Today’s Oxymoron … Police Integrity Report in Aruba


One wonders just how long this investigation was going to be kept under-wraps in Captioncontest_CuracaoOfficerAruba? An investigation into the investigators. Aruban officials even managed to squelch this report as well. Just par for the course on “One Happy Island”.   

The report was already given to the then chief of police Ronny Bernadina on April 3rd of this year.  The investigation took place in 2005 and based on the findings, Forensic Services Caribbean advices to draw up a master plan to deal with the integrity risks.

Read the full article at Amigoe, December 23, 2006: A master plan is needed for better police integrity  

ORANJESTAD – An investigation report on the efficiency of the Police Corps of Aruba (KPA) regarding integrity, states that the control on work procedure is poorly; promotional transfers take place, while there is a disciplinary investigation going; and there is no correct follow up after irregularities within the corps are signaled. 

Forensic Services Caribbean in Curaçao did the investigation by order of Justice-minister Rudy Croes (MEP).  Amigoe learned this from documents that the paper received for perusal.   The report was already given to the then chief of police Ronny Bernadina on April 3rd of this year.  The investigation took place in 2005 and based on the findings, Forensic Services Caribbean advices to draw up a master plan to deal with the integrity risks.  Based on conversations with some key-officials within the KPA and external partners of the corps, like the Security Service, the Public Prosecutor, and the Coastguard, they have mapped nine risks.  They have also analyzed summaries of integrity rules violations within the corps.   They first noticed that many rules regarding work procedures and work processes are established, but that these are not univocal and not conveniently arranged.  The procedures differ per (police-, editor) district and are implemented or interpreted differently.”  Besides, several regulations are not complete.  Not everybody is familiar with the procedures, they are difficult of access, and several of the versions used are outdated.  Several procedures are too complex and have therefore lost their powers.  “They have become dead letters”, states the report.  There is lack of control on the observance of the procedures in all sectors of the organization.  This has to do with not having qualitatively good employees on managerial positions.  Another reason is that there is lack of open culture, in which employees dare to talk to each other.  In order to restrict this risk, the bureau advices to further specify the career policy and to organize trainings that would provoke a culture change within the police corps.  A third risk that can cause the integrity of the corps to come into play is the lack of confidence when it comes to exchange information.  Confidential information is leaked to third parties and nobody knows what to do with the information or that the information can be used against you.   “This lack of confidence has consequences for the internal- and external communication”, states the report.  It also forms a hindrance for working effectively and efficiently.  Their advice is again a culture chance in order to create confidence.  

If you liked this post, you may also like these:

  • Aruba: One Sad Island
  • Kyron Horman Disappearance Series Part I: Desiree Young V Terri Horman- Civil As An Oxymoron
  • The Face of Aruba … Joran Van der Sloot, “Give Natalee Back to her Country & Family”
  • Dear Friends in Aruba – Natalee Holloway missing 3 years
  • Scared Monkeys is featured in Aruba Today

  • Comments

    126 Responses to “Today’s Oxymoron … Police Integrity Report in Aruba”

    1. MIss-Underestimated on December 27th, 2006 3:58 pm

      “A master plan is needed for better police integrity”

      Oooops, is that word integrity, for the police, did anyone consider the judges? How bout the one staying with Lawless VDS?

      I wonder when in 2005 this investigation was done, from what I understand what came out of the Aruba LE, there was little time to do anything else on the island, as they said they were consumed with the Natalee Holloway case?

      Keystone Cops, tripping all over the evidence or skuttling under the carpet?

      What is Aruba’s definition of integrity? Maybe Lawless could tell us.

      Hey Aruba whadya do with Natalee?

    2. mayan_moons on December 27th, 2006 4:00 pm

      (In Gomer Pyle voice)


    3. Observer on December 27th, 2006 4:01 pm

      Huh?? If the dutch havent interrogated these corrupt officials this case will never be solved.

      –If they see the girl they will see the shit–Deepak Kalpoe
      –You will get 15 years if they find the girl–Deepak Kalpoe
      –I will do anything for my son–Paulus Van Der Sloot

    4. MIss-Underestimated on December 27th, 2006 4:19 pm

      Let’s not forget that Anita said the search in her home, netted her camera, but as we now know there was no search of her home.

      Why would PVDS say ” it would be hard to prove a crime if there is no body? What did he know to assume that…1. there was a crime to prove, #2, that now Natalee was a body, rather than the “girl”, saying body implies that Natalee was deceased. Or maybe Arleen will say I just don’t understand.

      Everyone should really take a look at all the hard work our fellow poster Carpe has done with the photos, he has done an excellent job.

    5. Bob on December 27th, 2006 4:32 pm

      frankly Scarlett, I don’t give a damn. What in the world does anyone expect on a dirt pile populated by in-breds? Really.

    6. vicki on December 27th, 2006 4:44 pm

      #4- miss-u, I totally agree. the pictures really need to be explained by someone on that crappy island. Bodies all over the place. What a freakin nitemare… To think that they advertised as one happy island. Its disgusting and dispecable. Then chief???? who is the chief now? Arubasteve or Tacojoe???

    7. Tibrogargan on December 27th, 2006 4:46 pm

      Happy New Year to all at SM and posters and Natalee’s family. Hey mayan_moons how are you doing? Have you found another little four footed friend to love and care for like Tootsie. Hope all goes well for you in 2007. A pox on the three amigos and their supporters. Truth and justice will prevail this coming year and Scared Monkeys will have been the catalyst.

    8. LilPuma on December 27th, 2006 5:30 pm

      What kind of police force would allow a close friend of a boy involved in a missing person case to investigate that case? And then allow a Judge, who is also a friend, rule in the case? A member of the public prosecutor’s office was even present to “support” Paulus when the search warrant was executed, and changed. Given Paulus Van der Sloot’s position in Aruba, independent Dutch investigators should have been brought in immediately when police determined that the boys lied. The Police Chief at the time, Jan Van der Straaten, wasted a lot of time wanting to believe (or trying to make it appear) that Joran van der Sloot did not lie. That’s why this investigation is in the state it’s in; not, as Mr. Tacopina says, because of Jossy Mansur.

    9. JusticeforNatalee on December 27th, 2006 5:55 pm

      No matter what the “plan” is for “police integrity,”
      Aruba CANNOT, I repeat CANNOT,
      move right past Natalee.

      JUSTICE for NATALEE needs to be foremost in “THE PLAN.”
      Aruba Law Enforcement: Isn’t the whole name just a joke? None of the words really mesh.

      Laws aren’t enforced but LIES surely are.


    10. JusticeforNatalee on December 27th, 2006 5:58 pm

      No body no case

      You will get 15 years if they find the girl.

      Joran told Freddy they panicked when Natalee remained passed out.

      Joran was the last person seen with Natalee.

      Just a few of the hideous gems of this case.

    11. Allan K on December 27th, 2006 6:06 pm

      It is a shame, a mockery to speak of integrity and Aruba in the same sentence. The Sloots and most of the people on the island have lied during a criminal investigation. From the Chief to the spokesperson for Aruba. They need to do what is right. Give up the Sloots you hold so dearly to your heart. Quit bad mouthing Beth, you killed her daughter you ignorant fools. Ye, that includes the island people too! Nobody believes you have any integrity you idiots. We want you to come clean but it seems to be beyond the people of Aruba. Some of the people of Aruba will not be able to do any soul searching, they are way past the point of return of being humane.

    12. Elizabeth on December 27th, 2006 6:16 pm

      Ms. U:

      Isn’t it hilarious how, now, that she has told that lie, she must also tell another. “We were looking at pictures
      of a classroom field trip.” And soon they are mixing the truth with the lies… “We found a body.”

      And again, “We were looking at pictures of a clasroom field trip.”

      Pretty soon she’ll be saying that she knows for sure that Joran is not a psychopath. “He’s never had any problems with the law… and I’ve made sure because we are sporters.
      We get what we want. He’s got his whole life in front of him and he’s so smart. It would be such a waste of a sick, psychotic mind.”

