KLM Dutch passenger faces jail time for abusive behavior … “set an example and to clarify the boundaries of good manners in Aruba”


Seems that this Dutch individual will be going to jail. Maybe if the three suspects had done what they did with Natalee Holloway that fateful night after Carlos N’ Charlies on a plane instead of Deepak Kalpoe’s car things might be different.

And now for the classic line of the week:

The OM (District Attorney) asked for this sentence to set an example and to clarify the boundaries of good manners in Aruba.

Would appear that maybe “good manner” might pertain to some other actions that take place on Aruba on a usual basis, dont you District Attorney?

Amigoe: Aggressive KLM passenger faces jail time 


ORANJESTAD – A Dutch tourist who was verbally abusive en route to Aruba aboard an airplane may receive 6 months of jail time. The OM (District Attorney) asked for this sentence to set an example and to clarify the boundaries of good manners in Aruba. The judge called this a “unique case” and will study the case. The decision follows in 2 weeks. 

On June 29 A.J.L. was flying to Aruba with his girlfriend for vacation. About 3 hours before landing he began to act aggressively. The flight crew, passengers, and captain all made statements to the police. L. made numerous sexually suggestive comments towards the crew. He also grabbed several flight attendants preventing them from doing their work. According to the purser on the flight the crew felt threatened. The man was also physically aggressive, punching cabinets with his fist. He yelled and was bothering the other passengers. 

The purser stated that other passengers felt uncomfortable and some even decided to find seats elsewhere aboard the plane. When it became clear the situation might escalate, the captain was warned. He personally came back and decided to issue a written warning to the aggressive man. A letter was placed on L.’s chair telling him to stay seated. L. paid no attention to it. After that the “fasten seatbelts” warning came on. But L. also ignored that, continuing with his threats and bothering the other passengers aboard the plane. Not until 20 minutes before landing did he finally calm down some. 


L.’s girlfriend also made a statement. She said her friend is a “pain patient” (someone with chronic pain) and receives medicine to control this. During the flight he first had a beer, followed by cognac. After his first glass of cognac L. got a stomachache but he still kept drinking. The combination of medicine and alcohol appears to have been a bad mix because L. became frustrated when at some point the flight attendant wouldn’t serve him any more alcohol. 

After the KLM plane landed at Reina Beatrix Airport, L. was taken off first and detained. During the summons the police noticed the passenger smelled of alcohol and slurred his words. During his detention the man again became aggressive. 

The OM is charging L. with violent behavior aboard a plane and disturbing the peace and public safety upon his arrival in Aruba. According to the justice officer L. remained so aggressive, even after being taken off the plane, that other passengers waiting in line at customs had to move aside for him. “The OM on Aruba has never experienced an incident like this before,” the justice minister said. L. was on vacation and has since returned to Holland. “The penalty the OM is asking for should therefore primarily be viewed as a warning to everyone flying to Aruba. Everyone needs to behave themselves aboard an airplane,” said the officer of justice. They’re seeking a jail term of 6 months.

If you liked this post, you may also like these:

  • Aruba, Cruise Ships, and Drugs (Oh my).
  • Amigoe: ‘Joran Van der Sloot possibly released after six years’ for Murder of Stephany Flores (Natalee Holloway)
  • Natalee Holloway; Updates August 2, 2005
  • F.B.I. Investigating Former Rutgers Assistant Whistle Blower Eric Murdock Who Brought Down Coach Mike Rice & AD Pernetti … Accused of Extortion
  • From Aruba Today: Joran Leaves Aruba

  • Comments

    121 Responses to “KLM Dutch passenger faces jail time for abusive behavior … “set an example and to clarify the boundaries of good manners in Aruba””

    1. JusticeforNatalee on October 7th, 2006 10:57 am

      “The OM is charging L. with violent behavior…”

      When is the OM going to charge the perps responsible for violent behavior toward Natalee Holloway?!

    2. robots on October 7th, 2006 11:01 am


      do not go there, you might get killed.And the CORRUPT COPS
      will just cover it up


    3. Amsterdamned on October 7th, 2006 11:17 am

      {{edit}}Â  for another view on the holloway case


      SM:Â   That is a filthy site and I will not allow the link here (klaasend)

    4. Amsterdamned on October 7th, 2006 11:27 am

      Okido klaasend but I don’t think so!!

    5. Carpe Noctem on October 7th, 2006 11:29 am

      Amsterdamned, drink some Drano and cleanse your friggin
      insides out ya PIG.

      Check it out.


      OF AN OPOSSUM!?!?!?



    6. dancinbare on October 7th, 2006 11:37 am

      I have seen that VDS in our area.,Thank you Klass for deleting the trash from the whatever.Yes,it seems that they starting to foolow the law on dutch boys.Dancingbare

    7. Comet on October 7th, 2006 11:55 am

      Can’t start scaring away the Dutch tourists…

      Wouldn’t want people to think KLM is unsafe…

    8. dennisintn on October 7th, 2006 12:06 pm

      a dutch tourist? a klm plane? inappropriate behavior? witness statements from crew and passengers? a.l.e. reports belligerence and the smell of alcohol? no way there’s enough evidence to convict. he’s a dutch passenger, and he will of course sue the govt. and klm, and the people of aruba for denying his god given rights to act like a complete a{{edit}}hole. he’ll probably soak aruba for another 50 thousand florins for his terrible ordeal.

