invitation and giving advise is completly different from actually leading the investigation, now isn’t it.

      They are just citicens over there and have no special rights whatsoever.

    49. Miss-Underestimated on December 10th, 2007 3:39 pm

      Beautiful day on the deserted beach

      http://www.bucuticam.com/

      Come out, come out, where ever you are? Oops
      no one there…..

    50. Otto on December 10th, 2007 3:44 pm

      I think what he is saying is that a JURY in the US would convict him due to all the circumstantial evidence whereas a JUDGE in Aruba can’t because circumstantial evidence is not enough for a conviction (confession, weapon or body are needed yada, yada, yada and beyond reasonable doubt). I’m Dutch (don’t hate me!!!) and he probably did it but I’m not certain for the full 100%. Well, not enough to give him the death penalty only to find out in 3 years from now it was really a drug lord who picked her up after he left her on the beach. Or something…

    51. Stormy on December 10th, 2007 3:47 pm

      “Garbage” such as this will have to answer to a higher authority at some point…sooner , rather then later far as I am concerned.

      Right, in the United States justice would be served .The tourist industry of Aruba should pay for this coverup who on earth would ever want to allow their child to go and vacation there…in fact, how can anyone sit and enjoy that beach knowing an innocent girl lost her life there and the perpertrator got away with it. Damm his soul to H**l for all eternity.

    52. Pat in Alabama on December 10th, 2007 3:49 pm

      Richard (#35)

      Of course none of us is “certain” about anything, but we have to consider that what you have described is a very real possibility. I’m not sure if that is good or not… there are things worse than death.

      The many statements and circumstancial evidence in this case just do not ad up, unless they lead to J2K drugging, raping and killing Natalee. I have to ask myself, if I was a criminal would I make so many incriminating statements about what I did?? If I was a corrupt official, would I leak a lot of correct information about what happened??? The answer to both questions is “No”. I would provide information to lead people where I wanted them to go and away from the real situation. If J2K can’t be prosecuted then everything will eventually go back to the way it was right? Except for Natalee, and she is either with God or in a living hell.

      Kloothommel:

      You make some good points about the reality of the legal system there that are just hard for us outsiders to accept. That just the reality of it. We have an expression here, “you can’t fight city hall”. Regarding a boycott and its effectiveness: I’m not going to put myself or my family in a situation that I know is dangerous. There are a lot of parts of New York City I wouldn’t recommend, and places I don’t go in Birmingham, AL due to safety concerns. Making a decision about going to Aruba is pretty simple for me.

      And before anyone starts yelling about mall shooters etc., lets face it, there is no place 100% safe in this world unless you stay in bed all day with a loaded gun. There are, however, some places we know are much more dangerous than others, and it is a personal safety issue to avoid them.

    53. Vicki on December 10th, 2007 3:51 pm

      Innocent ppl living there???you mean like Nadira, who said “even grown ppl lie” Im sick of that VOLCANIC ASHE..They elected those officials..this has been going on to long. We will PUSH this BOYCOTT and put Mr.Pinks Business out of business, the scuba business out, the casinos out of business…who gives a RATS behind if American companys go out of business if they are conducting business there…TOO F’N BAD…BooHoo..cry me a river…We are shutting you guys down. We gave you fair warning…

    54. Kloothommel on December 10th, 2007 3:54 pm

      @brenda on December 10th, 2007 3:25 pm

      Referring to post #41, I am astounded to read you would say anyone “hurting” innocent Arubans who are not responsible puts those boycotting in the same category as those who raped and murdered (be it involuntary or not) Natalee Holloway.

      How can the Arubans be as innocent as you suggest if (and I am quoting you) “I believe there are plenty of people down there that know the truth and they choose not to come forward. Aruba also made the choice to cover this up hoping it would just go away.”????

      They are guilty of coverup if what you say is true, so since we are not in a position to determine which of them are innocent and which are not, we must go with boycotting all of them. Trust me…if the Arban population truly wanted justice for Natalee, they’d have been causing quite an uproar.

      ——————————————–

      Youre argumentation is the same as :

      “There is an murderer in the state of Florida, and just because we can’t determine who it is, where just gonna shoot everone in Florida just to make sure”

      It’s that argumentation which get’s the american’s an bad rep and hated in the world.

      ————————————————–

      ON-Topic :

      Not even een uproar could change the constitution within 2 years.

      Just like i said.

      1 2/3 majority (for arguments sake in the last year before elections).

      2 elections

      3 again the 2/3 majority.

      And for you haven’t noticed, we don’t have a 2 party system where 1 party clearly gets an majority, to get an 2/3 majority you will almost certain need 3 to 4 political party’ to agree to the change.

      And maybe before the election they could have an 2/3 majority, that’s doesn’t have to be the case after the election.

      Ergo
      to change the constitution you will need all party’s to agree, and that will never happen.

    55. Kloothommel on December 10th, 2007 4:01 pm

      @Pat in Alabama on December 10th, 2007 3:49 pm

      Indeed, nobody in theire right mind puts theire family at risk.

      I personnaly ain’t letting my kids at the age of 18 to an place like aruba, but the same goes for cancun etc etc etc

    56. Richard on December 10th, 2007 4:01 pm

      Hey, folks, we’re being inundated once again with apologies for “the Dutch system.”

      At this point, it’s very important not to lose sight of the forest for the trees. (I know, it’s not very original … so what?)

      Since May 30, 2005, the Holloway Twitty family and their supporters have faced everything in Aruba except honest people.

      They have been told this … only to have it reversed the next day.

      They have been promised that suspects would be interrogated … only they weren’t.

      They have been promised re-arrests … which never were carried out.

      And they were told that they would get cooperation … only to later be told that Aruba wasn’t even running the case (something “the Dutch system” never told them before).

      We don’t need more lectures on what “the Dutch system” allows.

      We know what the Aruban system allows. Lies, denials, evasions, retracted promises ….

      We then hear how horrible it would be for the “innocent Arubans” to lose our money, which is all they want in the first place.

      What about the truly innocent Natalee Holloway?

      What about the pain and grief (not to mention expense) caused to her parents and family?

      Not to mention Amy Bradley, Joel Gove, etc.

      Here’s what really matters: Aruba has no intention of solving this case. Never did.

      They can throw all the legalisms in the world at us … but here’s what we need to know:

      Can anyone believe that Aruba means justice?

      Can anyone believe it ever did?

      In light of what we know, is it wise, or even safe, to go to Aruba?

      HELL, NO!!

      What else do we need to know?

      What more lies do we need?

      Aruba has demonstrated what it is.

      I want no part of it. I want no more American victims on Aruba. I want justice for Natalee.

      WE OWE ARUBA NOTHING.

      As Nurturer posted above, whispers were heard about what Joran has “endured,” and “what a nice family” the van der Scums are, etc.

      AMERICA HAS NO OBLIGATION TO ARUBA.

      Let the “poor innocent people of Aruba” demand, AND OBTAIN, justice for Natalee.

      Otherwise … let them starve, or find some other way of making a living than from American largesse.

      Boycott Aruba … it’s only common sense.

    57. Kloothommel on December 10th, 2007 4:05 pm

      @Vicki on December 10th, 2007 3:51 pm

      A small lesson in the political system, unlike the US we don’t vote for official’s, we vote for political party’s, and after the elections they decide who get’s to be an official, the party that’s the biggest deliveres the Prime-Minister.

      Judge’s, prosecutor’s etc etc are not elected at all, the are appointed by the government.

    58. Richard on December 10th, 2007 4:06 pm

      Pat in Alabama … I also want to point out that when Elizabeth Smart was found, she didn’t ask for help. She tried to deny who she was.

      That’s just one case. Remember Shawn Hornbeck in Missouri … kidnap victim who helped imprison another boy. Had chances to escape, and didn’t.

      My point is: nobody can say “Natalee can’t be alive, or we would have heard.” There is mind control, and techniques for it.

      Remember Amy Bradley.

    59. Miss-Underestimated on December 10th, 2007 4:22 pm

      Natalee passed out and they (meaning more than one) panicked.

      This was on a written statement by one of the pimps.

    60. Miss-Underestimated on December 10th, 2007 4:30 pm

      Richard

      Was it indeed Smids who released them all this time too?

    61. kayjay on December 10th, 2007 5:02 pm

      Although it is interesting to have the Dutch legal system explained…it doesn’t make this dreadful miscarriage of justice any easier to bear.
      For those Dutch and Arubans who agree, please protest along with us to your authorities. Get them to explain why Paulus vanderSloot has been given a free pass, help us find out who is behind this coverup, get your friends to help Juran confess..you Arubans, work on the Kalpoes..do something to help, otherwise please stay away from this forum.
      I too could care less about the American companies who have hotels etc. on Aruba. They are mostly chains and can pack up and go elsewhere. Sooner the better.

    62. truthseeker2 on December 10th, 2007 5:09 pm

      41. Kloothommel on December 10th, 2007 3:02 pm

      That me be true, but youre also hurting people who have absolutly nothing to do with this case (inc. fellow americans cuz a lot of hotels on aruba are (partially) owned by american’s)

      By showing youre will to harm innocent people doesn’t that make you just as bad as the suspects????

      Where is your perspective? I did not lie and I did not kill anyone….so no. Boycotting Aruba does not make me as bad as the suspects (killers).

      On the other hand, if I knew the truth and did not tell someone who could ensure justice was served….I would be pretty bad. Not as bad as the actual killers, but bad enough to be…boycotted!!

    63. 10061906 on December 10th, 2007 5:37 pm

      OTTO 50;
      Leaving someone defenseless that you know is incapacitated is worth 6 years on Aruba. 1/2 if a minor at the time.
      Remember he said the last time she, Natalee did not regain consciousness, so he left her asleep on the beach by herself in a strange land and no less then one meter from the water’s edge. The fact that no one has seen her since is a good indication that something happened to her. So he thinks calling himself an asshole for leaving her makes everything right. I don’t think so.
      Nail him for three years Hans if you have the guts and are not on the take.
      I want Joran put away at least for crimes against Aruban law. But again corruption prevails. Therefore the reason right there for the boycott. Maybe eventually when the recession really kicks in from the boycott, there will be a revolt and Oduber and the rest of his henchmen will go the way of the DODO bird.

    64. Sharon Chicago on December 10th, 2007 5:38 pm

      #50 Otto…. why do you choose to believe Joran’s story that he left Natalee on the beach versus the other twenty other lies/stories he gave statements of what happened… ??

      So you assume this lie is the truth and you would not sentence him to death….so glad you are not an attorney or a judge….

      The FBI should have handled this case instead of corrupted Aruba.

    65. richard on December 10th, 2007 5:50 pm

      Aruba has failed an American family, and the cause of justice, for more than two years.

      Don’t ask me to justify a boycott of Aruba … tell Aruba that nothing else is justified by its own lies, evasions, actions and inactions.

      Justice for Natalee … or perish, Aruba.

      That’s how I see it.

      Don’t blame ME for YOUR dishonesty.

    66. Kloothommel on December 10th, 2007 5:52 pm

      @kayjay on December 10th, 2007 5:02 pm

      It has been told before, the best course of action is to do nothing pay no attention to Joran anymore, especially because joran is now in the netherlands and there he won’t get protection.

      The guy is an attention whore, if all goes quite around him he will probably start to brag or make another mistake, that’s when we can take him down.

      He needs to make an foul on dutch soil where daddy can’t protect him anymore, but we have to be very secure cuz daddy nows the law by head and milks it for what it’s worth.

      And a little more info, we have the “Trias Politica” that means it’s illegal for politicians to interfere with the justice system.

      SO protesting with our authority’s doesn’t help a thing because for example an judge can completly ignore an politician without any repercussion’s.

      The only way an politician can have influence is by making new laws to grant judges or police more power but those laws cannot be in conflict with the constitution.
      And as the rights of an suspect are locked in the constitution you cannot do that easy.

      And i already have explained that changing the constitution is nearly impossible.

      =====================================

      @truthseeker2

      How would you feel if the whole world decided to boycot the USA just because somebody in miami killed an tourist?

      Why should you be punished for the deed’s off somebody else.

    67. Deetch on December 10th, 2007 5:55 pm

      For anyone who thinks Natalee is alive can you create a possible scenario where Joran van der sloot and his father are not involved?

      Take it from Joran dropping her at the beach.

      And if this is true, in your belief, isn’t that a tacit admission this is a cover up?

      Jan van der straaten, karin Janssen, Nelson Oduber, Hans Mos, Gerold Dompig have all said she is dead.

      Paulus van der sloot was arrested for premeditated murder, why?

    68. mayan_moons on December 10th, 2007 5:59 pm

      Hey Carpe!

      Miss-U is right that is quite a visual ya gave us and has kept a grin on my face ALL DAY!~

      Yeah Jipshit you know you’d not have made it out of the USA alive but i encourage all the people in NL’s and Aruba that have been screwed and royaly to take this bitch out & do it soon, one need not even have a gun. There are many many clever ways to do the job without a proverbial *smoking gun*. Jurine & his father took a lovely sweet girl from us but he took away the quality of your live’s away forever.

      Think about it….

    69. mayan_moons on December 10th, 2007 6:07 pm

      I’ve got one thing and one thing only to say to anyone worried about the *innocent people* of Aruba.

      If you are so worried about them i suggest you pay for their needs and wants. In other words that maybe you can understand…if you care so much about them take out your wallet and pay their bills.

      Lets not waste another word trying to get the clueless and or guilty to see reason and channel all that energy into shutting down that popsickle stand for good!~

    70. Kloothommel on December 10th, 2007 6:10 pm

      Just for info and some more insight in the workings of the law system.

      From the constitution

      Artikel 15

      Article 15

      1. Buiten de gevallen bij of krachtens de wet bepaald mag niemand zijn vrijheid worden ontnomen.

      1. Nobody may be imprisoned unless an law orders it.

      2. Hij aan wie anders dan op rechterlijk bevel zijn vrijheid is ontnomen, kan aan de rechter zijn
      invrijheidstelling verzoeken. Hij wordt in dat geval door de rechter gehoord binnen een bij de wet te
      bepalen termijn. De rechter gelast de onmiddellijke invrijheidstelling, indien hij de vrijheidsontneming
      onrechtmatig oordeelt.