      His parents should be SHOT!!!!!!!

    13. jim rexroat on December 27th, 2006 6:34 pm

      don’t just condem the three boy, take a long look at that
      person, be paulus. he’s just as guilty as the others.

    14. LilPuma on December 27th, 2006 6:39 pm

      11. Allan K. The official Aruban response would be to point to corruption in the US. The difference is that in the US, most citizens would look to the media for more information if corruption or incompetence were uncovered. Aruba’s citizens protested the media; they weren’t concerned about it; didn’t want it reported. Then they spread rumors about Natalee and Beth in order to rationalize their lack of concern for the real problem or the loss and pain caused. Another typical response from Aruba is “what about O.J.?” I take this to mean that many many Arubans think Joran got away with murder.

    15. Elizabeth on December 27th, 2006 6:46 pm

      About the report: Blah, Blah, Blah efficiency of the integrity????

      Are you sure they are talking about the same Aruba that we all know and have come to distrust? I wonder how they’d fare if they had real investigators investigating them?

      I don’t give this or any other report credence. That government has had Natalee’s family chasing around like a bunch of chickens while they were hiding the goose that laid the golden egg. I wonder how much it cost to prepare this piece of shit. Don’t we all wish that they would have spent that money actually trying to solve the case?

      If this is what the Dutch think about their dishonest, inefficient government officials, we are in for a very rocky ride… and so are they. Perhaps we should suggest that the Dutch turn the investigation over to the F.B.I. if they are so sure that all they have is a communication problem. Afterall, from the sounds of the report, they should be apologizing as well.

      No one needs excuses, just remedy.

    16. dennisintn on December 27th, 2006 6:54 pm

      #l4, when you have no rational reasons to protest something, you have to go with irrational ones. that’s why we’ve all been standing around with our mouths thinking “surely he didn’t say that”, or “surely, they’re not that stupid or heartless”. but in actuality, they did, and they are.

    17. dennisintn on December 27th, 2006 6:58 pm

      arubaanse, where are you? it’s time for a competent govt. on aruba.

    18. mayan_moons on December 27th, 2006 7:45 pm

      Happy New Years to You too Tibrogargan! (interesting name)

      Thanks for asking, i’m okay. Tootsie isn’t my only dog, her litter mate brother Pedro (tiny & all white) was given to me 3 weeks later when i brought tootsie in for another shot. The lady gave tootsie her shot & told me that she wouldn’t be able to sell one of tootsie’s litter mate’s due to a heart murmur but waited til i brought tootsie in for the shots to ask if i’d like to take him too. She’d remembered that tootsie was going to be my first 6 wk. pup as i’d always adopted older dogs & some of them had to take medication. She felt the murmur was very serious & she wasn’t sure if he would live long ot how much care he needed & was going to put him to sleep if i couldn’t take em. I was thrilled to get that lil cutie (pedro) no matter how long his life lasted. You could feel the murmur easily but after 7 years i never felt it again & he’s 16 now too.

      Sorry thats so long about my pups! What i’m trying to convey is that i took pedro on faith that he would have a good life for ever how long it is. I trusted in God that everything would be alright & i’d be thankful for each day.

      I truely believe that all our efforts & prayers will be answered.

    19. Carpe Noctem on December 27th, 2006 7:49 pm

      Give it up Aruba!

      Your tombstone will read


      An Aruban Government Sanctioned

      Tourist Rape & Murder


      That is what it’ll say

      in the Universal History books…

      if you don’t hold those Van der Scuzzle

      and Kalpoe loads legally responsible.

      Get to the bottom of it. Please remove

      you heads from your southern regions.

      Write your history today! Your ‘TO DO LIST’

      is very long for 2007.


    20. Carpe Noctem on December 27th, 2006 8:05 pm

      LOL Gomer @ #2.

    21. Carpe Noctem on December 27th, 2006 8:16 pm

      “I will do anything for my son.” –Paulus Van Der Sloot


      Paul, most people would do anything for the children!

      Beth did. She couldn’t have made it to Aruba

      faster if she jacked up a plane and flew it there

      her damn self.

      BUT WHEN your child breaks the law.

      When your child kills,

      as yours did Paulus Van der Sloot…

      THEN a line in the sand has been crossed.


      That is the point where a parent has no choice but

      to let the real world take over.


      “Keep your head on a swivel.” -John Madden / NFL

      You’re one of Ammerica’s MOST WANTED -

      I think they just did not

      send you ‘THE MEMO’ yet!!!

      -Season’s Greetings, sucka…

      Hang On To Your Decorative X-Mas
      Balls. Justice For Natalee, the
      check is in the mail.

    22. mayan_moons on December 27th, 2006 9:04 pm

      Well….in order to make a *Master Plan* one must have a Master Mind……lol who writes this stuff?

    23. dennisintn on December 27th, 2006 9:29 pm

      has anyone looked at today? an aruban tv producer supposedly committed suicide by hanging today. pictures in the paper of a very pretty young woman who i would bet a lot of money did not commit suicide by hanging.
      wonder if she had any connections with devries investigation on the island, or maybe investigating natalee
      s case on her own. it’s in the local part of the paper, i don’t do papiamento, so couldn’t get much out of the article. there’s another article about a man found dead on a beach and overdose and 20 kilos of coke are mentioned.

    24. Carpe Noctem on December 27th, 2006 10:15 pm

      I saw that Dennis! I was thinking the same
      thing — suicide my big toe.

      More like ‘SUEY-CIDE’
      …it has all the signature
      markings of the pig staff – ALE Mafia.

      Keep perfumin it up, Aruba.

      ( that last line was in the
      spirit of Miss-U, right there.)


      A Natalee
      Computer Wallpaper!

      Just right-click and save it to your computer.

      Then open the pic on your PC – right-click
      and select *SET AS DESKTOP BACKGROUND*


    25. linda on December 27th, 2006 10:19 pm

      Dennis..the woman who comited suicide was the tele aruba tv producer..she has nothing to do with this case..not everybody who died in the last two years is connected with this case..maybe have some respect for her and let her rest in please don’t go digging in to her life like you guys always do with people that have totally nothing to do with this..
      And she did hang herself.


      SM:   Hi Linda – very sad about her.   Did you know her? (klaasend)

    26. Allan K on December 27th, 2006 10:25 pm

      What about the woman that got hurt in club-bar in Diaro?

    27. Tazman on December 27th, 2006 10:43 pm

      Well ok, here are the 9 risks:

      1. paulos vandersloot
      2. joran vandersloot
      3. deepak kalpoe
      4. satish kalpoe
      5. anita vandersloot
      6. dennis jacobs
      7. vanstratten
      8. guido
      9. the judge that released the 3 in the beginning

      Now, if they get rid of these nine; like, put them all in prison (separately), take away their rights, shave all of their heads, don’t let anyone know where they are, blame it all on their family members that are looking for them and wait until all their stories match! Then this just might work to solve the effeciency problem of the police force of aruba.

    28. IndyDan on December 27th, 2006 10:44 pm

      Please try to refrain from insulting the legacy of the Keystone Cops by comparing them to the Aruban ALE.

      Dennis – Seems everyone who dies on Hell’s Island committed suicide, afterall there are no Murders. Wonder what would make a pretty young TV producer hang herself on the island of paradise? Maybe she was feeling the same stress and pressure Pitull was feeling when he committed suicide.
      Much the same way young tourist girls like Natalee seek out drug dealers and OD never to be seen again.
      Yeah, none of it’s connected, it’s just a bunch of suicidal people with nothing in common.

    29. Minnesota Dad on December 27th, 2006 10:52 pm


      Who says she has nothing to do with this case? Are we to believe your word?

      Nothing personal, but this site in the past has had disinformation posted on here by paid shills of Aruba Tourism (IMO). Your post does not convince me that she wasn’t involved and the fact that you are somewhat defensive about it leads me to believe that she was involved — based on the historical conduct and actions coming out of Crime Island.