    9. Tazman on October 7th, 2006 12:47 pm

      Paulos will probably defend him.

      Dennis Jacobs will probably ask him “how much money do you have?”

      Maybe Joran, Deepak and Satish will take him for a drive!

    10. Tazman on October 7th, 2006 12:48 pm

      No wait, Joran, Deepak and Satish will take his GIRLFRIEND for a drive!!

    11. david r on October 7th, 2006 1:22 pm

      If Karin Jansen is prosecuting the case, he will probably walk and then recover several thousand dollars in damages from the government.

    12. JusticeforNatalee on October 7th, 2006 1:23 pm


      Michelle reposted Meri’s post.

    13. Tazman on October 7th, 2006 1:39 pm

      Well, he must not be related to the Vandersloots and their gang of perverts!

    14. nelson on October 7th, 2006 2:53 pm

      Hi check this out Jetblue is adding another flight from JFK in December!!! so much for the BOYCOTT!!!


      SM: you just go on believing that little dream. There are no more people going to Aruba. All that is happening is that those that are traveling there are taking cheaper ticket prices. That is all.

      Your tourism has tanked … all one has to look at is the beaches to see it. Please don’t be so desparate to actually try and spin that Aruba’s tourism is gone. Please … its unbecoming.


    15. nelson from NYC on October 7th, 2006 3:19 pm

      Sorry man but Iam someone thats “in” this business so sorry to burst your monkeys bubble, but tourism will be doing a quick turn up, just bit slow right now since there are many upgrades and construction going on. Sorry maybe one day you guys can afford Aruba also, but I guess for now you guys can just go on with your little lives of hating it!! doesn’t hurt anyone just yourselves!!

    16. Amsterdamned on October 7th, 2006 4:08 pm

      15 Yep doesn’t hurt anyone just yourselves. Nobody cares (including Fam van der Sloot)about this style ofd hate, but be carefull and know your limits.

    17. Carpe Noctem on October 7th, 2006 4:17 pm

      Nelson, hate to be a “playa de linda hater” like that little freshly cracked a$$ rapper kanye EAST.


      Confucius say: If Fu skit, wear it… bro bro!

      Where is your P R O O F? Simply logging on to SM with
      your limp ‘MOON UNIT’ in your hand and posting
      that YOU ***THINK*** THINK???

      reconstructive facelift???

      I MEAN, COME ON. Tourism is about the facts
      and figures.

      David Copperfield is holding on LINE 2 for you,
      he pulled a pink rabbit out of his tookus!

      Great cheer&
      Bombini to you nelson, are you related to that
      moron Nelson Oduber?

      Long live the fantasy, baby!



      Since Natalee turned
      are two things I am not
      experiencing over ARUBA at
      the moment.

      You all act like CLASS A WANKSTERS.

      The overly proud an arrogant
      Aruban and Dutch are like something
      straight out of ALICE IN WONDERLAND’S
      MAD TEA PARTY!!!

    18. robots on October 7th, 2006 4:20 pm


    19. Amsterdamned on October 7th, 2006 4:28 pm

      # 17 little baby’s shouldn’t drink alcohol. Go to bed Carpe Noctem

    20. Carpe Noctem on October 7th, 2006 4:28 pm


      It has been roughly 500 days now since
      Natalee was most likely raped and murdered
      by either the lying scumbag VAN DER SLOOTS…
      or like
      Joran said to the A.LE. Deepak raped
      her and something “very bad happened
      to Natalee.”

      Yet they were RELEASED by Ric Smidt?

      Some of the most damning evidence that
      Natalee is no longer with us… Please,
      read carefully the ARUBA POLIS SECRET
      TAPED RECORDINGS of Joran, Dirtpack,
      and Sasquatch. In this tape they talk
      about who buried near the fisherman huts
      and what the POLIS might potentially
      find – if the body is found.

      ARUBA LAW ENFORCEMENT a complete joke!

      The world is not laughing with you, they
      are laughing AT YOU. F. YOU. and

      Justice for Natalee

    21. Carpe Noctem on October 7th, 2006 4:36 pm
    22. Carpe Noctem on October 7th, 2006 4:37 pm
    23. Melissa on October 7th, 2006 5:12 pm

      Is Nelson from NYC (an Arubian) still using his employer Spirit Airlines e mail to post his messages?

    24. Tazman on October 7th, 2006 6:15 pm


      If Natalee’s case had been solved in a timely manner which would mean a lot earlier than 1 year and 5 months, then you wouldn’t have to worry about a boycott. The boycott is in existence because of the crime(s) committed against Natalee and the crime(s) committed in botching up the investigation. No American in their right mind wants to vacation with their hard earned money to a place that they or their loved ones might not come back alive! Americans have the right to go where they want on vacation. And, no new shopping malls, no new hotels, no new pizzaz built on Aruba is going to change anyone’s mind to feel that they are going to be safer vacationing on Aruba. The safety factor will be felt once this case has been solved. And, I mean solved, not dropped or not put in the cold case files. I mean SOLVED.

    25. Allan K on October 7th, 2006 6:20 pm

      Aruba tourism is down and on the decline. Aruba you are not in as the vacation to be. Even if you found some remains now its over for you. Get ready for more crime, plus poverty. Your island is forever cursed. If I was Aruban I would be ashamed to let murdering, raping perverts walk the streets plus be in school. They need to be in jail. What the hell is wrong with you? Have you no decency or concern for your children? You damn morons.