      2. He who’s is imprisoned other than on judge’s order can request his release by an judge, this has to happen within an time set by law (2 days), an judge can order an immiditiate release if the arrest is deemed unjust.
      (this decision can be appealled)

      3. De berechting van hem aan wie met het oog daarop zijn vrijheid is ontnomen, vindt binnen een
      redelijke termijn plaats.

      3. Trial of the arrested suspect is held within reasonable terms.

      4. Hij aan wie rechtmatig zijn vrijheid is ontnomen, kan worden beperkt in de uitoefening van
      grondrechten voor zover deze zich niet met de vrijheidsontneming verdraagt.

      4. He who has been arrest has been justified can be denied certain civilright’s if these civilrights conflict with the detainment.

    71. JusticeforNatalee on December 10th, 2007 6:35 pm

      If an Aruban tourist went missing in the US, there would be
      a competent investigation. Authorities WOULD NOT cover up the crime in order to make the US look safer.

      Again, the boycott is NOT about revenge. It is
      a stand for justice and a means to warn other tourists of the dangers of Aruba.

      If everyday Arubans are affected, it is the fault of the perps who did the crime and the officials who failed to deliver justice.

    72. Sharon Chicago on December 10th, 2007 6:38 pm

      #70 Kloothommel…. REF: Your law system

      You forgot number “5″ & “6″ and I will type it in English instead of Dutch.

      5. The Aruban and Netherland government has the option to disregard any evidence given at their own disgression. They also have the right to find favor with anyone who is accused of a murder/kidnapping/rape etc., if they deem so to the point of proclaiming they are innocent, even if they are not.

      6. The Aruban and Netherland government has the right to keep at bay anyone who would try to come against their bias system with the truth, this would include family members of the deceased and of course also the deceased who’s blood crys out for justice from her grave.

    73. JusticeforNatalee on December 10th, 2007 6:38 pm

      It seems that Aruba has depended on US tourism for so long that some think we owe them a living.

      We don’t.

      We can choose to vacation where we please and it WON’T be Aruba.

    74. richard on December 10th, 2007 6:40 pm

      Deetch, the point isn’t whether Joran and his father were involved. But were they the last ones involved?

      I have hypothesized that Natalee could have been brought to Joran’s apartment/Lorenzo’s house/elsewhere for the gang-rape and with Freddy filming away. Possibly she was held captive for a longer period.

      At some point, she may have awakened; if so, she certainly would have fought back. She would not have been cowed.

      So Joran, Paulus, the Pimps, or whoever would have had the decision … what to do now?

      In this situation, could someone have figured out a way of making money out of her, or of gaining favor with some drug lord?

      Or, possibly, could sheer psychological sadism have played a role?

      Or did Lorenzo or another of the Pimps say that he would “take care of the problem”?

      “No body, no case” could also mean “She’s off Aruba, so they can’t find her, so there’s no evidence.”

      The point is … we don’t know where things STOPPED.

    75. richard on December 10th, 2007 6:42 pm

      No offense to anyone … but we’ve had one cycle of lectures on Dutch law. We don’t need more.

      Dutch law as interpreted on Aruba is, plainly and simply … lie, evade, distort and never say tomorrow what you said yesterday.

      I really don’t think we need to hear more about Dutch law. Last I knew, the Dutch and Aruba were still squabbling about who had jurisdiction.

      If Dutch law rules on Aruba … then anyone who goes there is a fool. We have wised up in America … now we know what Aruba is.

    76. jh on December 10th, 2007 6:49 pm

      I gotta be honest..

      I don’t think Joran would have been any different in the US. I think, if they did it, he would have gotten away with it here, too.

      You don’t have to talk to cops here, and he’s not talking to cops there, and so there’s no difference at least on that regard.

    77. brie on December 10th, 2007 6:50 pm

      Joran and the Kalpoes are still suspects…maybe they should not be taken to trial just yet. If they are acquitted they can’t be tried again….

      We have 3 boys that have a reputation of stalking and raping young women. Do you know of anyone one that has two videos in their car with porno cd’s. The sex mobile provided by Deepak. Why else would Joran call him for a ride?

      A known rapist and pervert on another exposition…I have done this 20 times before..so you admit…

      You have never been taught the values of life by your parents…Your father lives through your ability to rape and harm young women.. Anita…saying he is a healthy sporter…he’s a really missed up kid, Anita wants to hold him his arms…you should of done that along time ago. Your guilty as parents, and your association with know criminals…Joran was a tool, Paulus provided through Posner.

    78. A New Girl on December 10th, 2007 6:51 pm

      Again, the boycott is NOT about revenge. It is
      a stand for justice and a means to warn other tourists of the dangers of Aruba.

      If everyday Arubans are affected, it is the fault of the perps who did the crime and the officials who failed to deliver justice.

      BRAVO !!! Well put and one of the the most direct and accurate statements posted here today.

      I will miss that Island, however. I had many fond memories of it as my honeymoon site in 2004. We shall never return until Aruba does something about bringing ALL OF THOSE INVOLVED the proper justice!!

      AS ALWAYS–thanks to SM for this blog & giving us all a place to come and vent our frustrations over this case….& our hearts and thoughts remain always with Natalee’s Holloway’s family and friends for what they have endured and are still going through to this very day.

      =*(

    79. brie on December 10th, 2007 7:06 pm

      If the water search does not find Natalee…then Aruba is forever given a reputation of human trafficing… no body. Removed from the island of Aruba…by those that lied about her disappearance. And well know what happened. Ask Satish!

    80. brie on December 10th, 2007 7:30 pm

      There was so much evidence…we all know that. Joran killed Natalee…he is capable of violent crime…already proven… I drowned a boy, I killed my dog…I pushed someone off the bridge, I beat up my brother..I steal from tourists, I break car windows, I set off fire alarms, relating to young women, I have done this 20 times before…

    81. martini on December 10th, 2007 8:20 pm

      Involuntary prostitution has boomed the last two years in the Netherlands. There seems to be a shift within the criminal domain from the high risk trafficking in drugs to the almost risk-free exploitation of women. Because of the lacking supervision by the government of the huge flow of money within the prostitution industry, it is very tempting for criminals to change over to this lucrative ‘branch of industry’.
      http://fleshtrade.blogspot.com/

      Natalee could have been abducted into this seedy world. It is why a cover up to this degree had to occur.
      The house of cards could not fall.

    82. da_wench on December 10th, 2007 8:28 pm

      There are a lot of angry posters here, and undestandably so. I hope that someone doesn’t take viglante justice. My concern is not for Joran. It is for the soul of the person who would take his life. If Joran cannot be judged by the law (even Aruban law), then we will have to accept that he will be judged by a higher power. His soul is damned and we all know it. Of course we want him to suffer because we believe he caused Natalee’s death and disappearance, and has inflicted unimaginable pain on her family. Please don’t let yourselves feel the ugliness that blackens his heart and soul. It won’t bring Natalee back and I know that’s not what Beth wants. In order for there to be justice, it has to be by a court of law and by a higher power, not an angry person taking revenge.

      I’m not a religious person, but I am spiritual. I believe that whoever would harm or kill Joran would be damned to suffer the same kind of hell in the end. If we’re lucky, karma will take care of Joran during our lifetimes so we can see that he has suffered for his sins.

      Don’t get me wrong, I would not shed a single tear if Joran were to end up dead or missing, but I would hate for the person responsible to risk his soul for it.

      I think the closest we will ever come to the truth of what happened to Natalee is if her body is found. Forensics will tell her story. We focus our thoughts, prayers and energy on that. Natalee needs to be found, even if her murders never are not brought to justice in this lifetime. Let’s use positive energy to make that happen. Don’t let the ugliness inside rule.

    83. katablog.com on December 10th, 2007 8:30 pm

      Richard: I respect your opinion but I totally disagree. I believe that IF Natalee had been alive and turned over to someone else, Aruba would have capitalized on that at the very beginning to point the finger elsewhere very quickly.

      I also believe that liars tells truths in their lies and Deepak, Satish and Joran seem to tell a story of Natalee having a head injury. To mean it means that they either injured her to shut her up or she ran and fell.

      I think the reason for protection is one or more of these:

      1. Too many youths of high powered fathers involved (most likely) along with Paulus being involved in the cover-up (perhaps other fathers too).
      2. Paulus has something on someone high up and covering for him and his son is pay back

    84. Guest on December 10th, 2007 8:36 pm

      #80 To Brie: “I drowned a boy” ???? Who was that and when did that happen?

    85. buster on December 10th, 2007 8:42 pm

      Oh hog wash !!! Urin you are wrong again There are many people here that would welcome you with Open Arms Once again you have underestimated the hospitality of U.S. Citizens.
      Urin Please come to the U.S. I am begging you !!! I would even pay your air fare 1st class if you like

    86. katablog.com on December 10th, 2007 8:42 pm

      >>>41. Kloothommel on December 10th, 2007 3:02 pm

      That me be true, but youre also hurting people who have absolutly nothing to do with this case (inc. fellow americans cuz a lot of hotels on aruba are (partially) owned by american’s)

      By showing youre will to harm innocent people doesn’t that make you just as bad as the suspects????>>>>>>

      I’m sorry you simply don’t get it. This boycott is not that Natalee was murdered – it is that her murderers walk free because of cover-ups and corruption!

      I don’t understand how you think that any American who knows the story of Natalee Holloway could possibly have a moments peace on Aruba let alone enjoy a vacation. We don’t owe Aruba anything. We aren’t responsible to come to Aruba so your people can eat, just as you are not responsible to come to the USA so we can feed our people.

    87. Carpe Noctem on December 10th, 2007 8:48 pm

      jh on December 10th, 2007 6:49 pm

      I gotta be honest..

      I don’t think Joran would have been any different in the US. I think, if they did it, he would have gotten away with it here, too.

      Jh… but he confessed to murdering her, and it was

      reported in AP. In America, that would have been

      “all she wrote.” Only Aruba, could one find a

      Polis Chief and general all around bent, limp

      > tallywhacker

      like GEROLD DUMBPIG to redact any confessions made,

      to protect a criminal like Joran Vandersloot

      and his science lab gone wrong psychological project

      of a ‘FADDA’.

      —-

      One more thing:

      Very astute observation Up above.

      Joran says he doesn’t think he would have made

      in the USA! ‘MADE WHAT?’ If you are 100 percent

      innocent… (what is there to make? why would you
      need to keep lying over & over?)

      He doesn’t think he would have made it… because

      he knows dang well he did it.

      NICE JOB TO YOU ARUBAN A$$HOLES IN TIMING THIS OUT

      RIGHT AROUND CHRISTMAS TIME SO YOU COULD HURT NATALEE

      ANN’S FAMILY EVEN MORE! THE HOLIDAYS ARE ALWAYS HARD

      FOR ANYONE WHO’S LOST A LOVED ONE. YOU’VE JUST

      COMPOUNDED THEIR MISERY FROM THANKSGIVING

      THROUGH CHRISTMAS.

      CLASS ACT GUYS. YOU ARE ALL CLASS! LONG LIVE THE F’N

      ARUBAN IDIOT, HIP HIP HOORAY! -j4n

      http://tinyurl.com/yor3rj

    88. Allan on December 10th, 2007 9:02 pm

      Kloothommel

      What the hell do you mean, hurting innocent Arubans that protested a mother trying to get her child back. Who the hell do you think you are? You come in here talking that @h+t! You don’t have a damn clue about whats going on here nor the spirit of the group. We would like to see justice for Natalee and people like you to shut up unless you can help in that endeavor. Please don’t preach about how we might hurt those good Aruban protesters, people like lying a@@ Steve Croes and the inability of anybody on that crappy island to tell the truth. Get real about that island, they are decapitating peoples heads, cutting limbs off, poisonings on the beach, raping in the school, a lot of drownings, bodys laying on the hillsides, Mr. Pink and his custom films, mafia Posnewr running the casino, drug running galore just for starters. We would all be better off with that island gone

    89. martini on December 10th, 2007 9:10 pm

      “He doesn’t think he would have made it”

      You are reading too much into the statement and it is out of context.
      So many people come to America hoping to make it.
      In sports , American Idol, business…
      Families send their life savings with a chosen relative to come to America to make it.
      It is about money.

    90. Carpe Noctem on December 10th, 2007 9:11 pm
    91. jason on December 10th, 2007 9:13 pm

      #88 Allan

      Sounds like you’re describing most major US cities.

      Hey here’s a quiz for all of you who pretend you’re just seekers of justice. Exactly how many people are missing in the US right this minute? What are all of their their names and how long have they all been missing.

      Sumpthin’ tells me you’re all going to fail the answer.

    92. Carpe Noctem on December 10th, 2007 9:31 pm

      91-

      Answer: ABDOLUTELY NONE WHERE THE INVESTIGATION
      WAS SABOTAGED FROM WITHIN, and the cops
      started to treat the victim’s family
      members like criminals.

      Eat a frying pan, you player hating piece of chit.

      ….

      http://tinyurl.com/2skjpf

      http://tinyurl.com/2np3uq

      http://tinyurl.com/36fyyj


      j4n

    93. benh on December 10th, 2007 9:34 pm

      Kloot,Any one who does buisness in Aruba is not innocent they chose a side the wrong side.As for the people of Aruba oh well, casualty of war and it is a war of JUSTICE

    94. Sharon Chicago on December 10th, 2007 9:40 pm

      #71 … even the FBI feel that Natalee is dead and was not abducted.

      You know it is not as if Joran had one story to tell and that was that he left Natalee on the beach, therefore anyone else could have either murdered her or took her.

      Joran gave many versions of what happened.

      He was the last one with her along with the Kalpoes. All three are guilty.