      PAULUS IS YOUR PERP! HOW ARE THE DUTCH DOING REGARDING VOIDING THE JUDGEMENTS MADE BY PAULUS’ BLACK ROBED BUDDIES IN ORDER TO GET HIM IN THE CLEAR??? Come on Dutch….we are watching. This case will not be solved until Paulus is pulled back in. Get to work.


    30. mayan_moons on December 27th, 2006 11:36 pm

      Tell it like it is Minnesota Dad! Me think think thou doeth protest to much aye?

    31. yoyo muffintop on December 28th, 2006 12:12 am

      Linda makes an honest post and she’s jumped – wow. Mn,mm,In, you should be ashamed of yourselves for attacking someone that on the surface appears to have committed suicide. Maybe something horrific happened in her life to cause her to do this? And insinuating that only “ugly” people commit suicide, IndyDan, might be something you might want to take back.


      SM:   Yoyo – you are twisting other posters words.   (klaasend)

    32. nychic on December 28th, 2006 12:17 am


      You forgot our good friend “Freddy”
      Freddy Knows Everything -
      And What A Slimy Looking Creature Freddy Is -

      Hey Anita – Your Camera Is At Freddy’s House
      Remember – Dickpick and Shithead said they took it over
      to Freddy’s house ! Wonder what else they hid at Freddy’s ?

    33. mayan_moons on December 28th, 2006 12:42 am

      I never said anything about ugly people??

    34. mayan_moons on December 28th, 2006 12:46 am

      No one’s attacking this woman.

    35. Minnesota Dad on December 28th, 2006 12:50 am


      What makes Linda’s post honest???

      I don’t know what her agenda is here at SM.

      I was just pointing out that based on “everyone lies” (thank you Nadira) in Aruba that Linda is a liar until proven differently.

      Her post is not honest. Her post may be her interpretation of the facts…which could be a completely incorrect interpretation.

      PAULUS IS YOUR PERP!!! Let’s go Dutch….you just trying to run the two year clock out like Aruban Law Enforcement? Too painful to bring forward the truth??? Do your jobs. md

    36. mayan_moons on December 28th, 2006 12:51 am

      whoa mychic! can’t ever forget that Freddy AKA Locoman Pimp(ple)! When the re/arrests went down i didn’t learn Freddy was arrested with the brothers til weeks later due to Katrina.

    37. Molly on December 28th, 2006 1:11 am

      I agree Minn. Dad. Maybe Mr. DeVries would like to comment on the pretty lady’s suicide. Hopefully, he reads the news out of Aruba.

      Ya, Indy Dan, there are a lot of suicides per capita on Aruba. The lady should have taken a plane out of there and gone some place to clear her head. I doubt that she was given that opportunity.

      And the stink goes on……..

      Molly (in Houston)

    38. nychic on December 28th, 2006 1:54 am

      I Recall That Linda Also Posted a
      Very Detailed Opinion About Several
      Other Suicides In Aruba That Have Been
      Discussed Here – Particularly The Guy
      Found Be-Headed In The Graveyard And
      The Guy Found Dead In A Container Behind
      His Motorcycle Shop -

      So Linda – Can You Give Any Further Details
      About This Woman’s Suicide ?

    39. vicki on December 28th, 2006 6:44 am

      I have a very serious question to YoYo and linda…If Lieruba is such a paradise and ONE HAPPY Island why all the suicides????I mean really , guards just jumping off buildings and Poor Pitbull crucifing[sp]himself and then setting himself on fire after cutting off his hands and head…I just dont understand all of these self inflicted horrors. Now this woman???OH and lets not forget the man who killed himself in the container that was locked on the outside…just to name a few. Integrity!!!Satan has taken over that Evil Island and it is all coming out. Could it be all of these supposed suicides are really[dare I say it] MURDERS?

    40. Dave on December 28th, 2006 8:05 am

      YOYO and Linda have an agenda here and I think us supporters of Natalee can see what they are all about by the posts they make.

    41. Waterboy on December 28th, 2006 8:22 am

      Most people live a quiet life, and don’t want much attention drawn to themselves. A television personality-about such a person I don’t know. I do know that most normal people i.e. Barbara Bush do not want and do not deserve to have their lives and their health analyzed by the public.

      However, when a person hangs himself or herself; all rights to privacy are gone with the wind. Suicide is such a selfish act, and so very hard on the family; and becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy for the survivors, especially for children and grandchildren of a suicide victim. The person committing the suicide increased the likelihood of a surviving family member doing the same. Once a suicide occurs in a family tree, you can find it over and over again; and it never goes away.

      So, respect the dead? Why? They have no respect for themselves. Respect the family-sure, I’ll agree there. They have been hurt enough.

      So, if we speculate, and drag a suicide victim through the dirt. It is not anything that that person did not do to himself or herself?

      Is hanging a normal way for a woman to commit suicide? It is not all that unusual. They don’t want to disfigure themselves, so you very rarely find one shooting themselves in the head. A woman will shoot herself in the heart. Men don’t care.

      Suicide is a permanent solution to an impermanent problem.

    42. MIss-Underestimated on December 28th, 2006 8:32 am

      Seems to me there is a high ratio of suicides on the island. What is so desperate on the island that causes its people to committ suicide?

    43. MIss-Underestimated on December 28th, 2006 8:41 am

      BTW, Aruba, did you ever find out who the “girl” was that Deepak hit with the car? I mean you did have that information on tape in the car the conversation between Joran, Deepak and Satishi, yeah the same conversation where Deepak said to Joran “your own father” remember?

    44. Achilles on December 28th, 2006 8:42 am

      They sure do have a lot of suicides and murders Vicki, for such a small island.Lmao satan has taken over,if that ain`t the truth!

    45. Waterboy on December 28th, 2006 8:46 am

      My brother had a very good friend. They had been friends since they were children. My brother knew his friend very well, even better than he knows me. They sent more time together than with anyone else, even after they both married.

      My brother’s friend came down with lung cancer. You know the routine, chemo, surgery, and then eventually death. When the hope for survival finally vanished, my brother entered his friend’s home while he was gone and took his one firearm. It took him hours to find it, but when he did, he knew he had made the right decision, because he found it under his friend’s pillow-fully loaded.

      As time went on, the dying man’s pastor lead him to Christ, something that would not have happen if my brother had not taken his friend’s gun.

      Death from lung cancer = horrible.
      Death from suicide = much worse.

    46. Melissa on December 28th, 2006 9:48 am

      When I was a counselor in Aruba I had a male client who committed suicide. Reading the article in Diario brought back the enormous sadness I felt at the time. Condolences and prayers to the family.

    47. vicki on December 28th, 2006 10:11 am

      Melissa,#46. Im sorry to hear that. It seems that suicides are very painful for the ppl that are left behind. I do not think this woman killed herself. I believe she was murdered. If she did kill herself than she is open for discussion because she did the worst.

    48. Mohican on December 28th, 2006 10:25 am

      29, 39, 40,

      The minute one starts to believe that the vision of a few -inhibited by impartial judgment- is a true reflection of reality or that the wishful thinking of a clique possesses veracity, one begins to fail to understand correctly the totality of essence, that which is true, because it exists, because it is a fact.

      The reiterative expressed suppositions with respect to Aruba, that it is a rat hole, that its citizens are criminals by nature, that the national pastime revolves around dealing drugs, killing, gambling, and sexual perversion, and that Arubans are desperately entrapped in a society where all is bad except A Man Named Jossy, only serve to solidify the preconceived irrational ideas of a virtual social unit where its members learn to get along with and behave similarly, to conform to the values of such unit.

      So Linda, don’t feel bad. The behavior you find incomprehensible is just a reflection of the most elemental way of human socialization: survival within the group. It’s not about Aruba, because the insults are just meant to reinforce group values. It’s not about Natalee either, because the rules of the group state that if you dissent in any way or form, you have to be insulted as a means to keep maintain you away, even if the elimination tactic reduces the participation of others concerned also about Justice for Natalee, but from a different perspective. The behavior is simply about meeting for social purposes, as a way to keep company, to belong, even if through a screen.