    26. dancinbare on October 7th, 2006 6:43 pm

      amsterdammed,you not a nice person.keep the personal remarks down.if the case had been solved 15 monthes ago,aruba would still have an economy.if the pimps and their overlords studied any history,they would sacrificed a couple to keep going.don’t just boycot,talk about it and boycot some more.there over 20 besides NAH that were raped by jds.How many others by the other pimps.So you destroy innocent ,lives for fun,but you are sick.I am biting my tounge in 3 languages,to be respectful to klass,but I have a long memory.The best you can do is confess.Dancingbare

    27. Maggie on October 7th, 2006 6:44 pm

      ROFL… 6 months. My advice to this guy is golf with the judge more often. Lie to the cops 17 months, obstruct a missing/murder case, drink and gamble underage every night, frame 2 innocent black men, daddy’s friends with the head cop, daddy calls her a body the day after she’s missing. His son is telling everyone all kinds of sexual activity in graphic detail. They get no time and rewarded money. Cops tell people they spike your drinks in the bars or they know people selling drugs to tourists. Give me a break.. Ohhh Barneyyy Fife..we miss you..

    28. nelson from NYC on October 7th, 2006 7:25 pm

      Cheaper tickets to Aruba yeap thats what Jetblue is all about thats why they are packing those flights just got one back to NY and both ways it was FULL!! well when the passengers get there they still have to pay those high prices for their their hotel stay!, so its a win win both ways. And Yes I’am Nelson living in Manhattan and NO not working for Spirit Airlines anymore. Now I’am managing Jetblue from another station.

    29. Carpe Noctem on October 7th, 2006 7:54 pm

      Oh, I’m sure it was!


      You are so believeable with the PROOOF

      you offer to your hysterical claims that

      tourism is just dandy.

      thanks for your non-input nelson!

      you seem to carry on Aruban tradition. lol -J4N-

    30. Carpe Noctem on October 7th, 2006 7:55 pm
    31. Tazman on October 7th, 2006 8:02 pm

      Once a bullshitter always a bullshitter Nelson!

    32. Tazman on October 7th, 2006 8:03 pm

      Nelson, was the flight full of hookers and pimps?

    33. Tazman on October 7th, 2006 8:09 pm

      Let’s hope the flight was full of detectives.

    34. linda on October 7th, 2006 8:21 pm

      Scared Monkeys peeps..You still have to understand even tough you don’t want to see it..that Aruba is doing well. building malls ,hotels etc..flight are fully booked..there are still a lot of people that really do not give a damn about Natalee or how the Ale handled this case..most of the tourist just want to have a nice time.shop..beach and they can do that perfectly here..I’m not one of those denial/ignore persons.I know tourism is less than last year..I own stores in Tourist areas..I talk to tourists everyday..but still for a small island ..and after all this ..Aruba is doing ok..So try to understand other posts from Arubans..Like Nelson..Jet blue is not flying here because they are not gonna make money..and yes there is a lot of(re) construction right now..These are facts..so don’t try to fight it..That Aruba handled this case poorly is no secret..and there are really a lot of things that I agree with you guys..But maybe nice if you give other people a change to say what they want to say..especially when they are right..instead of bashing them..and Carpe you to..If somebody doesnt agree with you..you immediately attack them..with crazy words..Didn’t Tom and Red started this website to DEBATE..or you all just want to agree with one another everyday??

    35. GRETAMAL on October 7th, 2006 8:32 pm

      linda GREAT post . You tell it like it is !! Just got back from the MICHIGAN game. We won 31 – 13. Good game !!!!!

    36. linda on October 7th, 2006 8:39 pm

      Hey Gretamal..And the Michigan game is???…The play offs..Yankees..American Football..Baseball…??haha no idea..My husband is watching some play offs..do really not know which ones tough..

    37. linda on October 7th, 2006 8:51 pm

      By the way..there is a rumor going around..that You guys (Red..Klaasend..Tom)are planning a trip to Aruba..maybe everybody knew this already..anyway if so..then you have to visit me..we can have some coffee at a nice bar…(Not C&C heeh)


      SM:Â   Nope, no trip planned for me Red or Tom that I’m aware of (klaasend)

    38. linda on October 7th, 2006 9:29 pm

      Ok so it was a rumor..but there are more rumors going around these last 15 months in Aruba..

    39. GRETAMAL on October 7th, 2006 9:37 pm

      linda, lol. it is college football. Michigan right now is ranked 6th in the nation. Next week they should move UP !!

    40. GRETAMAL on October 7th, 2006 9:43 pm

      linda, The Detroit Tigers also beat the N.Y. Yankees in the best of 5. They now play Oakland for the A.L. champs. If they win that they will play in the WORLD SERIES !!!!!!!

    41. Carpe Noctem on October 7th, 2006 9:46 pm


      Fair enough, but I will have to dip out with you on that assessment.

      One person’s debate style is another person’s attack. People
      perceive things differently, and to each his/her own!

      Do I let my inner anger and outrage show? Yeah, I ‘VINEGAR’ it up a lot!!! I am OUTRAGED, at the way the Aruban and
      the Dutch THUGS in power treated the Holloway-Twitty families.