    95. Carpe Noctem on December 10th, 2007 9:43 pm

      Close Up – Zoom

      http://tinyurl.com/2skjpf

    96. Sharon Chicago on December 10th, 2007 9:44 pm

      My Theory…

      I think when the sporter told Paulus that Natalee was dead that Paulus made a call to the drug lord and had them dispose of Natalee’s body.

      I don’t think a group of Joran’s friends helped with a boat etc to drop her in the ocean. I think Paulus found someone from the drug mafia to take care of his problem. One of them took her out in their small boat five miles or so and dropped her. They probably took that cage from the Fishermans Hut and put her in there.

      I think Paulus knew people who were part of the drug mafia and would not think twice about disposing of Natalee.

    97. Allan on December 10th, 2007 9:48 pm

      Listen Jason you just don’t get it, we are not talking about America we are talking about Aruba.
      We do not see this kind of cover-up here. It was plainly seen on TV, the lying, corruption, plain stupidity and letting the guys get rid of evidence and clean up. Maybe you can see that and maybe you can’t. Yes, Jason you are surely into justice by what you say.

      JASON just plain cover – up on TV.

    98. Sharon Chicago on December 10th, 2007 9:55 pm

      The only resident from Aruba that has come forth in the public eye to try to find justice for Natalee’s death, is JOSSY…

      Gee one person out of how many thousands that live on Aruba???

      That says a whole lot Aruba….why none of us are ever going to your corrupt island.

    99. brie on December 10th, 2007 10:03 pm

      Oh, to sum it all up Joran and Pauus did it!!!

    100. martini on December 10th, 2007 10:08 pm

      Carpe Noctem thanxs for all the pics!

      http://s83.photobucket.com/albums/j305/binwhack1/?start=all&paginator=tophttp://www.youtube.com/profile?user=driven70001
      The one of the body dumped in a hole with rats eating it was the one I will never forget. IMHO it was not Natalee , it was another schmuck who did not follow the rules .

    101. viet vet on December 10th, 2007 10:10 pm

      Talk fast Joran,,,, {{edit}}

      _________________
      SM: We are all frustrated (klaasend)

    102. 10061906 on December 10th, 2007 10:11 pm

      Not that it matters much anymore; but guess who were neighbors on Aruba. One neighbor lived at
      x5 Malmokweg and the other lived at 1x Malmokweg.
      Wrong: it was Posner and Gottenbos. Oh and by the way some lions do not leave their dens. Van Cromvoirt’s house and VCB have (had) the same address.
      “It is a short walk from Montana to Moko”.
      Let’s see who do we know that lives in Montana but then who do we know lives in Moko?
      One lies to tell the truth and the other is just Loco.

    103. 10061906 on December 10th, 2007 10:20 pm

      83 katablog.com;
      You are on the right track. Read the stateents and Jorans book.
      The reason it was covered up is all the Dutch Nationals kids and Aruban Girls; (Notice there are no attractive young blond female Dutch teenagers on the island. The fathers know to keep them away) sorry off the track were having a party and Joran shows up with an American blond female. Something bad happened there and I don’t believe at this time it was at the Van der Sloots. Nothing was ever found there. Like a magician’s misdirection. In my opinion it happened in …..100

    104. Jo on December 10th, 2007 10:21 pm

      First of all, I’m sick and tired of everyone convicting these three men of Holloway’s death. Natalie Holloway was drinking from 7:00 a.m in the morning at the Holiay Inn (where she and her classmates were requested not to return because of their behavior), then headed to a Blues Concert at Surfside Beach near Orangestadt on the way to the airport and ended up at Carlos & Charlies where she continued to drink. At Carlos & Charlies, according to the Aruban people (I’ve had a timeshare there for 14 years) she requested to leave with Joran and Deepak and Satish to do more drugs. She O’D'd and they panicked…and the brothers did leave her on the beach with Joran. To the individual who indicated there are no coverups in the U.S., are you off your meds??? Read the paper or a book, go to school, educate yourself about the country that you live in and you just may change your mind. Natalie Holloway chose to pursue her destiny…it’s sad but the Aruban people are not to blame. It’s a simple case of personal responsibility. Also, I’m willing to bet that 90% of the individuals giving their opinion have never been to Aruba nor will they even bother to make the trip. Most of them are probably armchair quarterbacks, etc. Please don’t persecute an island or its people for a choice that an American teenager made…Bon Noche
      ______________________
      SM: Your story is full of BS. So to you it’s ok not to call 911? Just dispose of her body and lie about it for 2 1/2 years? (klaasend)

    105. 10061906 on December 10th, 2007 10:21 pm

      make that 102

    106. john staton on December 10th, 2007 10:26 pm

      Jason, in the US “missing” has an entirely different definition than in other parts of the world. Here missing includes children taken by one parent during a custody dispute (the largest number of children) as well as others that leave a locations (such as a former partner). The most telling part of this last mess is that the perps are directly told that if they just hang on, there they are free from further investigation after 12/31. This is a Capital crime and no such BS exists in this country nor most other countries of which I am familiar. The fix is in and the cover up goes on!!! The authorities have as much as admitted that they are involved with a cover up!

    107. weasel on December 10th, 2007 10:54 pm

      Also, I’m willing to bet that 90% of the individuals giving their opinion have never been to Aruba nor will they even bother to make
      ———————————————

      I guess I’m not in your 90%. I have been there but won’t go back because of the way this case has been handled.

    108. mayan_moons on December 10th, 2007 10:56 pm

      Well Jo we don’t give a rats behind what you are sick & tired of but you are right about one thing.

      Million’s of American’s WILL NOT BOTHER GOING TO ARUBA. WHY WOULD WE WHEN YOU’VE SHOWN US WHAT A LOW CLASS POPULATION RESIDES THERE.

      YOU KEEP GOING THERE THOUGH JO COZ LOOKS LIKE YOU FIT RIGHT IN WITH SOB’S THAT RUN THE ISLAND.

    109. jason on December 10th, 2007 11:02 pm

      92-97-wrong

      #106 Wrong, wrong, wrong, that’s baloney.

      Give you a hint. The number is over 100,000 and it isn’t from custody battles.

      Give you another hint. The % of those that still aren’t solved due to police incompetence, police indifference and/or police corruption is in the double digits.

      Too bad none of you righteous justice seekers even care enough to find out about all of these cases of all of these fellow Americans and show the proper outrage on their behalf.

      Allan you think just because you haven’t seen it on tv means it doesn’t exist? Do some research, I am in this field and have worked with and studied missing persons for years.

      The stupidity and hypocrisy here is beyond comprehension.

    110. weasel on December 10th, 2007 11:13 pm

      she requested to leave with Joran and Deepak and Satish to do more drugs.
      ————————————————-according to Joran, Deepak and Satish. Oh wait
      a minute which one of 22 versions of their story is that one from ?

      yea right.

    111. Allan on December 10th, 2007 11:36 pm

      I am in this field and have worked with and studied missing persons for years.

      What missing person have you worked with? You idiot!

      Damn Jason I don’t care if you are in the field of making people missing.

    112. Miss-Underestimated on December 10th, 2007 11:45 pm

      JO.are you Deepak?.Natalee chose to persue her destiny? Reminds me of the statement “she dressed like a slut”

      Your an idiot.. go back and read what you posted.

      Witnesses that night said Joran impersonated a student from Holland on a vacation, staying at the HI, offering her a ride back to the Holiday Inn.

      Aruba …Dompig stated a suspect confessed and is leading them to the body. Care to defend that statement, Jo?

      FYI JO….you have one correct statement. they (tourists) won’t bother to make the trip to Aruba.
      ___________________
      SM: Corrected the hotel name for you ;) (klaasend)

    113. katablog.com on December 10th, 2007 11:59 pm

      #104 “According to the Aruban people” – well heck yes, they must know, right? They were there! That is more of the trash Renfro puts out so you will stick your head in the sand along with the Aruban people.

      The story doesn’t make sense and yet if it were true are you telling me that it’s not murder when someone goes into medical distress and you “panic” and leave them there?

      Next – what happened to Joran’s size 14 shoes that were actually size 11?

      If the story was true, why don’t the boys just guppy up and tell the truth?

      If the story were true, what happened to Natalee’s body? Is this one of those Dompig stories where after she died she got up and buried herself and then a couple days later, unburied and reburied herself? You guys have some really bad drugs on that Island.

    114. minnesota dad on December 11th, 2007 12:03 am

      Jason,

      I posted this earlier and none of the Joran/Aruba defenders dared to touch. Over the last two years I have consistently quizzed Joran/Aruba defenders regarding these facts…and no one has ever stepped up to answer. It seems the AHATA posters always wanted to keep the arguement goine over Joran and the 2Ks while avoiding at all costs discussion of Paulus Van Der Sloot’s crimes. Maybe you can shed some light on the following:

      Can you help explain why the KLPD and ALE have refused to develop a timeline for Paulus Van Der Sloot for the night of Natalee’s murder?

      Can you explain why search warrants for Paulus Van Der Sloot’s home and property were amended on site? What was the rationale for not searching the WHOLE premises?

      Can you explain why Karin Janssen, a close friend of Paulus Van Der Sloot’s, provided Paulus Van Der Sloot with a letter stating he was no longer a suspect in the case while not providing a similar letter to the two black guys that Paulus and his spawn tried to frame?

      Can you explain why there is no record of Paulus Van Der Sloot’s witness statements – despite media reporting at the time (June 15-16, 2005) stating that he was brought in and questioned as a witness — not a suspect? Where have these witness statements gone?

      Can you explain why the courts double layered the ‘legal onion’ for Paulus by stating that he was 1) no longer a suspect, and 2) awarded him $30,000?

      Can you explain why no one in Aruba will positively identify who the gentleman is sitting at “third base” at the blackjack table hitting on Natalee Holloway? Come on…a cook from a local restaurant???? Make me laugh Aruba!

      Can you explain what Paulus was doing at 4:00am on the night of Natalee’s murder?

      Can you explain why Paulus changed his story to 11:00pm the prior evening that he was out on the town?

      Can you explain who leaked the aerial photo of the furniture truck making a delivery to the Van Der Sloot residence just weeks after Natalee’s murder?

      Can you explain where the mattress from the Van Der Sloot’s home is currently? Can you explain why all ‘blood evidence’ needed to be sent to Holland for analysis….but the blood soaked mattress was not (within hours they declared the blood “dog blood” and discarded it as evidence). What a Dutch joke that is!

      Could you explain why Judge Smid, a friend of Paulus Van Der Sloot’s who STAYS AT THE VDS HOME WHEN HE VISITS FROM CURACAO, was allowed to rule on any orders from this case? Can you help us with the definition of ‘Conflict of Interest’ in the Dutch legal system.

      I could go on and on. For ANYONE to claim there is a lack of evidence is a joke…period. There was no attempt to obtain evidence and when there was….the evidence disappeared.

      Paulus Van Der Sloot is your perp. Aruba has done everything to protect him. While MOS will close the case against the boys….I know that this case was never “opened” as Paulus Van Der Sloot was always covered for throughout the case by his buddies in Law Enforcement, the Prosecutors, and the Court System. The conflicts of interest are way too overwhelming to ignore and the consistent actions to make sure the case got covered-up are beyond obvious.

      Shame on Aruba. And big time shame on the Dutch for playing along with the program. Corruption Rules in the KLPD as well as Aruba!

      MD

    115. Maggie on December 11th, 2007 12:14 am

      Speaking of stupidity.. comparing a country with 300,000,000 plus people against a country of less than 100,000 is kind of stupid.. not to mention area size.. More missing people, hellooooo.. I didn’t see no signs come dance in the USA..where there is no crime.. and if something happens to ya,,,,we will trash and blame you for the crimes the criminals walking around commited against you.

      Saw this today on CourtTV is this guy cuckoo..

      Archer:

      I did, I drove from Carlos & Charlie’s up towards the lighthouse where Natalee wanted to see the sharks,(HELLOOOOOO, DIDN’T JORAN SAY ON GRETA’s SHOW WE DIDN’T GO TO THE LIGHTHOUSE, because he read a witness statement that said noone was there that night) we turned around in the very parking lot they turned around in(OH YEAH LIKE WE CAN BELIEVE THEM BECAUSE THEY SAID THEY TURNED AROUND HERE, we went to the fishermen’s huts, got out, I walked the beach and then we went to the hotel, we went to Natalee’s room, all the points of interest we covered and I reviewed the file from top to bottom. There’s no evidence that a crime was committed, nevermind that my client, Joran van der Sloot was involved in Natalee’s disappearance. (ROFL NO EVIDENCE A CRIME WAS COMMITTED 2 and a half years laterm, when he’s looking.)There is plenty of evidence a crime was commited duh!

      Star:

      So what do you think happened then?

      Archer:

      I don’t know, there’s other explanations though other than Joran killed Natalee which everyone seems to want to celebrate and make such a big deal out of. She was intoxicated on the beach that night, that’s a given.(THIS IS NOT A GIVEN, WHERE IS THE PROOF SHE WAS ON THE BEACH DRUNK, DIDN”T JORAN SAY SHE WASN’T DRUNK, SHE KNEW WHAT SHE WAS DOING?) Did she go for a swim, did she drown, there’s many different explanations that should be considered that I don’t think were. (YEAH OK MR ARCHER APPARENTLY YOU DIDN’T SEE THE COPS TAKING A DUMMY OUT 3 MILES THAT WASHED BACK TO SHORE EVERY TIME, and wouldn’t you know, Joran’s shoes and Natalee’s were right by the water’s edge(convenient for the story huh) and washed away too)She wanted to go swimming alone and drowned..oh please…

      Star:

      You also, in addition to going step by step and from place to place, you’ve come to the conclusion that there wasn’t enough time for Joran van der Sloot to have committed any sort of act that would have led to her disappearance.

      Archer:

      Right, we’re talking about a 17 year old kid who, by his own admission and by the videotape had had a few drinks that night. RIGHT WHAT HAPPENED TO YOUR CLIENT THAT CAN DRINK A CASE OF BEER OR 20 WHISKEYS BEFORE HE’S DRUNK? HE SAID HE WASN’T DRUNK. HE ALSO SAID NATALEE WAS’NT.