      A free license to express prejudice is one of the most socially disruptive and dangerous forms of rivalry: the Us against You, no matter at what cost. This social posture originated the KKK, the Holocaust, and many other fights for supremacy. What we see here often, is also a vying for victory, this time against Arubans and or Dutch, whichever is convenient, and wondering off the path of “search for justice” is good, as long as those that are collectively perceived as rivals are “morally hurt”. Where will this lead us? I bet extinction by dispersion.


      SM: Please … You just had to reference the KKK & the Holocaust and in effect destroyed your bias argument.

      The actions that take place in Aruba are not necessarily the beliefs of the populace. How could they be, they have no power. The Aruban officials run rough shod over their people every day. Rights? Yea right.

      In the very first days of the Natalee Holloway disappearance, some Aruban commenter’s were upset with the actions of the police for only one reason. That reason was that they knew that an American tourist would get a greater deference in the attention of the ALE and others than if it were an Aruban girl. They was plainly stated from the outset by many in Aruba. That, however, turned out not to be the case.

      The truth was that the Aruban officials were going to hide and cover up all aspects of this case from day one. They thought it would just go away. THEY THOUGHT WRONG.


    49. Frank on December 28th, 2006 10:38 am

      Women do not hang themselves, never heard of one case and not to mention in a semi-public place.

      Also, the “insane and unprofessional” people on Aruba are not qualified to decide what is and what isn’t a suicide.

      Doesn’t mean this is related to Natalee’s case, but no way is it a suicide.

    50. Dave on December 28th, 2006 11:12 am

      LOL nice try Mohican. I needed a good laugh today.

    51. JusticeforNatalee on December 28th, 2006 11:19 am

      Words Words Words

      Aruba, we want ACTION
      in the

    52. JusticeforNatalee on December 28th, 2006 11:23 am

      “…Natalee remained passed out…”

      Sounds like a date-rape drug was given to Natalee and it killed her.

      NO 911 CALLS

    53. Minnesota Dad on December 28th, 2006 11:25 am


      Nice try Paulus. Are you getting tired of me posting here that you are the PERP with regard to this case and decided you needed to bring your arrogance to this board?

      The facts with this case are simple and backed up by many…including Dutch investigators, FBI, and others have watched Aruba slowly destroy itself…

      Aruba covered up a murder.
      Aruba covered up the cover-up
      Aruba failed to search the crime scene (YOUR HOME, PAULUS)
      Aruba failed to deal with evidence (YOUR BLOOD SOAKED MATTRESS, PAULUS)
      Aruba failed to establish a timeline for your actions that night, Paulus
      Aruba failed to get your cell phone data, computers, and other information, Paulus
      Aruba failed to interrogate MANY key witnesses
      Aruba/Curacao judges with clear CONFLICT OF INTEREST protected and insulated you, PAULUS

      So, please, do not come here and try to pontificate your way out of this for you or Aruba. Americans now know that if a crime was committed against them on your island – that they would get no justice.

      Board up your shops Aruba….no one’s coming.

      ….oh, and if I haven’t mentioned in earlier posts. To the Dutch Investigators – WHEN ARE YOU GOING TO VOID ALL JUDGEMENTS MADE TO PROTECT AND INSULATE PAULUS FROM HIS CRIME??? Do your job slackers! md

    54. Mohican on December 28th, 2006 12:01 pm

      48, reply by Red,

      I disagree. The KKK and the Holocaust, even if extreme, are palpable examples of struggle for supremacy. Referring to them as illustrative icons of what prepotency can do is neither indication or prejudice/bias, nor cause for declaring an opinion invalid. If anything, I believe what I wrote served its purpose. The fact that you state that the population of Aruba is not responsible for the criminal act committed against Natalee, contributes to enlighten members that assume that insulting Aruba, its people, Holland, and the Dutch is the procedural way to defend the quest of justice for Natalee Holloway. Your reply serves to emphasize the essential, underlying message of my comment: it is not.

      50, Dave,

      I know for sure that my comment did not give you the much-needed good laugh.

    55. leap on December 28th, 2006 12:18 pm

      Confidential information is leaked to third parties and nobody knows what to do with the information or that the information can be used against you

      And Jossy and BHT and all the other saints and the SM too cant seem to see that those leaks shot their case in the behind. But it did get them on TV. How quickly will any court dispose of Mansurs leaked messages as hearsay and or tainted. A lesson in how to loose a case. Of course the US courts will dump all these “evidence” as hearsay. So BFN and Sm did the most to loose the case. Good show. Thats why retired cops were never prosecutors.


      SM: Dream on …


    56. dennisintn on December 28th, 2006 12:20 pm

      #48, long winded and lttle to actually say.

    57. Linda on December 28th, 2006 12:38 pm

      Hey are you..I hope you had a great xmas..
      I had a great time with Family and friends..
      I didn’t know the woman who comited suicide..I just know the people that worked with her…
      I just don’t know how to react to the other posts…whatever I say is wrong anyways..just don’t think that everybody is being paid or connected with this case..not everybody is least not me..

    58. Miss-Underestimated on December 28th, 2006 12:42 pm


      There just was a case in NY where a woman supposedly hung herself, come to find out, a guy got mad at her because she told him he was making too much noise in the apartment building. He hung her to make it look like a suicide which it was not. I’ll surf and find the link.

    59. Miss-Underestimated on December 28th, 2006 12:44 pm
    60. Kat_Gram on December 28th, 2006 12:46 pm

      The lady that died should just be left alone. She might have family. We do not know the circumstances. It is none of my business whatsoever and has nothing to do with anything. Let people be, eh ?

    61. Linda on December 28th, 2006 12:58 pm

      Well thank you Kat Gram!!!

    62. Miss-Underestimated on December 28th, 2006 1:01 pm

      What do you suppose that others feel in the manner that the case was handled? ALE telling Beth to “shut up or else”, what do you suppose that could be interpreted as?

      Or when Dave Holloway was asked, “how much money do you have?” what could that be interpreted as?

      When a family was run thru a maize of lies and deceit at every turn to find their daughter, Natalee? Blaming the victim Natalee and her family. What is that interpeted as?

      Why would the ALE do that to this family? What are they hiding, and why is it that most renowned investigators across the globe think that Joran and Pauless know what happened and are more than likely responsible? How do you interpreted that?

    63. Minnesota Dad on December 28th, 2006 1:13 pm


      I have not implied you are corrupt.

      However, you have identified yourself as being from Aruba. Aruba and many have her people have committed a serious crime against Natalee Holloway.

      Rather than coming clean, Aruba has pumped millions into their tourism budgets and given away free trips from everything like the Price is Right to Regis & Kelly.

      In light of Aruba’s conduct — everything must be looked at as suspect. When you post that this ‘suicide’ has nothing to do with the Natalee Holloway case, either you have inside information or that you are providing disinformation (intentional or unintentional).

      You need to understand that your postings will be looked at with scrutiny based on the conduct and the culture of many on Crime Island. Sorry, but until Aruba deals with Paulus and puts him behind bars — and until people like yourself stand up to put Paulus behind bars — you are an Aruban and will be grouped into one group with all of the other criminals on Aruba.


    64. Mortella on December 28th, 2006 1:31 pm

      Claiming that asking questions about an alleged suicide is “attacking” the victim is yet another symptom of the problem with the cover up mentality in Aruba. There also seems to be a tendency to claim discussing something is worse than the fact being discussed.

      And, yes, Mohican, comparing a group of posters on a blog to the Holocaust/KKK is hyperbole in the extreme. The difference in actions and words also seems elusive to you. But many Europeans just can’t resist that Hitler analogy and literally apply it to any and everything. It is not nearly so popular in this country for we think it just plain silly to equate those supporting and promoting a consumer-based boycott with genocide.