      Do I TASTE BLOOD over it? Mmmm hmmmm… Sometimes my eyes
      bulge and veins pop out on my forehead, I can not believe your pathetic excuse for an island could be so disrespectful to the family of a victim. (any victim – any color – any gender – any country )

      I do believe there are good Arubans and Dutch, I do not
      believe there are any in power that have the set of balls to
      do anything about the Holloway case -AT THIS TIME-. Too busy sticking their noses up eachother’s a$$es, playin’ games of footsies, and I ‘ll scratch your back, if you scratch mine. ( cover mine? )

      Ya know what??? PROVE ME WRONG. I want to be proved wrong!

      Are there a couple of people in the entire Dutch-Aruban empire that have TWO FRIGGIN’ SHORT HAIRS TO RUB TOGETHER to get this family SOME ******* JUSTICE?


      Let me roll it down from the top one more time… just
      so we are all on THE SAME PAGE.

      R E C A P -



      Timeline now:

      About 500 DAYS LATER

      Last seen with Joran, Deepak and Satish. All the Bleach
      in Holland will not eat this away! (still)

      They admit something “BAD” happened to Natalee Holloway!

      Joran admits he KNOWS MORE but will not tell us right now.
      ( Current Affair September 2005 )

      Joran tells Aruban LAW UN-EFORCEMENT that Deepak raped
      he!r – goes to show them where she is buried… and some
      CHRIST SAKE… and MOVED THE BODY like that
      damn movie “Weekend At Bernie’s!”

      ( mouth agape – eyes-a-buggin )

      Joran tells family, friends and others,
      including a local business owner,
      on the island that he had sex with her.

      Then he lies & backpeddles.

      Joran goes on to lie a minimum of 22 more times to Polis and others. However, we all in are hearts of hearts know that Joran is effin lying to us, EVEN WHEN
      HE SAYS ” H E L L O ” …

      HE CAN NOT BE TRUSTED – His word is styrofoam?

      Natalee DISAPPEARED – NOT A TRACE OF DNA! (or was
      there evidence sabotaged and destroyed at every turn-
      look more closely, I think this was thoroughly the case. )

      Paulus from day 1 is saying – NO BODY – NO CRIME!

      In the Aruban Polis vehicle recording they are all talking about her dead. They are talking about where she MAY OR MAY NOT BE BURIED and even what she has on her person.


      How can any country with an iota of dignity, or an ounce of self-respect, sit there and say ‘OH WELL, BABES COME AND THEY GO ” Game over, man.


      Am I pissed, and do I want to bring your country to it’s knees LEGALLY. YUP. You fucking bet I do, and I am making more and more friends that want the same thing. You started a war in my eyes. One that I intend to fully participate in against Aruba. It is not a war in the traditional sense – it is A LOUD STATEMENT TO UNACCEPTABLE BEHAVIOR.

      F. ARUBA – AND BOYCOTT THEM IN TO THE BOTTOM OF THE CARIBBEAN. Withhold all money you can from them!!!

      Justice 4 Natalee


      I SAY TO YOU with a heart that is fully loaded.

      LET US GET IT THE F*** ON….

      You really stepped on your collective D*I*C*K*S when
      you screwed over Natalee Ann Holloway!

      The spectacle was a DEBACLE, A DISGRACE, and quite frankly
      I don’t know how dime store jerkoffs the likes of Nelson
      effin Oduber wake up each day and continue to look in the mirror and at your families. You’re as weak as water.

      What a complete pu$$y, and pathetic excuse for a man.


      ( klass, red, tom – if you have to slice that up I understand.I totally respect the fact that it is your board… and if you or the H-T family ever asked me to reel
      it in a bit – I would. However, I just like to callz
      ‘em, as I seez ‘em, and let the chips fall where
      they may. I have had enough of all their lies. thank you )

    42. Carpe Noctem on October 7th, 2006 9:50 pm



    43. Vicki E. on October 7th, 2006 10:02 pm

      Hey everyone. Tiger vs. Yankees. 8-3! What a great day!
      The tigers were the underdogs and surprised everyone!
      What a wonderful day!

    44. linda on October 7th, 2006 10:07 pm

      Carpe Carpe Carpe..relax..you really need a tranquilizer..anyway..if that is a reply to my message..then I really do not get it anymore..I wasn’t talking about Natalee..I was just tryin to say that Aruba is still doing ok after all this..what you just said is nothing new..you have the same old crazy messages all the time..funny tough..I have to admit..

    45. linda on October 7th, 2006 10:08 pm

      Allright Greta (you mean Greta the midget??)thanks for the college Football info..learn something new everyday..

    46. Judy Westmoreland on October 7th, 2006 11:08 pm

      Carpe Noctem…You Rock!!! Tell it like it is!!!!!!!!
      JUSTICE FOR NATALEE!!!!!!!! Wish we could give those murdering, raping, lying trash justice…SOUTHERN STYLE!!!!

    47. Carpe Noctem on October 7th, 2006 11:17 pm


      If we all thought the same… the world & SM
      would be a very boring place, indeed.


      Hey 25 SMACKER-ROONIES to anyone who can
      find the plug or battery pack
      on this dude’s shirt!


      Wowie wow wow wowww. Did he get it
      from a girlfriend? I hope she’s an EX!



    48. Carpe Noctem on October 7th, 2006 11:35 pm



    49. Betty on October 7th, 2006 11:37 pm

      On one of these sights, someone had posted “Is it possible Aruba wants you to think that Natalie is dead, but she really isn’t”. This could be possible that Natalie was sold into the slave market, and only God knows where she is now.
      Just my openion..I guess that I am still holding out hope that Natalie will be found. I pray for this every day!
      Maybe this is what the words..”Something bad has happened” means.