      Star:

      He was drunk, come on

      Archer:

      I’m not going to say that

      Star:

      He was drunk, I will

      Archer:

      If Joran was half drunk, somewhat intoxicated at 17, he has a window of 18 minutes to have killed Natalee, eliminated the crime scene, saw to it that every piece of forensic evidence that may have existed in the car, on his person, on his clothes disappeared and then disposed of the body in such a way that the world’s greatest forensic sleuths 2-1/2 years later can’t find. It’s ridiculous. (THIS WHOLE PARAGRAPH IS A JOKE!) 10 days no search in the car, the Kalpoes cleaning their car at night, didn’t search him for 10 days, and everyone knows you can take a body out to sea and not find any evidence of it. Last year, the kid who was one of the power rangers and another couple guys got a boat off a couple and threw them overboard and they’ve never been found, no trace of them. Maybe he should come on next time and tell us how Straten investigated his friend the Sloots and he worked with Croes, and Shippers represented the case in the USA when her cousin Guido was arrested as suspect, and Dompig who’s son Michael is a friend of Joran’s and cousin to the druggo witness Boeti who did time in Prison. Michael was seen trying to pick up tourists too and told them about a boat that went out. What about the search warrant changed on site. Or he can tell about all the different versions like Beth said on E last night of what they did with her daughter that night.

      As for Jo,,,it’s not even worth responding. You would think she would get tired of hearing herself repeat the same old untrue bs under different names.

    116. Patti on December 11th, 2007 12:14 am

      Jason:

      You’re calling Allan a hypocrit?

      WTF?!?!?

      If you know so much about missing persons, how is it that you don’t recognize or appreciate when people are backing the family of a missing teenager against an island that has virtually no justice system? How dare you call anyone here a hypocrit!

      Those numbers that you refer to but fail to mention are nothing. How many crimes have been committed in Aruba, just in the last two years that have been called suicides and drug overdoses that, clearly, were murders?

      We all admit that solving crimes is difficult, but the fact that no one has been ARRESTED in this crime, is a miscarriage of justice. Especially, when the statements made during questioning are admissions to those crimes.

      Any family of a missing person would love to have Scared Monkeys support, just as there are non-profit trusts opened for donations to fund what many of us do for free. If you, truly, work in the field of missing persons, you would have a deep respect for what we do here.

      .

      Joran says that he would never make it in the U.S.? I pray that, someday, we can put that to the test.

      We need to seek an expert in International Law.

    117. cheple on December 11th, 2007 12:15 am

      before i begin, let me just tell you that i’m from aruba. A lot has happened since Nathalee dissapeared but hey, who’s to blame, not me!…not anyone! I’m not taking side of the guys you think did this, nor the holloway family, leave me here standing in neutral. But since the dissapearing there has been one question in my mind that has been bothering me ever since,….how do i place this?,..ok here it goes:
      Your a senior “honor” graduate from Alabama,…which is thousands of miles from Aruba,..your folks are rich, you live in a nice big house,…that means that you must have money from where you come from,…that means that you must be able to “AFFORD” a freaking camera, and adding that this was your first trip to Aruba,..you usually take a camera with you when you travel!,…specially to a place you’ve never been to! Hey when i go to Orlando or New Jersey every year with my family, i make sure i do! Everyone does that! Every freaking tourist does that!…And here comes the strange part: you come to Aruba for a week!,…you take only one picture! “ONE” picture! the day before you dissapear?? And with the same clothes in wich you went missing! You guys know wich one i mean, the one that she’e standing by the beach with her friends,…i’m not against Nathalee Holloway or anyone! But hey that S#@$ right there is freaking weird don’t you think???
      ________________________
      SM: What the hell are you talking about? There are other photos of Natalee in Aruba. That particular photo you are referring to was taken the same evening she went to CnC, that’s why she’s wearing the same cloths. Also, they weren’t there for a week you fool, they were there for 4 days. Not sure what you are looking for here? (klaasend)

    118. LilPuma on December 11th, 2007 12:16 am

      Kloothammel, thank you for the info. When there is corruption and injustice in the U.S., our media and citizens cry foul. Many times, officials do something about it. In Aruba, the media (except Jossy) made up stories to blame the victim, her mother and the U.S. media. You say “we just have to live with it”. Have you tried to change it? Perhaps the political parties would do something if the people said that’s what they want. Shoulder shrugging isn’t something monkeys do well. :-) In spite of differing laws, this was clearly a cover up and Arubans aren’t upset about it. They want to blame Natalee and Beth, close their eyes, shut their blinds, and go about another day. We want them to not like the corruption and lies. Instead, they don’t like Beth and Monkeys.

      But thank you again for helping us understand the realities of the Dutch legal system.

    119. Maggie on December 11th, 2007 12:20 am

      Remember last year when Joran said he wasn’t afraid to come here and tell the truth in that lawsuit in New York,,,he didn’t even care if he had a lawyer or not.. He wanted to come tell the truth. and then fought like hell to keep it from going through and went on to do more interviews and caught lying over and over again. What a sporter,,

    120. LilPuma on December 11th, 2007 12:22 am

      For those who say we are blaming innocent Arubans for the actions of a few. Isn’t that what the world does to Americans every day of the week?

    121. Maggie on December 11th, 2007 12:24 am

      Oop re that article above.. 18 minutes to commit a crime and clean it up..apparently Archer forgot that they said they took her to Holiday Inn and left it at that for 10 days, so how can he said 18 minutes to clean it up etc. They had at least 24 hours until Beth arrived and longer due to no searches and not even saying the beach..

    122. mayan_moons on December 11th, 2007 12:25 am

      Hey MD!

      That aerial pic of the furniture truck at the van der sweat house and WHO took it has always puzzled me the most.

      Who do you think just *happened* to be there at just the right time to catch that very suspicious event?

      It’s astounding to this day that the VDS’s son is in jail on suspicion of murder, kidnapping, rape and these people feel its a great time to get new furniture and lay cement.

      Who took that pic of the truck??

    123. cheple on December 11th, 2007 12:42 am

      so if there were more pics of the vacation,…can you show them to me?,…or give me a link!? you see my point soon enough to where i’m going with this…

    124. kayjay on December 11th, 2007 12:51 am

      So Jason…we’re waiting..MD’s questions should be a piece of cake for a pompous blowhard like you to answer. By the way is your name really “Jason”, or are you maybe someone else?

    125. Maggie on December 11th, 2007 12:51 am

      Chepel neutral..lol.. There is even a picture of Natalee in a bikini..Have you looked at Natalee’s camera or pictures? It appears someone else took that one, so how do you know that was her camera taking the picture? Could’ve been her friends camera.. Her friends were also in the picture. Put down the pipe..

    126. Patti on December 11th, 2007 1:23 am

      This is so sad.

      I was hoping to come here and find some good news… but, obviously, Aruba has decided to keep their heads buried in the sand and we are left with people like Jo and Cheple who have not a clue about what really went on.

      This last few months, since the Dutch went to Aruba acting like they were set on finding some evidence, have been a heartbreak. I really, really wanted to believe that the Dutch were not involved in the corruption; but if this Mos character was acting on the part of the Hague, we are in big trouble.

      I have always gotten the impression that he was Aruban and had nothing to do with the Dutch investigation. Does anyone know, for sure, whether the “new evidence” that he spoke of at the beginning of his charade was from The Netherlands? And… why he would feel the need to promise the Van der Sloots that there would be no more arrests in the case? Is it possible that the Arubans want to close the case, knowing that the Hague has evidence that would proove what Prime Minister Oduber tried to hide?

      Why aren’t the press requesting information from the Hague?

      Also, since this Prosecutor stated that Natalee was dead, or that it was obvious that she is dead; aren’t there any federal laws that the Holloways can use to get the Federal Government to act?

      M.D…. Any ideas?

    127. Pat in Alabama on December 11th, 2007 1:40 am

      Richard, you are describing Stockholm syndrome. It apparently doesn’t take that long to break someone’s spirit. I seem to remember something about the SLA keeping Patti Hearst in a closet for weeks on end, along with giving her drugs, withholding food and other necessities… Has anyone ever found out what those shacks on the little island with chairs, wire and rope are used for?

      For those who don’t believe Natalee is alive, that’s fine, but please allow those of us that would like to keep an open mind the courtesy of discussion. There is a possibility she is dead, but there is also a possibility that we have bought into all the leaked misinformation and stories and gone in exactly the direction they wanted us to go. Any physical evidence such as the duct tape hair (etc.), whether real or planted, has been gathered up and made inaccessible – another incomplete path, just like the searches, the videos, the statements, the policework and Shango. There is little that can be verified as fact.

      If Natalee truly overdosed on E (wasn’t that what Deepak said tourist are sometimes given by the bartenders) why didn’t they just make up a story that Natalee took it and felt so good she wanted to have a party with all of them. Accidental death, open and shut case if the law is on your side the way it is down there. Well, maybe she was beat up and they couldn’t send her back that way. If so she wasn’t drugged; why would anyone want to beat on someone who was asleep? Would she send a text message about I don’t know these people if she was drugged? Further would she send such a message if she was still with the guy who was supposed to be taking her home? Maybe, maybe not. Whose phone was it sent from anyway? Do we know?

      All I’m saying is that we have been given too much information, but it is all incomplete, pointing in differnt directions and doesn’t add up. Normally suspects would try to tell as little as possible, and even the police would only disclose certain facts until they had built their case so as not to aid the defense. A coverup of human trafficing is at least worth consideration.

    128. Patti on December 11th, 2007 1:51 am

      Richard:

      I think you may be right.

      Aruba decided to go ahead and make one more arrest and close the case, before the search got under way so they would never have to prosecute the lovely, honorable Van der Sloot family… in case they found something.

      I still smell a rat and I have a feeling that this arrest had nothing to do with the investigation that was done by the Dutch. Remember just a few weeks ago, The Netherlands told Aruba that they had one more chance and that they’d better not screw up, again?

      What is “screwing up” to them?

      I think it’s time to write another stream of letters to the Dutch officials requesting that they make their findings public. They made a public statement about working on DNA… what does a taped telephone conversation have to do with DNA?

      The pieces of the puzzle aren’t fitting together.

      .

      Patti

      .

      P.S. Hang in There!

    129. Michelle Says So on December 11th, 2007 1:55 am

      Do the right thing! BOYCOTT ARUBA NOW!

      http://arubanboycott.blogspot.com

    130. mayan_moons on December 11th, 2007 1:59 am

      I’ve thought of that too Patti and it doesn’t look good does it? That nobody in our own Government prodded by the press has addressed Paules’s family ties within the Nl’s judiciary and thats why Jurine has walked away from his crimes against Natalee.

      The press ALWAYS speaks of this farce as “botching or bungling” instead of what it really is. Plus now they are reporting that this was our goon’s second arrest……IT WAS THE THIRD! Remember the second time was the day after Katrina hit. Geeeeez

    131. Pat in Alabama on December 11th, 2007 2:17 am

      They let them go last time under the cloud of Katrina. They are hoping that their final ruling will be eclipsed by Christmas and New Years.

    132. Patti on December 11th, 2007 2:29 am

      Mayan:

      They’ve never been charged with anything!

      Nothing…

      “Come on in and talk to us for awhile”,

      and out the door they go…

      Not one single charge…

      Ever.

      I remember a long time ago you told me that PVS
      had family in high places in NI, but I never
      imagined that the corruption could go that far.
      I can, honestly say that I am baffled by the whole
      turn of events. But something inside tells me its
      not over.

      I was sad to hear about your mom. I hope you’re
      doing okay. But, it’s good to see you back.

      .

      Patti

    133. mayan_moons on December 11th, 2007 2:32 am

      Hey Michelle!

      Don’t see you very often so let me wish you & your little one a safe and happy holiday season!

    134. iab on December 11th, 2007 2:58 am

      Is there no way we can put Aruba on the no visa list??? Nobody from the United States goes to Aruba and nobody from Aruba comes anywhere near this country?

    135. Patrick Gangemi on December 11th, 2007 2:59 am

      Hey ARUBA JUSTICE SYSTEM!

      I am from Blue Bell, Pennsylvania and this is a story about a young girl who attended the same high school I graduated from in 2004, Wissahickon High School! SHe was strangled, beaten, murdered, and then raped early last friday morning, the 7th. My prayers go to her family and I am happy they can get closure for their loved one. An honors student who loved doing the right things killed!

      What did our local and state police force do????

      THEY CAUGHT THIS DISGRACE BY NOT BOTCHING ANYTHING AND PURSUING THE “LAST PERSON THAT WAS SEEN WITH EBONY”!

      WHAT DID YOU DO, ARUBA?

      YOU LET THEM CONTINURE THEIR JOURNEY UNTIL THE RIGHT JUDGEMENT OF GOD SENDS THEM TO HELL!

      AND THROUGHOUT IT, NATALLE LIVES ON FOREVER!!!

      PIECES OF SHI* YOU ARE J2K!

    136. Patrick Gangemi on December 11th, 2007 2:59 am

      http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/story?section=news/local&id=5822597

      THIS IS THE SITE OF THE STORY I JUST MENTIONED!

      WATCH!

    137. Mike on December 11th, 2007 3:27 am

      To All The Trolls:

      It doesn’t make a bit of difference what you think! We have you by the balls and are going to squeeze even harder now. You have helped with this last episode. The only Americans that you will get are the older people on set incomes and they are not going to spend money on drinks and entertainment so you better get started on making up all those millions of tourist dollars with the South Americans and Europeans. May be you get them to make up the difference before you all starve and if you don’t that will just be tough $hit.I get the biggest smile just thinking about it. Squeeze, Squeeze…. you are blue now and will be purple before too much longer and all you had to do was to take care of your customers but you did not seem to think that was important.Aruba could have had it all by showing the world that Aruba really was safe and if “something bad” happened it would be taken care of and the criminals would be prosecuted to the fullest extent of whatever law you supposedly have.Aruba is headed down the toilet and you have just grabbed the handle to flush. Goodbye and good riddance!!!