      There are no “rules” and there is not the group-think that you imply and each one is free to state their opinion. I see Linda’s has not been edited nor deleted in any way nor has yours.

      Because people do not agree with you does not mean they are some how controlled or their responses contrived. I only means they think you are full of it and not buying what you are trying to sell. You are taking yourself far too seriously.

      And as for Linda asking that we show some respect, I would have to say I have seen far more disrespect shown for the dead in the grotesque, morbid photographs of the Aruban newspapers, including one of this poor woman wrapped in a blanket still hanging! There is your disrespect! Also see full page spread with several photos of the corpse on the beach. Morbid curiosity to sell papers and how disrespectful is that!

      Very rare is the female who commits suicide by hanging and that fact alone makes this stand out and calls for closer scrutiny. No one is attacking the victim, unlike Aruban Officials have done to Natalee Holloway and her mother. We are merely asking if this could be other than suicide because of the almost unheard of method.

      Mohican, you seem to be describing more what Arubans have done to Natalee and her family than this group. Thank you for explaining it because I never could understand the eagerness of Aruban officials to vilify the victim, Natalee, in this manner and the eagerness of most other Arubans to so eagerly accept as fact all their lies and disinformation. You have just cleared up that mindset for me greatly.

    65. Mortella on December 28th, 2006 1:41 pm

      Who said this woman’s suicide had anything to do with Natalee Holloway? All manner of crimes, be they suicide or murder or whatever, are discussed on this blog. Maybe some need to look around at a few other topics once in a while if they think all that is posted here is about Natalee Holloway.

      If one wants privacy, one should not select such a public and glaring method for suicide but one that would be less sensational about it. It almost seems a cry for publicity to select a method literally unheard of by females and to do so on the front porch.

      Suicide is a crime in most places and if one does the crime, one can expect it to be discussed.

      Does anyone have anything like suicide rate stats for One UnHappy Island? They have to be astronomical!! In the year 2005 alone there are too many deaths of very young people to count. Are these also suicides? AIDS related? Auto accidents, what? Why do so many young people die in a place that bills itself as Paradise? If we are asked to spend our time and money in a location, we have the right to understand the dangers that exist there.

    66. Miss-Underestimated on December 28th, 2006 1:53 pm

      The events with Pitbull’s alledged suicide draws scrunity to the claims by the ALE, (not mention the Natalee Holloway case) how can anyone trust what the ALE says?

      So when certain events come up as with this poor womans suicide, if indeed it was suicide, questions come up to again, as to the INTERGRITY of the Aruban LE.

      This is a serious question, along with Mortella I am asking if anyone has the stats for suicide in Aruba?

    67. dennisintn on December 28th, 2006 1:57 pm

      knowing from the last l8 months how hard it is to report a crime on the vile isle, even as many as we know about, i’d better there are at least twice as many that we never will hear about.

    68. Dave on December 28th, 2006 1:58 pm

      Linda, what really cracks me up is the fact you come here sticking your nose up Klaasends {{edit}}, as if that will give you some credibility. LOL. If you really want to help the family of Natalee then stand up to those involved on your “Happy Island” Stop the BS.


      SM: Linda has a right to her opinion and comments, At least she has the gumption to post here and put up with the good & the bad. Let’s give her credit as the real question is … where are the rest of the Aruban posters who have an opinion against what has transpired in their country?


    69. mayan_moons on December 28th, 2006 2:01 pm

      I just love it when someone from or connected to Aruba comes to this board & says its not about Natalee for us when we call it like we see it drawing from the last almost two years of being lied to and given the runarround by the Aruban Government.

      Mohican talking about us not really caring about Natalee and that we’re just here maintaining human socialization survival of a group is the best one yet and describes to a tee the mentality of Aruba. The biggest kicker of all is when the schill’s berate us for not thinking of Natalee and giving a false impression that they do care about what happened to her.

      You’re NOT fooling anyone but yourselves!

    70. Carpe Noctem on December 28th, 2006 2:07 pm

      #48 Is either Pualu-azz or that friggin’ bonehead -winky doo- of a poptart from DOWN-UNDAAAAA. (and I wish he’d STAYYYY THERE!)

      I love Australia, I just think he’s a twit!

      These dudes have stuffed their brains so full with their

      Funk & Wagnalls, that they dropped their common sense

      out all over the sidewalk like falling marbles.

      P.S. The only time RACISM has E-V-E-R been brought
      up in the Natalee Holloway case — it has been by
      putrid, disgusting, hate monger filth the
      likes of the the Van derapist sloot CLAN and
      the Wever carnivores.

      They preach, preach, and preach some more
      about not being racists…

      — yet THEY ARE A-B-S-O-L-U-T-E-L-Y what
      they profess to loathe so much!

      When you plot what THEY SAY, and match it up
      with WHAT THEY DO — It does not compute!

      They are quite comical to listen
      to and watch really, that is if
      you are not one of the unfortunate souls who’s
      unlucky enough to wind up on the business end
      of one of those sorry sacks of
      yak dung.

      …but even in ugly things, one can find beauty!

      I find it beautiful that no matter how much money
      you have… let’s take the Guido Wever family or
      the Van der Rapists for instance – no matta how
      *m*u*s*h money u gawwwwwt!!! — no matter HOW MANY
      BIG MONEY LAWYERS you can fetch — it still will
      not buy you grace, dignity, and class. ( sp? klaas ):)


      I have a beautiful long haired Chihuahua that
      has more dignity, grace, and class than the
      people I mentioned above.

      She was born with it,
      she uses it by instinct,
      it is free and costs nothing.

      –other than the whiffin’ that ass thing,
      she’s all ‘Dafodils.’–

      A real keeper, MAW!


    71. vicki on December 28th, 2006 2:31 pm

      Mortella, so very well put and precise. I wish I had your gift. BOO HOO Arubans….dont pick on us..well you know what you all started this. You “GOOD” ppl on Satans Island need to take your Island back. When stupid Odeber told Beth to shut up and he wished this would all go away, he made us mad. How dare he! and did any arubans stick up for Natalee’s MOM? Heck no. You all wished she would go away too.[not you Linda or arubaneese]It was about the ALMIGHTY DOLLAR. We have every right to question what goes on anywhere we spend our vacations or money and since Natalee you can bet your bottom dollar we will.

    72. Molly on December 28th, 2006 2:47 pm

      Carpe, I always recognize one of your posts way before I get down to the bottom because you are so creative with words and often very funny. “Winky doo of a poptart” Some people love poptarts, LOL.

      molly (in Houston)

    73. Molly on December 28th, 2006 2:54 pm

      45 Waterboy, Thank God for your story. And Praise the Lord that your friend met Jesus before passing. Suicide is so sad.

      I can’t bring myself to believe that the tv woman committed suicide on her front porch. Ridiculous. No one does that. Such a public spectacle.

      Molly (in Houston)

    74. mayan_moons on December 28th, 2006 2:55 pm

      Hey Carpe!

      Did you get the email i sent ya back regarding my outline of a still in Video 1?

    75. Carpe Noctem on December 28th, 2006 3:21 pm

      “I’m READY FOR MY CLOSE-UP Mr. de Vries!!!” ( DeMille )



      Where in the hell was Joran on
      the day the ROCKS ARUBAY CHI 510
      videos were layed to tape? Specifically,
      number 38.

      Joran was supposedly in jail… but I strongly believe
      with all my heart & soul that he is the passenger in
      the grey car pic above! That would mean he
      was temporarily let out of jail to
      be in this grey car!!!

      * That would SUCK. I am sure the security guards
      had dry cleaning to do – WHY COULDN’T THEY BE
      LET OUT on a little weekend furlough too??? Hmmm?

      Yes, the same car video we keep
      combing over — The one seen exiting
      the ROCKS SITE between 1 and
      30 seconds
      on ARUBAY
      - CHI #38.

      NOW — If he was temporarily let out…

      LET OUT TO DO W-H-A-T? WHY???

      Why was he at this site
      that looks like it may have
      had to do with the
      of Natalee Ann?