    50. Tazman on October 7th, 2006 11:39 pm


      Good post. However, it goes both ways. We all express ourselves in different “styles”.

    51. para2legal on October 8th, 2006 12:23 am

      How sad indeed that Aruba officials will do nothing more for the Holloway-Twitty family. The island is as schizophrenic as JVDS. Even Stephen King with his great imagination couldn’t have written this story with all the twists, turns and endless corruption at every level. Natalee Ann Holloway was drugged, raped and murdered by the last three people known to be with her.

      We know it, Aruba knows it, and Aruba knows that we know it…and they’re worried about a disruptive passenger on a plane? So let me get this straight – in Aruba you can get away with murder, but you get 6 months in jail for being rowdy on a plane? Are they all smoking the same stuff Willie got busted with??

    52. Carpe Noctem on October 8th, 2006 1:34 am
    53. Carpe Noctem on October 8th, 2006 1:52 am

      Bloody Mattress Info Link


      Jail the gangraping, serial lying,
      cold blooded murdering Kalpoes
      and Van der Rapes. DO IT.

      You could very well end your vacation
      exiting on a bloody mattress like sadly
      some think Natalee unfortunately did.

      BOYCOTT ARUBA in to the dirt.


    54. Carpe Noctem on October 8th, 2006 1:54 am

      It is interesting that the mattress was located
      on a beach down near San Nicolas way.

      discovered 6-5-2005

    55. mayan_moons on October 8th, 2006 2:10 am

      hey para2legal!

      They’re not smokin, more like sniffin glue out of babyfood jar is what they do. Makes it easier to have no personal responsibility, makes it easier to pretend that sons arn’t murderer’s. If ONLY if were just an abberation…..if only it was just one local son, if Only it were just one local twisted family it’d be easier to understand. But no, all the sons target a young girl & with help from the bartenders they are drugging her. When i go in an establishment & order a drink i’m trusting them NOT to slip GHB in it ok. Natalee trusted too and thats were you were counting on……thats what makes aruba lowest of the low.

    56. mayan_moons on October 8th, 2006 2:33 am

      Hey Carpe!

      You do Rock!~

      (lol @ nick’s hair & the kitty)

    57. oxbow on October 8th, 2006 3:29 am

      Mayan….?? Crosby’s boat?

    58. Carpe Noctem on October 8th, 2006 6:31 am
    59. Richard on October 8th, 2006 7:16 am

      Getting back to the KLM flight … isn’t it illuminating that after this guy acts up in this way (and with all the terrorism fears that afflict air travel now, onboard disturbances are the last thing travelers want or need), the first response of the KLM pilot was to issue a WRITTEN WARNING.

      Sounds wimpy to me. You don’t reason with someone behaving like that; you take action. The passengers who are obeying the rules deserve no less.

      And then the guy’s girlfriend tries to explain it away … in my view, if you’re on medication, it’s your responsibility to avoid liquor if you might have a bad reaction. If you don’t, then your behavior is YOUR responsibility.

      Betty (#49), some of us have been saying this (about Natalee being taken off the island) for a long time. And some of us are continuing to think this way. No evidence; no evidence against it either.

      Remember Amy Bradley!

    60. Carpe Noctem on October 8th, 2006 8:16 am

      Linda said:

      what you just said is nothing new.


      Hey Linda,

      You are so correct. That is part of the
      reason this whole thing so sad and frustrating!

      500 DAYS LATER

      all that I touched on IS TRUE, and the pieces
      of ,,,, who killed her are still walking around free.

      If you read the Aruban Secret Polis recordings…

      There’s really no way a person with even
      just a very basic IQ could read all those
      things and come away with the feeling that
      Natalee could still be living.

      …and again, June 2005 – Joran stated Deepak raped,
      killed, and buried her near the fisherman huts.

      Yet they were cut loose to walk free?

      All 3 say something bad happened and she’s dead…

      but they could be let go without finding just

      what each one knows?

      How can anyone defend that?

      It’s total insanity.

      A.L.E. and Aruban Government are completely
      out of their effin MINDS!!! Alice In Wonderland’s
      Mad Tea Party… mad as a March friggin hares!


      Lastly, how can anybody think the economy
      is okay… when you have officials that
      inexplicibly will not even breathe a word
      of the facts and figures. That is so damning
      and totally embarrassing.

      Aruba is a joke!

      the only way. Otherwise, you might as well
      call Mrs. Cleo’s 900 Number to find out
      how your ISLAND economy is doing — or maybe even
      Dilbert with Jet Blue outta the NYC. lol

      – Justice 4 Nat!

    61. GRETAMAL on October 8th, 2006 9:01 am

      Tazman post # 50, I agree. We all DO express ourselves in different styles and ways.

    62. gulf to bay on October 8th, 2006 9:02 am

      Should of stayed home and beat the meat boys. You had other options. If justice isnt served by holland i say we do an eye for any eye pulp fiction style. Payback is near its only fair. Lets do em just like they did natalee holloway. Aruba blows. Or lets do arlene schipper like they did natalee and we will just make her disappear. Of course we wouldnt stoop to there level. But these boys and whomever else is involved should know there is a price to pay for raping and disposing of an american tourist. How dare they should think they should get away with it for free. No way. Are you stupid? I think you are. Watch your back. We need to have john holmes give it to joran with no vaseline. Give joran a taste of his own medicine. Im sick of all of the lying. These people are cowards all of them.