    138. indianaredneck on December 11th, 2007 3:30 am

      Everybody buy and read Into The Deep The Hidden Confession of Natalee’s Killer by Andrew G. Hodges, M.D.! EXCELLENT BOOK!

    139. mayan_moons on December 11th, 2007 3:42 am

      Thank you Patti for your condolences on the losss of my mother, i appreciate it very much. Due to her health problems i’ve taken care of her for the last 20 years and everyday as i wake….by the time my feet hit the floor the realization that i’m never going to see her or hear her voice, her laugh…is like a punch in the stomach. We had alot more years together than Beth & Natalee got to have together but its the worst feeling in the world when your close loved one is gone & never coming back.

      I think of Beth when it gets to be to much and admire her strength & faith & try to maintain mine.

    140. mayan_moons on December 11th, 2007 3:54 am

      My thoughts and prayers go out to her family and you Patrick. So glad the guilty will be put where he belongs…..should be a 6 foot hole.

    141. SteveDinMD on December 11th, 2007 4:36 am

      Kloothommel said:

      “How would you feel if the whole world decided to boycot the USA just because somebody in miami killed an tourist?

      Why should you be punished for the deed’s off somebody else?”

      SteveDinMD: I believe that most of us here in the U.S., like myself, could be quite understanding if Natalee’s disappearance were a genuine mystery, but it’s not. Those responsible for her death are well known. We could also understand if insufficient evidence were uncovered by a competent and sincere investigation, but such an investigation was never conducted. Rather, from day 1 we’ve witnessed an unbroken chain of countless missteps that have undermined the cause of justice. We could probably even understand and forgive simple incompetence, but the truth is far more sinister. In fact, Aruba’s highest public officials in the Justice Ministry and elsewhere have all conspired to ignore evidence, to destroy evidence, and to subvert the rule of law, all to ensure that the guilty in this case go free. Moreover, this conspiracy is so blindingly obvious that it insults the intelligence of those who have followed the case from the beginning.

      Lets turn now to your premise. What IF a U.S. citizen in Miami killed a tourist from, say, Aruba? To provide some background, I’d first care to point out that it is appalling to most people in the U.S. to see time and again how most foreigners greet with near jubilation the news that one of their own has somehow escaped prosecution for crimes committed against outsiders, especially Americans. Arubans aren’t unique in this regard, merely typical. Americans, by contrast, by and large reject this sentiment. We’re not such mindless “homers” that we would blindly support a fellow American, irregardless of guilt. If an American citizen had murdered an Aruban tourist in Miami, I’m confident that the vast majority of my fellow citizens would favor prosecuting the offender to the fullest extent of the law, to include seeking capital punishment, if applicable. You see, Americans are insightful enough to recognize that a fellow citizen who is capable of murdering a tourist could just as easily commit crimes of violence against his countrymen, and is therefore undesirable as a member of society.

      If, in our hypothetical scenario, all the people of the world nevertheless decided to boycott the U.S. over the murder of the tourist in question, then that would be their privilege. Right or wrong, we wouldn’t be able to compel them to discard their sensibilities and do business with us. This is likewise true for Aruba with respect to the Holloway case. There is no appeal from the judgement of the marketplace, and the American market demands justice for Natalee. If Aruba wants their business, they’re best advised to give the people what they want. The customer is always right.

    142. Jim Hanson on December 11th, 2007 6:15 am

      I can’t belive how bigoted and brainwashed you all are here … Are all of you on blogs defending the thousands of missing persons in the US that have never been found as well? I hope so. If you aren’t, well, you’re hypocrites …
      _________
      SM: Gee as a matter of fact they do you well informed troll … http://www.missingexploited.com

      You may want to actually be informed before you make foolish comments.

    143. Jim Hanson on December 11th, 2007 6:17 am

      What you read here is one of the reasons the United States is the most hated country on earth … for God’s sake, get a life …
      _________
      SM: OK Troll boy, every maybe that you might think to getting a life yourself? Don’t tell others to do what you obviously are in desperate need of.

    144. Scarrlett on December 11th, 2007 8:19 am

      @ Kloothommel
      Thanks for your knowledge and the facts of the leagal system out there.It explains alot.The law is run by only a few and the rest are at the mercy of the rich and connected.”WE” as Americans can stand up and say anything we feel and do not have to worry about repercussions by our Govt`.I do understand that this is not the case else where in the world.This whole mess should at least make us proud to live free and have Justice For All and grateful to be an American!
      On “The Line Up”.the Kalpoes Mom said her son was wanting to go to Miami for school!!Could this culprit really get into our country?What would he have to do to gain entrance into a Miami school?

    145. cullen on December 11th, 2007 8:48 am

      You people are a riot! Good luck with your boycott! Meanwhile, I’ll continue to enjoy my vacations in Aruba – still one of the safest destinations on earth! Happy Holidays!
      ___________
      SM: That is your free choice to do what you please. You have the right to look the other way and pretend nothing happened. Ask yourself though, would you feel the same and do the same if Natalee was your daughter, niece, sister or friend? Hmm?

      Would it be different if it affected you directly? There’s an ethical question to ponder.

      RED

    146. Miss-Underestimated on December 11th, 2007 9:15 am

      I have to get this off my chest and then I won’t hopefully have to post about it again.

      To all that say we are the most hated country….

      How many of you live in a country where you are call upon to help others whether in civil unrest, natural disaster or civil human rights, none of your countries are.

      Does your country have a problem with people risking to come here for work or protection from their governments? No none of your countries.

      Most hated. Yep so is Bill Gates. That is the mentality of the haves and don’t haves.

      Your sorry a&& mentality, If I don’t have it, I hate it.
      That’s exactly why you will never have it.

    147. Vicki on December 11th, 2007 9:23 am

      This is so crazy…There is NO LAWS on LIERUBA…they never needed any..they are a fasade{SP} you know like in the HOLLYWOOD movies, where you have store fronts but nothing behind them…This place was set up to money launder. The MAFIA decided hey, its a great place to bring in drugs and wash money and send them out again. We will just jazz it up some, have tourists come and have the locals take care of them. Gives the locals something to do, they stay out of our business and its a win win situation…Beth said in her book, there were ALOT of places she couldnt look. Places with fences around them and guards and helicopter pads…the whole place is a seedy,filthy place…with drug dealers,pimps,chollers,crack heads..just to name a few.BOYCOTT LIERUBA CAUSE YOUR LIFE DEPENDS ON IT…

    148. cullen on December 11th, 2007 9:57 am

      Red, I appreciate your opinion as well but don’t believe that Aruba is any different than any other tourist destination. Common sense with regards to personal safety goes a long way!

    149. Michelle Says So on December 11th, 2007 10:02 am

      Hey mayan_moons! Thanks for the holiday wishes!

    150. Pat in Alabama on December 11th, 2007 10:07 am

      When I’m planning a vacation I always look for a place where the local police officials admit that they don’t interfere with drug addicts that kidnap and fleese the tourists. Why go to Disney, when you can be taken for a ride in Aruba?

      Some people just don’t get it, or perhaps they just don’t like that others are so vocal in exposing what is really going on. Taking a vacation where you can be safe is just common sense, and letting others know about the danger isn’t punishment, it’s the right thing to do. I would certainly hope someone would warn me if they knew I was putting myself in danger.

      If I want customers to come to my business (or town) I have to make conditions desirable for them, and not just a facade. A wise man once told me that word of great service would get around fast, but word of poor service would get around faster. I have observed that to be true. Aruba, you have a severe customer service problem, and advertising isn’t going to fix it.

    151. Sharon Chicago on December 11th, 2007 10:11 am

      #146 Misunderstood so true…

      I have traveled internationally a lot and have heard from time to time how arrogant the Americans are. We are misunderstood by some people.

      We as Americans are confident and show that to the world…we have the freedom of speech and are able to voice our opinions without repicusions…we work hard and strive toward reaching the American dream which enables us to be blessed monatarily and t0 be able to bless others by giving, we have big hearts to help our country and other countries…

      and many other countries do not have this mind set. They are oppressed, not free, not inspired, not ambitious to reach higher for their American dream.

      I think that their pride and jealousy plays a big part in calling us Americans arrogant or whatever. I think that THEY feel inferior because we are flourishing and they are not.

      Don’t misunderstand I am not putting them down at all I think that they do that to themselves, unfortunately.

    152. brenda on December 11th, 2007 10:37 am

      #54…well, you are partially correct except that Florida is a hugh state with a massive population of 18,089,888 according to 2006 data. Aruba is a tiny speck of ash (as someone put it) and the population only has about 70,000. It is so small, that the “popular” people are certainly recognized or known by about everyone for the most part.

      There is no reason to equate the two. Saying that, there ARE areas in Florida I would not step foot into because of not only the crime rate, but the fact many of the local population feel “squeeling” is not correct. They have gone backwards, so to speak, in moral evolution. Same I see for ARuba. Those who can speak out choose not to. With only 70K people, you are correct that many probably know what happened and the coverup was throughout the island’s law enforcement/judicial community.

      At least in Florida, there are more good law enforcement officials than bad and crimes of this nature are not as easily covered up.

      Still, you are correct in that many innocent folks who knew nothing are being hurt. Maybe they really should demand answers rather than forcing Nat’s family to do all the pushing?

    153. super dave on December 11th, 2007 11:04 am

      wonder how much little cullen was paid for that
      ignorant comment ?

    154. katablog.com on December 11th, 2007 11:07 am

      Something struck me the other day and I didn’t mention it but we all remember the troll Kammel?

      Kloothammel – remove a few letters.

    155. super dave on December 11th, 2007 11:07 am

      oh, i guess jim hanson and cullen were holding hands when the payments were made ! yes we are hated by the muslims, but we are free and still have the right to defend ourselves. i have yet to see that in aruba.

    156. katablog.com on December 11th, 2007 11:19 am

      Deetch has a wonderful picture of Papa and Mama Sloot with Tacopinia http://arubadirtypolice.blogspot.com/ for his 12/10 entry – anyone know who the other guy is? Perhaps Richard Smid the judge?

    157. dennisintn on December 11th, 2007 11:55 am

      #l56, the guy with them is taco.’s “forensic” expert. he can almost find the bathroom without help. that pic. looks like a weightwatchers, meeting has been interrupted. check out paulus’s fly.
      dennisintn

    158. Miss-Underestimated on December 11th, 2007 12:17 pm

      153. Dave, they were a free trip to Aruba.

    159. Miss-Underestimated on December 11th, 2007 12:19 pm

      157. I wonder how Joe let that picture out?
      Paulus caught with his fly down…..again?

    160. Richard on December 11th, 2007 1:27 pm

      Folks, don’t feed the trolls. Some of them just post nonsense here that doesn’t merit a reply.

      Katablog (#83) … I might well be wrong. But I’ve long thought that Paulus vd Scum is one of many Arubans who the drug cartel kingpins thought was worth cultivating … i.e., paying off.

      It seems to me that PvdS has demonstrated his ability to manipulate and pervert what passes for the Aruban “justice” system. Wouldn’t it be worth while for the drug kingpins to have someone like that on his side?

      So, in re Natalee, he may well have contacts with people who have a LOT of Aruba cowed.

      I also suspect that lots of other Arubans are on the take. The Bradleys told me that, in one of their searches for their daughter Amy on Curacao, they were shown an airstrip that the drug lords use to ferry drugs.

      That airstrip was about two minutes from an American air base.

      So we are premising big-time drug connections on Aruba, as elsewhere in the Caribbean. Remember, too, that Aruba is a place where cruise ships visit … and it is known beyond dispute that cruise ships are used to ferry drugs.

      My point being, also, that it seems nobody on Aruba trusts anyone else. (We can understand that easily enough: look how corrupt the place is.)

      So my belief that Natalee was turned over to a druglord, or a porno film kingpin, as a way of getting rid of her and possibly of profiting, AND possibly with the element of sheer psychological sadism thrown in as well (not to mention that lots of people in the Caribbean don’t like Americans … AND that young blond girls evoke the Hollywood image), illustrates in part the grip that the drug lords have on the island.

      And not to belabor the point … but I don’t think Aruba would have rushed to point the finger at anyone else. Rather, they know full well that a case of white slavery would keep Americans away from there forevermore.

      That’s my point … the damage to their tourist trade from an individual assault/rape/accidental death/homicide/murder, IF IT HAD BEEN PROSECUTED, would have been minimal. Because yes indeed, the same things happen here and elsewhere.

      I asked this before: is there anyone here who believes that sheer incompetence is the only factor at work on Aruba?

      It seems to me that everyone does indeed believe in the cover-up.

      And given the impact on Aruba so far, and the potential unlimited impact of the continuing boycott (which only a solution to the case can avert) … either you think the cover-up is being sustained at a high level for the benefit of the suspects we have, plus maybe others, or you think that something darker is involved.

      Again, human trafficking is, in my eyes, the only logical explanation.

      Naturally, I may well be wrong. I hope we find out. But despite all the theories that we have presented, I think we can agree on one thing:

      Boycott Aruba. It’s only common sense.

    161. da_wench on December 11th, 2007 1:35 pm

      #109 – How the hell would you know what other missing persons cases posters here are concerned with. I am one of many here who are following several missing persons cases in the U.S. In fact I’m following many unsolved murders as well…some of those murders committed by our own men in blue. You are making assumptions without any facts. I can tell you that if there was the kind of corruption in my hometown as there is in Aruba, I would speak up, not hide like a terrified mouse as other Arubans do.

      If you are sick and tired of what is posted here, BUZZ OFF! We don’t appreciate your assinine comments anyway.

    162. da_wench on December 11th, 2007 1:42 pm

      120 – You are absolutely right. Americans are hated all over the world, especially since Bush has been in office. I didn’t vote for him and I think he should be impeached, but I’m still an American and still hated by others because of our administration.

    163. brenda on December 11th, 2007 2:21 pm

      Da_wrench…gotta respectfully as possible disagree with you once more. Our administration has nothing to do with it. If so, explain why we were not loved by all when Mr. “I’ve got a cigar in my pants” Clinton was in office? Talk about one in need of a full impeachment!!!