      (imo – w/o a doubt it is him)

      He can not be in two different places
      at one time! NOT EVEN JORAN could pull
      that off – even with his psychotic
      multiple personalities.


    76. Carpe Noctem on December 28th, 2006 3:30 pm
    77. Miss-Underestimated on December 28th, 2006 3:48 pm

      I heard a new movie will be released soon

      “The Devil wears K-Swiss”

    78. Miss-Underestimated on December 28th, 2006 3:49 pm

      LOL Carpe

    79. JusticeforNatalee on December 28th, 2006 3:52 pm

      Lake Erie Princess posted a great image inside:

      It showed a small plane towing a “Boycott Aruba” banner.

      Would love to see THAT at the Jersey shore!

      Hmmm–might be a good idea to keep in mind.
      Maybe our collective efforts could make it happen.

      Let’s all hope that before summer there is some MOVEMENT in Natalee’s case.

      What do I mean by MOVEMENT?

      Well, for starters, Karin Janssen could get off that medium-sized DUFF squeezed into a designer small and CHARGE THE SUSPECTS AND ACCOMPLICES.

      Dompig admitted there is enough evidence to put J2K in JAIL for

      Let’s go, Karin Janssen. Uphold the LAW. That’s what LAWyers, especially prosecutors, do.


    80. mayan_moons on December 28th, 2006 4:11 pm


      Great Post and you articulated very well some of our many concerns & questions. All fair questions & comments but you will never see Aruba or those connected to it address any of these concerns.

    81. elisabeth on December 28th, 2006 4:20 pm

      Although irrelevant to the real issue some facts: suicide rates vary greatly. 1/100.000 woman hang themself.
      Finland has one of the highest rates of suicide mortality in the world. While the suicide rate per 100 000 mean population was 27.2 (males and females together) in the year 1995, it was 14.2 (1996) in Sweden, 12.6 (1995) in Norway and 10.1 (1995) in Iceland. When compared with other European countries, the suicide rate was 7.5 (1994) in Great Britain, 20.8 (1994) in France and 9.8 (1995) in the Netherlands. Respectively, the rates for suicides were 16.7 (1994) in Japan, 13.5 (1995) in Canada, and 11.9 (1995) in the USA (Statistics Finland 1999a

    82. Linda on December 28th, 2006 4:26 pm

      Mortella..We can show respect for the deceased people..because Diario has no respect for nobody’s privacy doenst mean we have to be the same..
      And Dave..I just like Klaasend..I have been posting here for a long time and I just like to know how Klaasend is doing??..It has nothing to with suck up or with whatever you meant..Just respect for somebody who devotes her time on helping to find answers for Beth..
      So what do you do to help find Natalee.??.at least I spread the word here if I hear some corrupt thing going on..or if I have info that may help this case..
      Anyway you have a good day Dave..and find a way to help Natalee instead of bashing Aruban People..I’m dutch by the way!!!

    83. Carpe Noctem on December 28th, 2006 4:32 pm

      That little ALE Muppet riding the trikey cracks

      me up *everytime* I see it… LOL


      Grey 4 DOOR Car Occupants photo juxtaposed

      with known shots of J Sloot

      in his sunglasses …and the way

      he looked roughly around that

      same time period.

      ARUBAY CHI 38 – 1 to 30 secs t


      mm, email heading your way soon!

    84. leeb on December 28th, 2006 4:36 pm

      Like you dreamed the NY case would get the answers you decided are the facts – with mansurs “leaks” that is.

      Confidential information is leaked to third parties and nobody knows what to do with the information or that the information can be used against you

      And Jossy and BHT and all the other saints and the SM too cant seem to see that those leaks shot their case in the behind. But it did get them on TV. How quickly will any court dispose of Mansurs leaked messages as hearsay and or tainted. A lesson in how to loose a case. Of course the US courts will dump all these “evidence” as hearsay. So BFN and Sm did the most to loose the case. Good show. Thats why retired cops were never prosecutors.


      SM: Dream on …


    85. mayan_moons on December 28th, 2006 4:54 pm

      lol at go to hell Paules!

    86. Mortella on December 28th, 2006 5:03 pm

      If I were to be murdered and it made to appear suicide as is so often the case, I would for certain and sure want someone to question it and try to find out the truth of the matter.

      If Mortella is ever found hanged on her front porch and even if LE rules it suicide, please do everything within your power to ascertain for a fact that it is.

      Forget my privacy and go for my justice! We know the suicide rate is far, far too high on this small island for the small number of people there. After the Pitbull case being originally called a suicide, I no longer trust any LE that could say a person with their hands nailed to boards committed suicide.

      Sorry, but no cred in the suicide department.

      And it was stats for Aruba I was hoping to find, not the rest of the world. We have seen at least half a dozen wash up on the beach or be on the beach allegedly from suicide by OD. What a strange place to go to indulge in large quantities of illegal substance! Almost as strange as the young security guards both jumping off separate high rises within three weeks of each other.

      More to an Aruban suicide than meets the eye sometimes. As for respect, I try to treat others as I would want to be treated myself and I would for sure want something this irregular investigated fully.

    87. Mortella on December 28th, 2006 5:06 pm

      Blaming the media, the victim, the victim’s family for law enforcement’s failure to conduct anything close to a legitimate investigation in the disappearance of Natalee is just about the most lame thing I have ever heard.

      If it were true that others had the power to derail an investigation, all that would say is that LE is weak and lacks any sort of standards or professionalism. LE deals with the scrutiny of the media in this country each and every day and I have yet to hear one whine like a little girl about it causing them not to do their job.

      They wouldn’t have a job if they did for one thing. Nor would they deserve to.

      But when just looking for an excuse as is the case with ALE, one is about as good as another.

    88. mayan_moons on December 28th, 2006 5:26 pm

      Got it Carpe!

    89. Carpe Noctem on December 28th, 2006 5:53 pm

      Yes, but you know what leeb? Retired cops
      know the difference between the word ‘loose’
      and ‘lose’ – and the fact that they have two
      totally different meanings.

      Normally, I never point out flaws in other people’s
      posts… because I make slip-ups too! (quite a bit,
      I’m afraid to admit.)

      …but you seem to be a flaming lunch bag, so that may
      make things okay?

      I figure Klaas or Red will “SMACK Button” my a$$.
      if this one is over the top.

      Justice for Natalee,
      to ya dweeb!

      It’s comin’ to a theater
      near you.

      We know you HATE DOT –

      but DAT is de TRUTHHHH!


    90. Elizabeth on December 28th, 2006 6:21 pm

      #84 Leeb:

      I can’t believe that you could refer to this crime as a
      lesson on how to loose a case. There has never been a case
      to loose. In fact, to this point, according to Aruban
      authorities, there is not even proof that a crime has been

      You remind me of the way that Beth was treated in Aruba.
      She was told not to interfere and was kept completely out
      of the loop by Karin Jansen as well as others. She wasn’t
      treated as a victim of a crime or as a parent of a missing
      child. She and her family were all treated as if they were
      unwelcomed outsiders. The police and investigators, as
      well as the prosecutor, hoped that she would simply walk
      away perplexed, confused and without hope… never to
      return again.

      Well, that didn’t happen and it won’t happen. This is not
      a case that you can win or lose. This is case of a young
      woman that was murdered on an island that would rather
      protect their own than to be concerned for the safety of
      others. An island that is more concerned with appearances
      than reality. All we ever wanted was to know the truth
      about what happened to Natalee. We want the same as any
      other family wants, answers.

      There is nothing left to lose. None of us really care
      what you or what the Arubans think of us. All we can hope
      for at this point is justice for our Natalee.

      I wish that people could understand that IF the pressure
      had not been kept on the Aruban authorities to do something
      about the loss of this child, nothing would have been
      done. The family has not leaked anything. The family has
      done nothing to railroad this investigation, one way or the
      other. If anything, the family has been helpful to their
      investigation and blaming them is just one more excuse for the inept way that they operate their dirty, corrupt island.