    63. JusticeforNatalee on October 8th, 2006 10:07 am

      So the Dutch passenger is being charged with ABUSIVE behavior and Aruba won’t tolerate BAD MANNERS.

      How’s THIS for abusive behavior and bad manners:

      Three punks take a petite and nice girl in a car. Instead of being gentlemen and taking her back to her hotel (as she requested), they take advantage of her and she is never seen again. They lie to police and her parents but admit that “something bad happened.”

    64. realtruth on October 8th, 2006 10:55 am

      to #34 and #35 – check this web-site and quote from a columnist there:


      “This was never a responsible piece of detective work by the Aruban authorities it was a professional cover up. Contrary to people screaming, “They BOTCHED the investigation,” the facts now show that it was not a mistake at all. This was handled beautifully by a team of people answering to the Dutch government. Once the name, “Van der Sloot” was mentioned, it was all over for Natalee. She never had a chance. It was too bad her last name wasn’t Van der Hollow, she might have gotten a fairer hearing.

      ……..This isn’t stupidity. It is BEYOND stupidity. Or maybe it is a systematic approach to protecting Aruba, the Dutch government’s interests and the Van der Sloot family. This is not an unintelligent series of moves here; this is very calculated.”

      what can you expect – there’s most probably a few people out there with a huge amount of anger at what the aruban and dutch gov’t did to the family of natalee. all these rampage murders we read about in the newspapers are people with intense anger and they eventually snap. so in a time of opportunity when a group of arubans arrive in the states, and when everyone is least expecting it; some individual will take their anger out on other innocent individuals; but in their mind all arubans are scum. aruba created its own grave unless they untangle it quickly.

    65. 10061906 on October 8th, 2006 11:16 am

      Hello: Trying to catch up. Noticed we picked up a couple of new trolls. Poor misguided A$$ holes.
      Had emergency surgery 8 days ago.
      Nine inch incission hurts. Guess what kind? :::::::
      Will take some time to catch up: but not giving up.
      Heard Beth’s interview. What a shame she had to go through that.

    66. Allan K on October 8th, 2006 11:36 am


      Yes you can have your opinion and others have theirs. I strongly believe Aruba’s tourism is going down. There are sites out there that study these things. Most people will not put up with rapes in schools and being publicized, crack houses at free will, rapes and murder of tourists, corrupt law force in charge. The allegations that the police is involved with the raves and sex partys(date rape drug)in which I am inclined to believe because we know them by now. There are many other factors involved that I am not going in to. Alas Aruba is going down for how many years I don’t know. The mindset in Aruba is unlike ours too!

    67. Houston on October 8th, 2006 12:20 pm

      KLM? Someone told me that Air France had bought KLM? Does anyone know the details?

    68. GRETAMAL on October 8th, 2006 12:27 pm

      1906, I hope everything went allright. I will say a prayer for you today. WELCOME BACK !!!!!!!!

    69. GRETAMAL on October 8th, 2006 12:31 pm

      realtruth, I think you may be RIGHT. As soon as the name SLOOT came up it was ALL over. The cover-up was on. Just like in the USA when a name like Kennedy or M. Jackson comes up. SAD VERY SAD !!!!!!!!!!!!!

    70. GRETAMAL on October 8th, 2006 12:42 pm

      nychic, TIGERS WIN !!!!!!!
      I would like to see Detroit play New York in the World Series !!!!

    71. FL on October 8th, 2006 12:57 pm

      @Houston: yes, I know the details. And if you visit their website, you can read it too!

    72. FL on October 8th, 2006 1:02 pm

      @Richard(59): It is difficult to fly a plane when a pilot is knock out :-D

    73. dancinbare on October 8th, 2006 2:27 pm

      Hey 1000619006,I can guess and be wrong.I think it was in the chest region.Remember,Joran is self-confessed liar.In the car the k2′ said if they found,it was 15 years for jvds.HMMMMMMMM.gvc was rumored to some forensic evidence that linked him.if it been deepak,he would be in jail.he isn’t dutch.Klm has not been bought by Air France.dancingbare

    74. Carpe Noctem on October 8th, 2006 3:38 pm

      The cover-up was on. Just like in the USA when a name like Kennedy or M. Jackson comes up. SAD VERY SAD !!!!!!!!!!!!!


      yes greta,

      I see your comparison and understand what you’re are

      kennedy = the drunk

      jackson = the predatory pedophile

      GREAT post!



    75. Carpe Noctem on October 8th, 2006 3:47 pm

      Judy and Mayan… thanks! I think u guys rawk. ;)


      1006, so glad you are back. You’ve done a lot
      of superb work with your online 700+ Aruba Holloway Case
      timeline project. WE CAN’T AFFORD 2 LET U GO JUST YET!

      Best wishes, and a speedy recovery 2 u.




    76. Maggie on October 8th, 2006 4:51 pm

      wb 1006 glad you are ok!

      Paralegal #51 exactly right.. They know Natalee has been dead since the early morning of May 30th. Betty can wait another 50 years, Natalee will still be just as dead as she was the first night she went missing. Joran describing Natalee’s underwear and her personal body parts.. passing out waking up.. lots of graphic sexual descriptions.. Natalee would tell her family afterwards if she lived & what sh*t are they going to find if they find the girl as Joran said. Why would Joran get 15 years if they find her.