      We only have to go back to what happened at Pearl Harbor to see this hatred goes back further than the past 7 years. Hell, we’ve been hated since we won the Revolution and gained our freedom!

    164. Richard on December 11th, 2007 2:47 pm

      Whatever politicians may be in charge, it seems clear that there’s always some animosity toward Americans. I’ve lived abroad a lot, and this general feeling doesn’t always translate into anger against a particular person, but for some reason it seems easy to assail Americans.

      Undoubtedly Bush is not popular in much of the world (or at home); whether that feeling is justified or not, who knows?

      But many posters here who have been to Aruba have told us their feeling that the Arubans wanted their money, and their money ONLY … and didn’t welcome them at all.

      (It’s only fair to say that not everyone agrees with that assessment of the Aruban people.)

      I’m sure that this feeling of anti-Americanism, coupled with the psychological perversion that use of some drugs fuels, might help explain why, say, drug kingpins would take special delight in reducing Natalee to the level of a sexual slave.

      By the way, there was an article the other day about some Americans (all men, I believe) who have been held captive in the Colombian jungle for three or four years by militants. Does anyone think it’s impossible that the same could happen to Natalee somewhere?

    165. jgirl on December 11th, 2007 3:28 pm

      What about Natalee’s text messages? Are they fact? I guess what are the real facts is the question. No, really, I am curious about those messages Natalee sent. Does anyone know all about them. Maybe “something bad happened” was someone taking her away. We’ll never know unless Nat or her body is found. Sad.
      ________________________
      SM: There are no text messages (klaasend)

    166. brenda on December 11th, 2007 3:47 pm

      #164. YES! I remember reading about that. There is one woman and 3 or 4 men. The woman was politically active, but I do not know any more about her. One of the men (supposedly) had a will he was reading on camera. The information came from a raid by authorities on a remote cabin and the tapes were located at that time. Wish I had more info.

    167. Kloothommel on December 11th, 2007 4:19 pm

      @brenda on December 11th, 2007 2:21 pm

      Do you have any idea how many corrupt regime’s were supported by the US administration in the past.

      Regimes that surpressed civil rights, killed people, started wars.

      Iran (the Shah was supported an helped by the US)
      Iraq (Saddam came to power with american weapons)
      Various Country’s like Chili in South America
      They even helped Pinochet overthrow an LEGALLY & DEMOCRATIC elected goverment of Chili to establish the dictorial regime of Pinochet.

      and the list is even much longer.

      And do you know how many corrupt regimes are stil supported by the US administration today?

      Pakistan,
      Saudi Arabia,
      Quwait
      and the list is even much longer.

      And yet you dare to point to other country’;s

      Let me give you an small hint, if natalee holloway dissappeared in Saudi-Arabia then the US government would help the Saudi-Arabia’s government to cover it up.

      Get with the fact’s the US administration has and still is activly supporting corrupt regime’s which are in their own intrests.

      Whe have an saying for that and that is :
      “Wel de splint in andermans oog zien maar niet de balk in je eigen oog”

      Which roughly translates to :

      “Seeing the splinter in somebody’s elses eye but not the 2 by 4 in youre own eye”

    168. Koo on December 11th, 2007 4:51 pm

      Is anyone else as tired as I am of the lectures?
      sheeeeesh~

    169. Kloothommel on December 11th, 2007 5:11 pm

      @Koo on December 11th, 2007 4:51 pm

      What is it?, can’t handle the truth?????

      Last major f*** up off the US, lying about Iraq, illigally invading Iraq and being responsible for 500.000+ dead iraqi’s

      When can we expect the perp’s to be brought to justice for crime’s against humanity???

      Saddam was brought to power by the US also.

      I’m getting sick and tired of the US pointing at other country’s fouls while being one of the biggest creator and supporter of foul regime’s.

    170. brie on December 11th, 2007 5:19 pm

      The reason for being here is the disappearance of Natalee, the injustice shown by Aruban authorities and all reasons that could have lead to her death or abduction. We’re help to help not hinder. So if you can’t say or do anything in that respect…then drink alot of beer, eat alot of beans and follow it up with cheese. In other words, blow yourself up and get the living h**l out of here!!!!!!!!

    171. Jim Hanson on December 11th, 2007 5:23 pm

      You people are a riot! Good luck with your boycott! Meanwhile, I’ll continue to enjoy my vacations in Aruba – still one of the safest destinations on earth! Happy Holidays!
      ___________
      SM: That is your free choice to do what you please. You have the right to look the other way and pretend nothing happened. Ask yourself though, would you feel the same and do the same if Natalee was your daughter, niece, sister or friend? Hmm?

      Would it be different if it affected you directly? There’s an ethical question to ponder.

      RED

      Interesting comment SM — None of the people on this blog are related to NH, so why are they all caught and wound up and at war with Aruba? People have disappeared from every vacation spot down there … does that stop others from vacationing there? NO …

    172. Maggie on December 11th, 2007 5:35 pm

      Paulus trying to clear his conscience? lol

      What the heck does an American invited tourist to Aruba, who was victimized, trashed and disposed of like yesterday’s newspaper got to do with Iraq, Iran and Chile and Dictators? Not a damn thing. Nice thing to compare Aruba against. When you got to revert to that to defend what was done to Natalee, I really wonder. Aruba is here advertising to come to one big safe happy island, not vice versa.

      Ever heard of keep your friends close and your enemies closer?

    173. JusticeforNatalee on December 11th, 2007 6:23 pm

      Actually, Koo, what many of us are tired of is
      the change of topic to such things as crime in US, President Bush, etc.

      Irrelevant!

      The crime, corruption, and coverup regarding Natalee happened in ARUBA.

      This thread is dedicated to Natalee Holloway. We stand for her justice.

      We also wish to warn other tourists of the dangers of Aruba.

      It isn’t so much the crime –but the coverup–that has caused the scandal and tarnished image for Aruba.

      We have chosen to support Natalee. Nothing you say will stop the voluntary boycott. It is a free choice that vacationing Americans have made and will continue to make.

      After the latest dog and pony show, many more will join the boycott. Did you read the comments at Gretawire? People who never considered boycotting switched sides. People are FED UP with authorities jerking the Holloway family around and disgusted with the big stall on justice.

      NO JUSTICE/NO TOURISTS

    174. Tazman on December 11th, 2007 6:29 pm

      Was he walking to the store with the younger brother that he once beat up & had to go to therapy over his violent temper??

    175. minnesota dad on December 11th, 2007 6:34 pm

      I am still waiting for the Aruba/Joran/Dutch law apologists to answer my simple questions posed in post #114. It is amazing how they all defend Aruba, Joran, and Dutch Law…but avoid addressing the serious questions which point directly at a high end cover-up of the murder of Natalee Holloway.

      Still waiting….

      MD

    176. 10061906 on December 11th, 2007 6:47 pm

      Of all the “evidence” collected that may have been useful, in my opinion was discarded.
      A copy of Natalee’s dental records could have been compared to the pieces of foam with the imbedded teeth marks. Saliva on the foam could have been compared to Beth’s DNA sample. What happened to that along with the bottle with the unknown liquid, the VCB shirt that was never checked for DNA nor the sport sun glasses like Geoff wears. The body oil and dead skin cells from the glasses too could have been checked and DNA analysis could have been compared with Geoff’s. If not enough for DNA at least the cells could be checked for being either male or female. XX vs XY Biology 101.
      Maybe that is why Geoff almost crapped his pants when he saw the Beach Security while walking with that female tourist when Natalee’s name was mentioned.

    177. Maggie on December 11th, 2007 7:00 pm

      Have a good trip Jim Hanson,, be sure to take your brothers and serenade Renfro and Anita with a little MMMMMM Bop.. btw I am Margaret Thatcher.

      The injustices in this case just strikes every nerve of a person’s being, if they are any decent kind of human being to start with, whether one is related or not. Forget the minor percentage who still want to marry Scott Peterson and that an 18 year old girl celebrating the time of her life, getting ready to go off to enjoy her college scholarship, wanted to sit on some dark, cold beach at 3am to look at stars in a foreign country. Let’s see their argument is..she wasn’t drunk, she knew what she was doing when she went with these 3, then she becomes drunk in the car and wants to see sharks and talks about slaves and Hitler, then she becomes sober and wants to have consensual sex and walks up and down the beach, then she becomes drunk and unruly and wants to stay on the beach alone, then she’s sober when they engage in sexual stuff he describes, then she’s drunk and falls in the water or goes swimming alone and dies. Who in their right mind would believe that garbage..

    178. Nut44x4 on December 11th, 2007 8:08 pm

      to #117 Cheple …Wow, you really need to lay off the crack pipe. :roll:

    179. yoyo muffintop on December 11th, 2007 8:25 pm

      minnesota dad – why don’t you just ask the DEA yourself?
      The answers to you questions are here in the USA. At least that’s what you told us:

      “minnesota dad on May 5th, 2007 11:18 pm:
      I fully believe that our DEA knew that night exactly what went on with Paulus and the other perps. The problem is our method of getting that information probably is not within ‘Dutch Law’. Not admissable, but serious enough to let the Holloway/Twittys know that some serious stuff went down with their daughter. They know exactly what that stuff was.”

    180. weael on December 11th, 2007 9:45 pm

      I’m getting sick and tired of the US pointing at other country’s fouls while being one of the biggest creator and supporter of foul regime’s.

      ————————————————
      maybe you would rather have been governed by Hitler or Stalin.

    181. yoyo muffintop on December 11th, 2007 9:47 pm

      Minnesota Dad –
      Since the FBI & State Department (hence the USA) believe Natalee Holloway is less important than fighting drugs and dealing with a wacko leader (as you state), then why on earth should Aruba care about Natalee?
      Good luck with this one…

      “minnesota dad on April 12th, 2007 2:22 pm:
      The FBI and the State Department will not get involved. Aruba’s strategic position to Venezuala is not worth tipping the apple cart over. Yes, strategically, Natalee Holloway is less important than fighting drugs and dealing with a wacko leader. Politics will win on this.”

    182. Poochy on December 11th, 2007 10:10 pm

      Does ANYBODY know what this ‘rotton package from the Hague’ that is SCREAMING to be heard is?
      Whazzup with that codetalker statement? The Hague ACTUALLY has evidence in this case that we’ve not heard about yet?

      Or, do these 3 boys know EXACTLY what happened, but are afraid to talk for fear of their lives? Paulus must PROTECT (not support) his son. Did these boys finally get their drug/gambling markers called in to produce some moolah, or to trade with the lions? BUT the trade went real bad (for Natalee that is?)

      Let’s see who ‘up and fled’ Aruba:

      – Posner – well, we can’t really account for his disappearing act as he ‘arrived on the island’ at a later date.
      - But we know Posner has offices in Miami – Brickle – and we know that’s where Paulus flew just days after her disappearence. To get that tape back Paulus? Hm… didja get it?
      - Tattoo boat – this Aruba icon closed up shop and the boat was immediately put up for sale. Interesting…eh?
      - GVCromvort – up and ‘fled’ Aruba for the Netherlands.Why, surfing not good on Aruba Geoffy?

      - Guido Wever – up and ‘fled’ Aruba for the Netherlands, got the best lawyer $ could by, but not before his mommy told everybody we better not ream into him like we did to Joran! And mommy also sharing his sexual preference to the world as in perhaps something did happen to Natalee of a sexual nature but no, her son could NOT have been involved. Geesh how pathetic of a family can you get!
      - Koen Gottenbos, Sander Gottenbos and family – up and fled to the USA – Mississippi was the last I heard. Sander, you lost your phone that night. What were you doing that night? Oh that’s right, DAddy had to step in and not allow ANY ALE to interview his little angel boys. Sickening.

      - Joran fled to the Netherlands to hide in school. Guess that’s normal being that you really didn’t lose your usa scholarship, now did ya?

      - Lorenzo – not sure what this one is up to, but it took a few years to arrest him on drug charges. DOH! Like he’s the ONLY ONE down there with barb wire around his compound – gimme a break!

      Did I miss anybody??

    183. Poochy on December 11th, 2007 10:23 pm

      “Mos says he has PROMISED THE THREE SUSPECTS that after Dec. 31st, he will not pursue the case, saying: “This investigation should end at a certain point.”

      LET’S REPHRASE WHAT MOS SAID:

      “Mos has PROMISED THE THREE PERPS that he has been $paid $handsomely so therefore will not bother them or their lives after Dec 31st 2007. Mos will close the case. Leave it be. Halt the dog and pony show. Cease and desist harrassment and focus on rebuilding Aruba – sweeping the case dirt under the rug.

      HEY MOS- WE’VE HAD ENOUGH W/YA TOYING WITH OUR HEADS AND HEARTS — SO JUST HOW MUCH $ DID THE CA$INO’S PAY TO GO BACK HOME TO THE NETHERLANDS WITH YOUR TAIL BETWEEN YOUR LEGS? HUH? HOW MUCH DID THEY PAY YOU TO SELL YOUR SOUL TO THE DEBIL?

      TOO BAD THEY GOT TO YOU TOO…

    184. 10061906 on December 11th, 2007 10:31 pm

      poochy: pretty good summary except they fled to Dacula Georgia. not Mississippi.
      You forgot Geoff’s father; I believe it was said he sold his business also; after removing the cameras and then he went back to the low lands.
      Deepak stays because he makes his supplemental income supplying the porn sites with freddy’s pictures. Of couse all my opinion. Van der Straaten I believe is in Bonaire. (?)
      Never could find out where Dennis Jacobs lived and his current whereabouts.

    185. weael on December 11th, 2007 11:45 pm

      Never could find out where Dennis Jacobs lived and his current whereabouts.
      ———————————————
      you’re kidding, right ? someone that big and fat would have a hard time hiding anywhere.

    186. minnesota dad on December 12th, 2007 12:43 am

      Yoyo…answer my questions buddy. Please don’t try to divert attention from the cover-up for Paulus “Mr. Premeditated Murder” Van Der Sloot as alleged by Aruba’s very own before the breaks were put on this case and evidence disappeared.

      md

    187. yoyo muffintop on December 12th, 2007 1:18 am

      I just answered – ask the DEA. According to you, they have the answers.
      Those are your words, not mine. Own ‘em, you wrote ‘em.