      We will never give up, so if you are asking that we stop, sorry no can do.

    91. Tibrogargan on December 28th, 2006 7:01 pm

      #18 m_m Your story of little Pedro proves what love and faith can achieve. The same love and faith all of us have that follow SM in their quest for truth and justice for Natalee and her family. I don’t really care who harmed Natalee as long as they and their protectors are rounded up and treated as the perverted mongrels that they are. In all the pictures of that island I have never seen anything that would encourage me to visit there. It looks to be a desolate and uncared for piece of rubble in the middle of the ocean.
      My nick is the name of a mountain close to where I lived for 20 years before returning to my home state further south.
      Thank you to all the clever monkeys who give so much of their time and talents to further this quest

    92. Carpe Noctem on December 28th, 2006 7:14 pm

      Go Elizabeth! Sic ‘em. ;-)

      New Bombshell Find from Arubay
      Chi Video # 38 – May Totally Have
      Everyone Talking Around the Water
      Cooler Tomorrow Morning!!!

      Arubay pics broken down in to
      frames and enhanced images
      in my PB Slideshow.


    93. JusticeforNatalee on December 28th, 2006 7:15 pm



    94. msmarple on December 28th, 2006 8:12 pm

      Alan K – Can you tell more about the “lady who was injured in a bar” ?? Think I missed that one.

      Linda – Can you tell more about “Baby D”, the infant child last name Dijkhoff? Has a man, apparently the father, been charged, and if so, what is the charge?

      Re. our “concern” about suicides on Aruba – On the Murder & Crime thread, we have an article to the effect that The Netherlands has requested DNA and other evidence from suicides be sent to Holland for testing, because (surprise!) not all are believed to have been suicides … and then there was the ship passenger on died on board; in Aruba, it was deemed natural causes, but when the fellow was returned to his home, another autopsy revealed that he was strangled and there were visible injuries on his body!

      So no, not everything pertains to the Natalee Holloway case, but a lot pertains to manipulation of murder statistics, and that begs the question WHY ???? and also provides insight as to why Natalee’s case was “handled” the way it was.

    95. Maggie on December 28th, 2006 8:23 pm

      What helps to lose(loose? lol) cases if when the police investigating are just as dirty or dirtier than the ones who commit the crimes. I’m still outraged by the comment by Dennis Jacobs when he came to ask about his missing daughter and Dave was told to go to CnC and have a beer, she will turn up, but watch his drink, they might put something in it. 3 days after Natalee was missing and he came to Aruba, 2 of 3 police stations knew nothing about Natalee. Precious time in a missing person case. Days of letting 2 guards sit in jail , when Jacobs knew 2 days after Natalee was missing and he watched the H.I. tape that Natalee never returned to Holiday Inn.

      People are angry due to the lack of people in Aruba who have stood up for an American tourist in Aruba, what was done to her May 2005 and how she’s been smeared since that night knowing she can’t defend herself. It has nothing to do with a certain race. All one has to do is look at the outrageous behaviour of the 3 suspects and the father that started even before it was public she was missing to know, they know what happened to Natalee. You don’t need liar’s logic when you are innocent. None have stood up to the govt or police and demanded the truth. Why should anyone want to be the next family to go through what Natalee and her family went through? Could someone tell us why the main suspect had his hard drive cleaned with no back up to save anything and why he had his picture photo shopped in one with Natalee from when she was in Alabama. I’m stunned at people who pretend the behaviour of these people is the norm. As for the KKK or the Holocaust save the propaganda for another time. It’s no different then the remark about Natalee and slaves and Hitler.

      Natalee didn’t evaporate, fly away, run away, or die and bury herself. Noone has seen her since she left CnC’s with Deepak, Satish and Joran. That says it all to me.

    96. Tibrogargan on December 28th, 2006 8:41 pm

      I have to say that I always enjoy the posts by Linda and Arubanese as it shows that some people from there have minds of their own and can see through all the cover-ups and lies, not like the majority of the population who appear to have been brainwashed into a stupor. Also I have seen the photos of the so-called party boys who all look to me as though they come from the reject pile of a Frankenstein assembly line.
      Happy New Year to all and a safe, healthy and peaceful 2007 ahead. Peace and comfort to Natalee’s family and friends.

    97. linda on December 28th, 2006 9:20 pm

      ms marple..that asshole only got 9 years jailtime..he really just killed his son..because he was crying to much..just hit him in the these situations I really want your system..death sentence..but we have to do it with the stupid dutch law system..9 years and probably out in 5 for good behavior..just makes me sick..

    98. Elizabeth on December 28th, 2006 9:46 pm


      You bet it does. We all know from viewing the video and reviewing the pictures at the California Lighthouse that
      the Police found a body, alright. In fact, they found
      more than one… they found a covey of bodies.

      Isn’t it odd that Joran, who is supposed to be sitting in a
      jail is in the grey sedan at the scene of the crime at the
      lighthouse? Not only is he there, but the ALE are there as
      well. They knew what happened to Natalee and they knew that
      there were other victims, too. So why did they lie? Why
      did they hide it from everyone, including the citizens of

      Remember the report that a body had been found? Why did things, so rapidly, change from a search to a cover? Who
      are the other victims that would make it necessary for such
      a secret? But, even more important, why haven’t the Aruban
      people caught on to the murdering that has been plaguing
      their island for a very long time? For God’s sake, when
      are the people of Aruba going to wake up?

      And now, Holland, are they going to let themselves be led
      around by the nose to look at this case only through the
      eyes of those that are either guilty of committing these
      murders or guilty of covering them up? Granted, the fact
      that the Dutch are looking into those cases that are deemed
      by ALE to be suicides is encouraging. But the truth of the
      matter is that the Dutch only know as much as the Aruban
      authorities are willing to tell.

      What is going on with the letters to the queen? Is there
      anything else that we can do? What if we got a petition
      going? Is there any way of allowing someone to go speak
      to the queen? Perhaps, with the pictures?

      #95 Maggie:

      Nice post as always! I wonder if all that talk about Beth
      being a nazi and having slaves was just one more way of
      causing an alliance between the perps? Or, perhaps, they
      wanted to alienate those involved in the cover-up from
      Natalee’s family? You know, make it easier to cause her
      pain by painting her as the enemy. The Dutch are not fond
      of Nazis and the Arubans are not fond of people who have
      slaves. And remember the “missing” poster? What kind of
      message did that send to the people of Aruba? I know it
      must sound rash; but, remember, this is just a very small
      island of people that are spoon-fed whatever the authorities
      want them to believe…. and it is obvious that they don’t
      want them be believe that Aruba is a part of an organization
      that not only lies to them; but, also, kills young women.

    99. mayan_moons on December 28th, 2006 9:54 pm

      Happy New Years to You too Tibrogragan!~

    100. msmarple on December 28th, 2006 10:04 pm

      Linda – Thanks for responding to my question. I am going to post your reply on the Murder & Crime thread. (We had not been able to find a disposition of that case.)

    101. linda on December 28th, 2006 10:28 pm

      Allright Ms marple..I will find out exactly what happened..If I’ll hear something new I will let you know…

    102. para2legal on December 28th, 2006 10:34 pm

      One of my best friend’s son hung himself a few years ago. Suffice it to say the family will never be the same. Stats are correct that females rarely do this, but it does happen. How very, very sad it is.
      We don’t know that this young lady’s death had anything to do with Natalee’s demise. For all we know in this moment of time she could have broken up with a boyfriend, had family problems on top of that, etc. We just don’t know.
      What we do know is that Natalee has been missing for almost 19 months and nothing has been done other than investigations on top of investigations that have yielded nothing more than more pile of refuse.
      Until the ones in power are removed, NOTHING will happen. Aruba is a very corrupt island. They don’t think like we do (right Arlene?), and don’t have to as long as they are empowered with tourist money.
      Show them we won’t take their crap…enough is enough…
      NO MORE BS.