      An Internet “troll” is a person who delights in sowing discord on the Internet. He (and it is usually he) tries to start arguments and upset people.

      Trolls see Internet communications services as convenient venues for their bizarre game. For some reason, they don’t “get” that they are hurting real people. To them, other Internet users are not quite human but are a kind of digital abstraction. As a result, they feel no sorrow whatsoever for the pain they inflict. Indeed, the greater the suffering they cause, the greater their ‘achievement’ (as they see it). At the moment, the relative anonymity of the net allows trolls to flourish.

      Trolls are utterly impervious to criticism (constructive or otherwise). You cannot negotiate with them; you cannot cause them to feel shame or compassion; you cannot reason with them. They cannot be made to feel remorse. For some reason, trolls do not feel they are bound by the rules of courtesy or social responsibility.

      Perhaps this sounds inconceivable. You may think, “Surely there is something I can write that will change them.” But a true troll can not be changed by mere words.

      When you try to reason with a troll, he wins. When you insult a troll, he wins. When you scream at a troll, he wins. The only thing that trolls can’t handle is being ignored.

    77. Carpe Noctem on October 8th, 2006 5:57 pm


      I wonder if old JOE T. ever managed to get those
      ‘monkeys’ off Joran-steins back????




    78. GRETAMAL on October 8th, 2006 6:14 pm

      maggie, greta post. That is the reason I never say anything when some people on here call the sloots names. They are trying to hurt real people and inflict pain on them. EXCELLENT POINT !!!!!!!!

    79. Carpe Noctem on October 8th, 2006 6:36 pm

      yep, hurting real people precisely
      the same way Joran, Deepak and Satish
      did Natalee.

      Killing her, and then blowing in a tracked
      cellular call to Paulus Van der Sloot, ARUBA’S
      BEST murder consultant. He could build a franchise.



    80. GRETAMAL on October 8th, 2006 7:01 pm

      No response from me. Like maggie said when you try to reason with one THEY WIN. So if I don’t say anything , “I WIN ” !!!!!!!!!!

    81. Carpe Noctem on October 8th, 2006 7:10 pm
    82. JusticeforNatalee on October 8th, 2006 7:48 pm

      Why would Joran get 15 years if they find her?.

      Why would Joran get 15 years if they find her?

      Why would Joran get 15 years if they find her?

      That says it all.

    83. GRETAMAL on October 8th, 2006 7:57 pm

      justice, You are RIGHT. That says it all. But how does this help us ????????????

    84. linda on October 8th, 2006 8:09 pm

      So I’m a 50/50 Troll..So no response from me either to anyone..So I win??..so Maggie what are you..you set the rules for Trolls..you work for a anti-troll company..duhhh..grow up!!
      Start your own Website

    85. Richard on October 8th, 2006 8:33 pm

      And why would Joran say to the Kalpoes while in the police car, “I’d laugh if they found her alive”? (Quote may not be exact.) Note that he doesn’t say he’d laugh if they found her body.

      I still think it’s possible that he knew she was taken off the island … and that the Aruban police aren’t going to go looking around outside their country, because they can’t.

      An article posted on http://www.defendu.com on Aug. 9, 2001, quotes a Ms. Ann Hagedorn Auerbach as giving a list of ten areas and regions that “have considerable kidnapping activity.”

      No. 3 on her list? “Aruba, an island near Colombia.” Colombia leads the list.

    86. Richard on October 8th, 2006 8:38 pm

      Hope nobody minds if I say here that I don’t see any reason to take after Linda. Most posters here have little or no good feeling for the Aruban government, myself among them … but is anyone blaming Linda for what happened?

      After all, isn’t this thread titled “Good manners”?

      I’d like to focus on what we can do to help the Holloway Twitty family pursue their campaign. Just my idea….

    87. GRETAMAL on October 8th, 2006 8:42 pm

      linda, LOL !!!!!!! How you doing tonight ??? I had a busy week-end. I will be in bed EARLY tonight. I guess I’m getting to old for these wild week-ends!!!!!!!

    88. IndyDan on October 8th, 2006 8:48 pm

      “the only thing trolls can’t handle is being ignored”
      Maggie – that has been my mantra for the past 11 months. trolls aren’t interested in constructive discussion, they are only interested in getting a ‘jolt’ from someone to their ugly post.
      Acknowledgement feeds a trolls purpose – why do we feed them?

    89. Miss-Underestimated on October 8th, 2006 9:05 pm


      Thanks for the Bloody Mattess info

      I wonder what three cars ALE siezed?

      Who would know to pour dog blood on human blood so that human blood could not be detected.

      Or how could they determine in 10 minutes it was not human blood?

      Who is that OLD MAN on the casino tape sitting to Natalee’s left the last nite she was ever seen again?

      My question does anyone know for certain where Paulus was between 12 am and 6 am the last night Natalee was seen?

      Aruba, Dutch Auntilleys whatever you are today.

      First your Natural Bridge, now you economy, what Aruba will you sacrifice next for covering up the Natalee Holloway Case?

    90. Miss-Underestimated on October 8th, 2006 9:12 pm

      Welcome back 1906 I hope you are doing great.
      Looking forward to your posts.

    91. Carpe Noctem on October 8th, 2006 9:29 pm

      IndyDan and Maggie are correct,
      trolls should not be FED HERE! I agree.