      If your own country’s gov’t won’t give you the answers, how can you expect a foreign one too?

    188. minnesota dad on December 12th, 2007 1:37 am

      Numnuts Muffintop,

      Because the WHOLE economy of a foreign country rides on doing the right thing. USA interests (strategically deal with Chavez) are different than Aruba interests (make sure the tourism cash register rings).

      While Aruba followed the ‘textbook’ Caribbean cover-up for a violent crime against a tourist, in the Internet Age that recipe no longer is effective. Aruba, to protect tourism should take Paulus down and let the chips fly on any other corrupt officials down there.

      Its a tourism issue. Cash registers with tourist dollars will never ring in the Internet Age on the current path Aruba is taking. Tons of websites are already up exposing Aruba as an unsafe destination…Tons more will go up after Mos/KLPD play along with the cover-up. Aruba is cooked without coming clean.

      There, I have answered. Now, please answer my list of questions and stop diverting. You deal with these things like a second rate attorney or a failed judge would deal with them.

      MD

    189. yoyo muffintop on December 12th, 2007 2:05 am

      So let me get this straight:
      Aruba has answers for the Holloway family and should give the answers to the Holloway family…because of tourism.
      USA has answers for the Holloway family but will NOT give the answers to the Holloway family…because of Chavez.
      I take it you’re not “proud to be an American” then.

      btw – there’s about 40+ million websites on the internet. 10 out of 40,000,000 doesn’t seem like a ton to me, but what do I know…

    190. Jim Hanson on December 12th, 2007 3:30 am

      172 Maggie … it’s a sick world … get used to it kiddo … btw, do you personally care about all the thousands of blacks & hispanics that have disappeared in your own country without any media coverage? I highly doubt it.

    191. Jim Hanson on December 12th, 2007 3:40 am

      By the way Maggie, have you ever watched the movie “A Time To Kill”? If not, I think it would do you a world of good to see it …

      Actually, it would do eveyone a world of good …

      It did exactly that for me …
      ___________
      SM: After first arresting 2 black officers in Aruba and trying to railroad them, I would dare say maybe Aruba better watch that same movie.

      R

    192. Kayleigh on December 12th, 2007 9:40 am

      Not even Americans make it in the United Sates, take the patriot act as an example, all it takes to be a patriot these days is wave the flag and implicitly trust Congress and federal law-enforcement agents not to abuse a measure that allows for the indefinite detention and imprisonment of U.S. citizens without due process – or even being charged with a crime.

    193. Ryan on December 12th, 2007 9:45 am

      So you people say that Aruba is not safe?,…ok, and you say that the justice system sucks? ok, let’s analyse the differences between Aruba and the United States! For example: for the Aruba government we shall take Goerge W Bush, your dear president. What do they have in common? can you tell me? you say ours is corrupt? right!? then what about him? isn’t he just as corrupt when the soldiers in baghdad wanted to come back to the US and he simpy said that they should remain over there a little longer? To die maybe? for what reason was that? no one knows! Yet! War sucks! poeple who like to play war games suck! don’t tell me that it’ll benefit to the country’s economy, or give your country more power! If in fact you believe so, you shuold’ve been hanged with Saddam. And further more, you say that our country is not safe: over the years there have been countless murders, rapings, lynching, racism,kidnappings, bank robberies etc etc. And did you ever here that Aruba tried to boycott your country? Or any other country try to do that aswell!?? No, that is humanly onethical! Read this line good! YOU CANNOT BLAME AN ISLAND FOR THE ACTIONS THAT THREE (3) INDIVIDUALS HAVE DONE!! wich in fact are not even Arubians!!, hey i feel sorry for nathalee! who doesn’t? i hope too that justice will soon be served! maybe those kids actually did kill her, maybe not….!! The police doesn’t know! The FBI doesn’t know! so how can YOU be so certain?! i mean shish, yeah tell me to look at the facts, this one fled away, the other one is covering up for that one!,….it’s the same deal everywhere son! there’s nothing that YOU can do about it. Can you imagine that if all the oil companies in the Middle East where to boycott your country,…how would you ride your car to school or work?? I doubt that you’ll receive any help from Chavez!Cause he hates the stinking gutz of your President! He calls him Batman! So man if you say that you guys have freedom of speech, go ahead, talk of whatever you like, but please stop talking bad obout my island, it hurts dude! Let’s just pray for nathalee’s sake instead
      _________
      SM: You can blame people for not voicing an opinion … that one can most certainly do. Arubans have no problem protesting and going on strike at Valero and the hospital. But nothing demanding that their officials get to the bottom of the NH investigation when it leaves a dark cloud over the whole island.

      NBC just recently reversed a decision on running ads because the American people spoke and threatened to boycott NBC and their advertisers.

      Arubans can and should have done the same.

      No, Arubans are not responsible for what 3 boys did, but they are responsible for a response to what happened. That they are most certainly held accountable for. That’s what people who care do.

      RED

    194. super dave on December 12th, 2007 9:55 am

      jim hanson: i would think that the family of your so called black, hispanic missing should have put up as much of a fight as Natalee’s parents did !
      her parents have suffered because of the stupid swine like you, yoyo muffin breath, and your little boy cullen.
      you go on to aruba and get yourself raped and murdered and we’ll be sure “not” to look for answers to your whereabouts since you are so smug with your beloved aruba. why don’t you take your hands off yoyo and cullen’s peckers and do something constructive with your life instead of being a complete a$$hole. boy!

    195. Pat in Alabama on December 12th, 2007 9:57 am

      Why do the naysayers continually ask if we are following other cases? This board is about Natalee.

      I actually do follow other cases and have lots of other interests as well. We don’t owe anyone an explaination for why we are here, or why we are interested in this case – the fact is WE ARE! I do wonder why some of the people who seem to hate this board so much waste their time here. Its a free world where I live and that means I’m free to spend my time as I wish and vacation where I wish. I guess the naysayers are free to spend their time on boards they hate.

    196. Ryan on December 12th, 2007 10:00 am

      RED,…that’s the same question i ask myself everytime! How come the poeple on my country can protest for the stupidest of things and still they don’t want to protest to the authorities for some answers, wish i could tell you why, hey i’m just a student, there’s nothing much i can do really, but let me just add something, i find it strange myself why the police here hasn’t invited the FBI to come and help, i mean with they’re expertise they probably could’ve solved the case already?,…

    197. Kayleigh on December 12th, 2007 10:13 am

      Red,

      That’s precisely what we feel the Americans should have done, in stead they gave George W. Bush a second term in the White House. NH was one girl, in Iraq thousands of girls and children died through American bombs and gunfire.

      Americans care? Give me a break, you do not even care about your own, that’s why so many people died and were left to rot out on the streets in New Orleans after Katrina, remember Red? How they died out on the streets, in the stinkin’ heat, little babies that died from dehydration, and how all those so called caring Americans didn’t do shit for 5 days?

      Yes, that’s what people who care do.

    198. crackpipesarebad on December 12th, 2007 10:47 am

      i will take the US over aruba anyday

      aruba will be bankrupt within a year

    199. Pat in Alabama on December 12th, 2007 10:50 am

      Ryan,

      Throughout the world it usually is the young people who bring about change. The old people want things to stay the way they are. Be a force for change; gather people who are like-minded to you and make the world a better place.

    200. Libby on December 12th, 2007 11:07 am

      I love that movie A Time to Kill. {{edit}}
      ____________________
      SM: A bit over the top. Sometimes things are better left unsaid. (klaasend)

    201. Brenda on December 12th, 2007 11:09 am

      #167 – I dare speak of other countries because as an America citizen I have the right to free speech. I appreciate you reminding me of the splinters in my eyes. Can be hard to see through them since I know they are there…yet you do not see you are in need of a pair of tweezers yourself.

      My post regarding my quicky research on population statistics, with the fact many people are more closely aquainted on a small island compared to the heavily populated state of Florida, I fail to see where that is slandering any other country? I also mentioned there are parts of Florida where I’d not be pleased to step foot in the broad daylight.

      You and I have agreed once, but understand I see that when any person starts attacking another’s view(s) rather than expressing ideas, they have run out of things to contribute that are useful.

      Brenda

    202. Brenda on December 12th, 2007 11:16 am

      comment on #180 –

      Yes, there are some people who would rather be governed by Hitler or Stalin. That is why a large part of an entire nation embraced them. No different than the pharaohs who were worshipped by their subject who were often made to be their slaves.

      In Cuba, Castro reigns by use of fear and force. That’s not very, far away and many of his former subjects are here. Some are strong, but some are still broken and would (for reasons I cannot really understand) run to embrace another Castro if he were to rise up in this country. You know, like the “a victim embraces their corrupter” type thing. Now, I’m not saying these are bad people by any means, but they are insecure and often “bad” power is viewed as a secure force to them. Only to later realize they are not being saved, but terrorized again themselves.

    203. downloadingdaddy on December 12th, 2007 11:18 am

      Please quit feeding the trolls!

    204. Brenda on December 12th, 2007 11:40 am

      Oh Kayleigh, you’ve given me a treasure trove to reply to:

      (gonna have to number this)

      1. You wrote “Not even Americans make it in the United Sates,”

      >>> Not everone makes it how (financially, marriage, school, business, sports)? This is called life in every country that ever was or ever will be.

      2. You wrote “take the patriot act as an example,”

      >>>>> That has nothing to do with making or not making it in America.

      3. You wrote “all it takes to be a patriot these days is wave the flag and implicitly trust Congress and federal law-enforcement agents not to abuse a measure that allows for the indefinite detention and imprisonment of U.S. citizens without due process – or even being charged with a crime.”

      >>>> You need to learn about the Patriot Act. I am positive they are not looking for you.

      >>>> As for what constitutes a patrior, I would never accept the person you described as a patrios…only an idiot. Since there are hardly any liberals that trust anything involving monitoring, by your definition none are patriots in THEIR OWN minds. You logic is flawed.

    205. Brenda on December 12th, 2007 11:43 am

      sorry for all the typos in #204..was typing standing up.

    206. Brenda on December 12th, 2007 11:47 am

      Dear downloadingdaddy, I like to torment the trolls, and if a troll myself, I don’t know it?!

    207. Laura on December 12th, 2007 11:57 am

      #90 Carpe

      I have followed this case from the beginning, and I have looked at the Aru-bay video #24, and i have a question for you…When whoever is filming this video and they are looking at the pipeline on one side of the street, it appears that the water is a pretty good distance from the bridge. then the video shows them going to the other side of the street and that is where the bag is located.My question to you is, was that bag floating in water or was it dry in that basin? My reason for asking is if there was no water in that basin, then whatever(or whoever)was in that bag appears to be moving. Look at the bottom of the bag…it appears to be a foot moving up and down.Please let me know what your thoughts are on this. I have been wanting to ask you this for along time, but never had the courage. I didnt want to appear stupid, but I cant seem to get this haunting image out of my head.

    208. Brenda on December 12th, 2007 12:00 pm

      Kayleigh,

      Provide one example of a baby who died in the street from dehydration. Have you ever been in a hurricane? It rains.

    209. Libby on December 12th, 2007 12:26 pm

      Sorry about the comments I made regarding the movie, A Time to Kill. You are right, my comments were a little over the top. I just get so frustrated. Hopefully, justice will be served some day…in some way shape or form.

    210. Richard on December 12th, 2007 1:04 pm

      Question for all: When Joran was released from his latest stint in prison, he took pains to point out that he remained mute, answered nothing, and volunteered no information.

      Why, pray tell, was he at such pains to make sure this precise message was given out?

      He obviously could talk with his family directly; ditto for the Kalpoes.

      So to whom was this message intended to be sent?

      Anyone think it could have been some drug lord off the island or someone else who was responsible for taking Natalee off Aruba?

    211. Libby on December 12th, 2007 1:35 pm

      Very possible Richard.

      I had a dream the other night that Joran had been abducted. The Aruban LE and what resembled hit men in my dream were going crazy looking for him because they knew he would talk if pushed.

      Joran can be big and bad when the girl is drugged and drunk and has no control of herself. I bet, however, he would be a little pussy if someone took him off somewhere and had a little “talk”. Bet he would spill his beans. Probably why Papa Perp sent him away. I’m sure the ALE took good care of him…and the K brothers for that matter while locked up…making sure they talked to no one.

    212. katablog on December 12th, 2007 1:48 pm

      #197 your ignorance is showing.

      There have been civilians killed in Iraq – most of them by Iraqis and al Queada. There have also been thousands of lives saved in Iraq and in other countries by putting terrorists out of commission. Today it may be Iraq, tomorrow it may be your country.

      Next, no babies died in the streets with Katrina. There was so many false and over hyped stories about what really happened. The US Govt. was not doing “nothing” for 5 days. The US was attempting to send in helicopters and had to stop because the thugs on the street were shooting at them!

      You failed to mention the governor and the mayor of New Orleans who left school buses in low lying areas, refused an offer to take people out by trains before the flooding and offered other assistance that was simply rejected.

      Bro – don’t believe everything you see on TV.

    213. Carpe Noctem on December 12th, 2007 5:23 pm

      For Jerry & Laura-

      207 – Laura, I was creeped out by it too, in the
      beginning. It’s either wind, or a rodent.
      I think blowing in the wind would be my pick.

      It is dry in there.

      The material they used to bag everything, looks just
      like that stuff the so called “forensic team” was
      working with out at the Rocks.

      Also, over time I have noticed white hand prints & smudges all over the Marriott Basin. The goon squad out at the rocks was using stuff that looked just like it.

      MARRIOTT
      The footage was likely shot by a Top 95 radio reporter.

      Dates sometime between 6/10 – 6/12.

      CO-INK-A-DINKLY… isn’t that real neat how all
      this activity was taking place at the same time
      Joran is confessing, taking cops to the Fisherman
      Huts, and then reeling his confession back in.