    103. mayan_moons on December 28th, 2006 11:27 pm

      Hey para2legal

      One of your bestfriends son? Sorry to hear of that, one of my nephews tried to kill himself with a 38 pistol under his chin several years ago. He lived and is doing okay in his life now.

      No Way would i or anyone here attack this young woman, just the opposite, we question if thats what really happened to her. The fact she worked in tv production & Peter de Vries has been investigating on the island makes it a reasonable possibility there could be a connection.

    104. Carpe Noctem on December 29th, 2006 12:29 am

      Here are more -


      In IE just right-click and
      select SET AS BACKGROUND. done.

      Also, you can right-click and
      save it to your computer.

      Then open the pic on your PC – right-click
      and select *SET AS DESKTOP BACKGROUND*


      We love Natalee.
      We Stand United With Her Family.
      We Will Forget.

      Please, Boycott Aruba.

    105. Carpe Noctem on December 29th, 2006 12:31 am


    106. yoyo muffintop on December 29th, 2006 12:45 am

      Where is evryone getting that hanging by a female is rare?
      From the CDC for 2004 in the US:
      6800 total suicides by females
      1350 of those where by hanging. #3 behind gun & poisoning

      1350 out of 6800 – Hardly Rare. Look it up. Sadly, it’s percentage is increasing in the US each year and is #2 in other countries (Australia for one).

    107. Carpe Noctem on December 29th, 2006 1:13 am

      #48, long winded and lttle to actually say.

      yep, that’d be the signature of Paulus! A gas bag
      of an ARUBAN Murder Rape consultant.

      A lot of wind, little substance!

      Dear Paulus,

      Why don’t YOU


      Why don’t you GROW A PAIR you
      demon spawn ferile myrtle

      Get the 800 pound gorilla off
      the sporter’s back.

      It really IS SOOOOO simple. Even a person
      with whiffle ball ‘cocktail shakers’
      like you COULD DO IT!!!

      Just allow a complete and
      unencumbered search
      of the ADDAM’S FAMILY
      RESIDENCE of 19 Montanja.

      —More specifically, the backyard focusing on your
      hasty concrete job of 2005 —

      It’s THAT EASY to make it all go away, Paulus.


    108. mayan_moons on December 29th, 2006 1:19 am

      Those wallpapers of Natalee are beautiful Carpe!

    109. vicki on December 29th, 2006 9:18 am

      Why isnt her house being roped off as in a crime scene? For goodness sake… any evidence is surly messed up by ppl looking and ppl taking pictures???? This is another incident that makes you go hmmmm. Where are the police? Oh, thats right,they are busy working Natalee’s case.How terribly wrong.

    110. Melissa on December 29th, 2006 10:24 am

      Just curious – Poster Linda: Are you the owner of the pancake restaurant next to Valero in Noord?

    111. NM on December 29th, 2006 11:38 am

      Quick post to wish you all a beautiful and Happy New Year.
      May this year bring Natalee home and Justice for Natalee.

    112. linda on December 29th, 2006 12:47 pm

      Melissa..No I’m not..I do Know her..drink my coffee there sometimes..
      Did you live In Aruba??
      Maybe we met before..

    113. mayan_moons on December 29th, 2006 1:18 pm

      Hey vicki!

      Could you post the link showing her house (lady that was hung) wasn’t roped off?


    114. mayan_moons on December 29th, 2006 1:20 pm

      Happy New Year to you too NM!

    115. JusticeforNatalee on December 29th, 2006 1:30 pm

      I see no problem with continuing to write to the queen to
      enlighten her about the problems and ethical issues
      involved with Natalee’s case.

      We just need to remember to be respectful.

      Good idea to spell check and proofread. Makes a better impression, and your letter will be taken more seriously.

    116. Carpe Noctem on December 29th, 2006 2:16 pm

      Happy New Years, MM and NM, and all!

      No, I agree… Justice for Natalee. I also think it
      is time for a new wave of snail mail and/or email on all the cruise lines & the spring break markets. It would
      be wise to get started early to let the air out of Aruba’s
      tires so to speak for any possible spring break money.

      I found a breathtaking new video frame that
      I wanted to share everyone. :) Go ‘Nita, it’s yerrrrr
      berf-day. ha ha ha haaaa


    117. Carpe Noctem on December 29th, 2006 3:02 pm

      Mayan, thanks @ 108.

      Making Nat look beautiful is a pretty easy job, huh?
      She’s pretty easy on the eyes…

      Speaking of eyes, this is the one I have
      on my desktop. I like it… it’s different.

    118. mayan_moons on December 29th, 2006 3:04 pm

      Happy New Years to You CARPE!~

      Wow this year went soooo fast!

    119. mayan_moons on December 29th, 2006 3:07 pm

      hahaha ewww Anita!

    120. mayan_moons on December 29th, 2006 3:19 pm

      Natalee’s beautiful. I say it in the present tense coz her spirit is still alive, the ones who hurt her can’t take that away.

    121. SunWarlock on December 29th, 2006 3:36 pm

      I’m an Aruban and I want justice as much as you do. What I don’t understand is why you folks attack posters like Linda and Arubaanse, and the rest of the Arubans, calling them liars, then say that Jossy Mansur is a saint, the only good person living on this island.
      Pleaaaaase!!!!!! Maybe Linda and Arubaanse can give you more details on the Mansur family.


      SM:  I’ve rarely seen anyone attack Linda or Arubaanse, especially not Arubaanse.   Some may have argued with them regarding a particular subject but most here truly appreciate both of them.   I also don’t believe anyone here has called Jossy a saint.   We are very aware of the problems some of his extended family have had.   (klaasend)

    122. Linda in MD on December 29th, 2006 4:40 pm

      How do Arubans who want justice for Natalee take action on that desire?
      Linda in MD

    123. linda on December 29th, 2006 6:22 pm

      Hi Sunwarlock..
      I don’t care if people attack me..I see it more as a discussion in a strange way..
      I have discussion with my husband..and I still love him..eventough some posters are a little rough with me..but thats okee.
      Mansur..i don’t even want to talk about Klaasend said..everybody knows he has some problems..
      Hi are suck up..hehe..just want to know how you are doing today!!!


      SM:   Hi Linda!   I’m fine and you?   Ready for 2007?   Think I may have to take down my Christmas tree tonight, it’s getting pretty dead..ha ha.   Maybe next year I’ll get a fake tree ;)   (klaasend)

    124. linda on December 29th, 2006 6:35 pm

      hey I’m tree is even worse I think..because its so hot en dry here after one week the tree is totally brown and ugly..
      Fake is not will miss the smell..


      SM:   Yeah, you are probably right about the fake trees..that’s why each year goes by and I don’t get one, lol :)   (klaasend)

    125. Desiree on December 29th, 2006 7:44 pm

      12 Elizabeth
      His parents should be shot !! Interesting to read and to notice the anger and hate of some. Red and Tom are you there?


      SM: I think its called “hyperbole”.

      Kind of like saying … go jump off a cliff.

    126. jfly on April 9th, 2007 5:49 pm

      My Opinions,thoughts and some facts!
      OMG!- is all I could think after a short discussion I had with my mother about jsut soem of what is going on in ARUBA~ who is a native arubian- my family is from aruba and in the early 80′s they moved to the U.S. we have gone back to aruba several times but not in the last 7yrs- we stay updated by reading the local paper(Diario online) I have many family living in aruba aunts,uncles,cousins and an elderly grandmother that lives alone and I FEAR for her SAFETY!!!
      ARUBA- was a SAFE ISLAND
      until Holland gave Aruba over to the arubian people 15 yrs ago.
      Since then Aruba’s government has become corrupt-and not to mention aruba has let any TOM DICK AND HARRY into Aruba!
      LET ME MAKE THIS CLEAR 99% of arubians are nice, friendly,quite AND peaceful-
      how long is Holland going to sit back and watch as they destroy our beautiful home- our beautiful country!!!
      WHAT THE HELL!!!

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