      I believe with everything, that IS Natalee in #24.

      So, that means I can’t buy that they could turn
      the body around for disposal in just (24-48 hrs)

      They held it for about 10 days… and who
      knows where… but

      They may have waited for the Rocks to be searched,
      then dropped the body there for bagging and disposal.

      From there, into the Marriott basin for a brief
      layover (that area had just been searched too -
      so they were in the clear.) Paulus & Anita seemed
      to know about all the police activity and where
      they were searching. REMEMBER: She told Joran-stein
      and the boys to specifically steer clear of that Marriott area?

      I think Steve Croes helped with disposal. They didn’t
      just arrest him out of the blue! There’s a reason,
      we just haven’t figured it out yet. I think he’s
      more f’n stupid than a rock, but for me to buy
      the fact he turned himself in to provide a fake alibi
      for Deepak… GUMME A BREAK!

      He needs to be wearing adult diapers, & a special helmet with a chin strap if he’s that damn stupid!!!

      From there (Marriott) into the trap & boat, and finally in the sea, 3 – 5 mi. out.

      http://tinyurl.com/ytqw8d

      -j4n

    214. Carpe Noctem on December 12th, 2007 5:33 pm

      MARRIOTT BASIN PHOTOS – updated

      http://tinyurl.com/jljbv

      -j4n

    215. Jim Hanson on December 12th, 2007 6:16 pm

      jim hanson: i would think that the family of your so called black, hispanic missing should have put up as much of a fight as Natalee’s parents did !
      her parents have suffered because of the stupid swine like you, yoyo muffin breath, and your little boy cullen.
      you go on to aruba and get yourself raped and murdered and we’ll be sure “not” to look for answers to your whereabouts since you are so smug with your beloved aruba. why don’t you take your hands off yoyo and cullen’s peckers and do something constructive with your life instead of being a complete a$$hole. boy!

      “Super Dave” … if this the best you can do with a post here, in other words simply calling people you don’t know childish names, then you’re much use here are you. As far as I can see after reading your post, you’re quite childish and don’t have anything useful to contribute here.

      You’re telling ME to get a life after what you wrote? Did you perhaps once think it’s YOU who needs a life? I happen to have one. Do you?

    216. Pat in Alabama on December 12th, 2007 7:23 pm

      Laura:

      It looks like someone moving under the plastic to me. I think all of the videos were staged. When was the last time someone in the media shot video of something and didn’t take credit for it? This would have been the biggest breaking news on Aruba in our lifetime, and they just pass up the story? Why didn’t they take some footage of the basin with the plastic pulled back so that there would be no doubt who it was??? Someone is having a good laugh over this.

      I really believed the video of the rocks for a long time. I was sure it was a forensic recovery of Natalee. There is one point in video 8 where it looks like they lift a hand or foot, but the more I reflect on the videos the more questions they raise.

      If the dogs are cadaver dogs, why are they standing around so disinterested? Why are the guys intensly interested in one area, working on something, but then move 10 feet away and start wrapping someting in plastic there. What’s up with the cooler? I’m sure its hot there, but if I was recovering a dead body I would be ready to throw up, not take a break and drink Gatorade. Most people know that blood evidence might be visibly covered by paint, but that scrapings could be made later by any passers by that wanted to send samples for DNA tests. The paint would tend to preserve the blood from getting washed away by rain. How did this person ratting out the ALE know when and where to go to shoot this video (they are there ahead of the vehicles). I just can’t buy into the videos any more. More misinformation, and they have done a good job at leading us off track, but then these people are professionals…

    217. Maggie on December 12th, 2007 7:51 pm

      Jim Hanson, I have watched ” A Time to Kill” what does that have to do with Natalee’s case? Why come here and complain about publicity Natalee’s case is getting or any missing person case? How many blogs for missing black people have you started, blogged at or helped search for? How many can you name? Why not go blog on a site for missing African Americans instead of coming here complaining about one who gets attention? Enough with the crap profiling Natalee because she is white and blonde. We aren’t here because Natalee is white and blonde, if you are that narrow minded, that is your problem. Of course we can’t pay attention to each missing person case as much due to time. However this is the one who touched all of us who comes here simply because it reeks of corruption and injustice. Why would we then recommend people go there on vacation? Why would we believe the next victim would be handled any different?

      It wasn’t us who tried to frame 2 African Americans for kidnapping and murder.. It was Deepak who said the father/family made that up around the pool as he told Mickey Johns. It was the cops who then went out and arrested even after they seen the video of the Holiday Inn, that Natalee didn’t return. It was these 3 who were getting together making up more stories with Paulus around at the Sloots, while these 2 African Americans sat in jail being interrogated, even when they had alibis.

      I watched a show one night on American Justice about a homecoming queen 17, went to a party and was never seen again.. Oklahoma I think, 2 years later a boy who attended the party came forward. He said his conscience bothered him. He didn’t want a special deal, he said he deserved what they give him. He said the girl was drunk, 3 of them took turns raping her and then killed her to shut her up and he would show them where they buried her. He said he was tired of the lies and watching what the family went through. He got life, the other 2 got the death penalty.

      Would you please explain, why 3 guys would go out and move in on 1 girl a half hour before closing time? Natalee was at CnC a few nights before, made it back just fine..Would you please explain why you would describe a persons underwear and private parts to the family the first night and all kinds of graphic sexual stuff going on at the lighthouse and back, say she was waking up and falling asleep, say she was drunk, say she hit her head and fell when she got out and then shoved Joran(Have you checked out Joran’s size compared to Natalee’s?)point to 2 black security guards who got her and when that didn’t work, point to each other for rape and or murder all because you felt bad about leaving her on a beach? He first told the family, he didn’t know her or her name and yet tried to say he made the story up about what happened to her on the way home to talk to them. Loonieeeee… No logic to anything they say.

      Like I said last night.. She’s in the bar according to them, doing jello shots, dancing on a bar drunk.. She leaves with Joran walking fine, talking fine, gets in the car on her own according to them and she’s sober to decide that, then she starts wanting to see sharks, talking about Hitler, and plantations, then shes normal wants to go on the beach for sex, walks up and down the beach talking and holding hands, then goes nuts again drunk and wants to stay alone, refusing to go, then shes sober again wanting consensual sex, then she’s drunk again and goes swimming and drowns. Please, I do not believe at all a girl would ask to be left on the beach alone at 3 am to look at stars in a foreign country, no more than I believe, someone else would come along and victimize her then go hunt shoes down, that he don’t even know about and get rid of them too. Nothing about this case, passes the smell test.

    218. resolution on December 12th, 2007 9:24 pm

      sorry maggie….they cannot respond to your questions and shame on them! To me, it’s nothing more than covering up for similar situations or somehow, retalitations for something that it is within their up-bringing. I bet they may be bed-wetters.

    219. Poochy on December 13th, 2007 12:17 am

      #184 10061906 Thanks for correcting me that the Gottenbos’ settled in Dacula (DRACULA?)GA

      I’ve watched Aru-Bay videos (aka Chicago510) a gazillion times over the yrs. Take notice of the background music, lyrics, movie titles, etc. For example, the name of the movie w/the cruise ship and smaller ship facing opposite directions was entitled ‘David and Goliath’. Did y’all know that “David and Goliath” is the name of Sinbad’s production company? Sinbad runs the Soul Beach Music Festival…and ran it in Aruba 2005… His real name is David Adkins – could this be the “only DAVID made it out alive” codetalker reference? Also, if you look as the two ships ‘pass in the night (er daytime)’ the videographer makes it a point for you to notice that there was a handoff of some sort between the smaller boat and the cruise ship. On tripadvisor.com I read when cruise ships dock in Aruba, some local kids come on board and ‘hang’ with other friends who are working on the ship – no questions asked. So much for cruise safety.

      One of the vids has music that could be interepreted as drunken or disoriented music. It’s in the one that was taken from the private island, and zooming in on the Aruba high rise hotels. There’s another vid that takes us all over town on the roads, and then the film glitches and zooms in and out a few times as if to get us to notice a particular spot. Well, that’s what I got out of ‘em anyway.

      If ya’ll got Adobe Premiere software, you can REALLY check out all the spliced effects done into those movies. There’s a movie of a guy who hides behind a rock, and as he pops up and down, the guy changes from a dark hair to a blonde and back…also different icons appear and disappear in that same video onto of the rocks.

      So, if you haven’t done it already, get your sleuth hats on and check out the OTHER clues on those vids that has yet to be explored… carpe – you seem to be the aru-bay video expert – go get ‘em!

    220. Pat in Alabama on December 13th, 2007 12:35 am

      Poochy:

      I haven’t seen those things; perhaps have not studied them that closely. It sounds like someone playing head games to me. The suspects and ALE have thumbed their noses at Natalee’s parents (and others who care) so many times I wouldn’t put it past them to make them up popping in and out like hide and go seek. Sick!

    221. Dolf on December 13th, 2007 10:39 am

      again: Aruba only cares for Dutch money, nothing else.

      We in Holland do not really like the way how the islands are managed (Curacao also comes to mind).
      But there is not much we can do about it.

      Only if we (Holland) threaten them with stopping funding they listen (a tiny bit)

      and for the remark about ppl only wanting the tourists money, this not an Aruban thing.

      Been to different parts of the world and most places are like this (Greece was a very positive change)

    222. stoney on December 13th, 2007 12:49 pm

      whats the update on the boat in aruba searcing the deep water with new technology

    223. Libby on December 13th, 2007 2:41 pm

      Stoney, I think someone said the boat won’t be there till Saturday now due to a tropical storm.

    224. Jim Hanson on December 14th, 2007 5:51 am

      By the way Maggie, I’m Canadian, I live on Vancouver Island … I could care less about Aruba, we have no intention of ever travelling to the Caribbean hotspots … we have beautiful beaches here on the Pacific to visit all summer for free ….

      We did however take the kids about ten years ago to Disneyland and and stayed at a motel in Long Beach. Every night we heard screaming from either outside or in rooms close by. It was a nightmare. We’ve never been back to the States since. I can just imagine what went on further than we could hear every night. VIOLOENCE.

      Someone goes missing in the US every 4 minutes … check it out … is that enough? Or should it be every 2 minutes?

      Las Vegas has the highest missing person count in the US … did you know that?

      I’m not a bigot … our country is a total melting pot … we all live with it … we don’t pack AK 47′s here and shoot up shopping malls and Universities … we’re civil … we have our odd events, but so does every other country …

      I think my whole point here is to stop believing everything you see and hear on the news and tabloid shows, concentrate on the problems in your own country, try to solve them if you have the ability to do so, and stop trying so solve this missing person case in Aruba, because you can’t …

    225. Dolf on December 14th, 2007 9:46 am

      Jim,

      stop using logic against the yanks.
      doesn’t work.

      btw. I also would skip on Aruba, not because of this incident, not because the weather is nice (rain, rain, rain) here at home.

      but because there is nothing to do there except drinking and sunning.

      I am thinking of a visit to NYC after my wedding next year 9/11, but the whole US customs thing doesn’t really sound appealing (don’t really like to be treated as cattle by some guy/girl who thinks he/she is god because he/she wears an uniform)

    226. Dan on December 14th, 2007 1:24 pm

      IMHO, I believe Aruba should be boycotted. I believe the sloots as well as the Kalpoes are guilty as hell. I also believe a cover up has taken place. For a very long time I have thought that natalee was dead, but im not so sure anymore. I do believe only the persons involved know for sure what happened, and that would be the sloots and the kalpoes. It appears that what has been said is that natalee has been murdered and disposed of. Im just not totaly convinced, I feel the boys did rape her and druged her no doubt. I can’t help but to think that natalee is still alive and was sold into sexual slavery. I think a lot of what has been said probably is true, but I think they managed to keep her alive and got her off the island. Natalee is a very beautiful young lady and in the sexual slave market she would be worth a bundle. I think that this was well planned out except for they never figured that Beth & Dave would raise such a stink. I believe they were not prepared for that. Thus all the bungling of the investigation. Yes I agree the higher ups are soooooo corrupt and were paid off, thats a given. I believe that she was sold because of the disappearance of Jennifer Kesse and Stepha Henry. they both disappeared with out a trace, no bodies have been found and no nothing. All 3 of these young women are very beautiful and educated. Both Jennifer and Stepha went missing from florida, Stepha was visiting from up north, and Jennifer lived in Orlando. All would bring big bucks to the ring. Im not saying that natalee is alive, i have no clue, she very well may have been murdered by the sloots. In any event joran and his daddy and the kalpoes need to be hung, shot, skinned alive, something for this to of happened. They do know what happened no doubt in my mind. The trafficking of these young ladies is so wide spread and there is so much of it, people really don’t know how bad it is. I just can’t help to think that she and the others are alive somewhere and need our help. Before anyone jumps my arse, I want justice for natalee as much as anyone, trust me, and i am behind the boycott with bells on. What ever has happened to these young women, the perps will pay the ultimate price in the end and you can rest assured that the judge will not be corrupt.

    227. ben on December 15th, 2007 7:15 am

      jim hanson,,,,,did you call the cops concerning the screaming in other room are did you do nothing.if you did nothing what are you bitching about,Scaredmonkeys are doing something.

    228. sydney on February 8th, 2008 10:00 pm

      In retrospect, after seeing that tape of him where he didn’t realize he was being taped, it makes a lot more sense, that statement he made about how he never would have made it in America.

      He had consciousness of guilt and knew he’d never have gotten it past our law enforcement and criminal justice system.

    229. Monte Haun on February 17th, 2008 12:08 am

      “He had consciousness of guilt and knew he’d never have gotten it past our law enforcement and criminal justice system.”

      Yeah, the US criminal justice system is in a shambles, probably the worst in the civilized world, don’t even need a body to prove murder. Testimony from any scumbag working for an easier sentence for some equally disgusting crime.

      Interrogations that qualify as torture, hypnosis, fabricated cop testimony, incompetent forensic lab work, on and on.

      Why do you think our prisons are overflowing with innocents?

      Monte Haun mchaun@hotmail.com

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