      If should find yourself
      slipping from time to time,
      like I do… make sure
      whatever you feed them is laced
      with some of this!


      A little dab, will get rid of a Troll’s
      blood clots.


      LOAD OF IT…

      LUV YAAAAAAAAAA!!!! Good times,

      XOXOXOXO -Carpe

    92. GRETAMAL on October 8th, 2006 9:59 pm

      carpe, Funny you should mention that. I am on warfarin NOW. I take 6 mg everyday. It is a blood thinner. I had a blood clot in my leg. It is called DVT. DEEP Vein Thrombosis.

    93. molly on October 8th, 2006 10:36 pm

      1006: So glad to have you back. Yes, way too many trolls. Gag. Sounds like you didn’t exactly have endoscopic surgery. What a long incision!

      molly (in Houston)

    94. Maggie on October 8th, 2006 10:41 pm

      Linda, I do not consider you a troll. I’ve always enjoyed your posts.

    95. molly on October 8th, 2006 10:42 pm

      Linda, I don’t see how YOU stay safe on a small island with all this mess going on. Aren’t you worried about the drugs and murders that are so close to home? Just wondering.

      molly (in Houston)

    96. Carpe Noctem on October 8th, 2006 10:43 pm

      yes, kel…

      seriously for a few seconds…

      that stuff is can be wicked. when they repackage
      it an sell it at Home Depot and Lowes they call
      it ‘RAT POISON.’

      It’s basically one and the same.

      A Dr. that got a little too liberal with his
      prescriptions of it almost overdosed my
      grandmother on it 5 years ago.

      A little bit will thin your blood. Too much
      and you’ll bleed to death by overdose.

      Signs of OVERDOSE to look for:

      Your whiskers start to twitch,
      and your legs begin to wiggle!!! :p


    97. molly on October 8th, 2006 11:16 pm

      Carpe, Since you are still up. I have been wanting to ask you. Why is it that when I look at your pics that the pixels are so big that I can hardly make out what you are talking about, and yet, other people talk about details in the pics?

      molly (in Houston)

    98. Audrey on October 8th, 2006 11:51 pm

      From an American perspective, Aruba is just one of several potential locations for a beach vacation. One carribean island is just as good as another. We Americans barely know enough geography to care. So, I feel a little uneasy about Aruba, and I just no longer consider it an option. What difference does it make to me or most other travellers? It doesn’t have to be about the boycott. All it takes is the suggestion of unpleasantness, and people just look elsewhere. The publicity here regarding Natalee has made Aruba appear seedy & unappealling at best, and, quite likely, much worse. I would LOVE to see some actual data that suggests Aruba isn’t suffering from this.

    99. Carpe Noctem on October 9th, 2006 12:05 am

      hi molly!

      if you don’t mind –

      if I could ask a couple of questions, it would
      help me be more accurate in my answer to you.

      what operating system are you using?

      right-click over my computer & slect properties
      and jot it down. Operating System and Service
      Pack number if you can find it.


      also, it would help for me to know
      your resolution video settings.


      – 800×600? or 1024×768? –

      The norm these days is about 1024×768 screen res.
      That is what I keep in mind when building many
      of my graphics.

      So, if you’re not tuned to what I am building
      for… you might get some strange results
      when attempting to view some pics.

      If you don’t feel comfortable posting
      that info on the SM front page
      because of privacy concerns, I understand.

      You can send it to my email if ya want, @ Hotmail:




      Hey 10061906

      A quick question for you, sir!



      Justice 4 Natalee, people.

    100. Mike on October 9th, 2006 12:31 am


      if you have a business on aruba and tourism is so great then i would think you would be too busy counting your money to be on here.

    101. nychic on October 9th, 2006 12:35 am

      “All It Takes Is The Suggestion Of Unpleasantness”

      That Is Exactly What More and More Think Of When
      The Word “Aruba” Is Mentioned…

      What A Great Phrase To Describe What Will Ultimately
      Be The Deciding Factor In Many Vacation Plans

      Carpe #41
      Add That Post To Your “Best Of Carpe”

      molly – check out Carpe’s entire set of pics
      (if he will post his photobucket file for you)
      sometimes I take a few steps back to see them better

      kelmal -
      yes, I am VERY AWARE of The Yankees Loss
      sad day in NYC -
      hope you did not lose much on those bets -

    102. linda on October 9th, 2006 7:47 am

      Ohh Mike I’m couting my money..I’m in my office..so I do work and SM together..isn’t that great..what about you??

      And Molly..where do you live..So funny that you really think that I can’t get out of my house..or that I have to be affraid of murderers..I lived In Holland for 20 years and lived in places where you really have to watch out..The reason why I live here is first of all because its so safe..especially for my kids..What do you mean with all those murders?? who ?? I’m sure where you live right now there are more murders and you just live your life right.

      Maggie I’m sorry..was just teasing you a little bit..I just like the word “Troll”..

    103. super dave on October 9th, 2006 9:58 am


    104. momja on October 9th, 2006 10:07 am

      Ok, let me try to understand this, you can get six months in prison in Aruba for being “rude” but nothing for “lying” or “murder”

      Does this make sense?

    105. JusticeforNatalee on October 9th, 2006 10:08 am



    106. molly on October 9th, 2006 10:13 am

      Hi, Linda, I live in NW Houston, TX which is relatively safe compared to other parts of Houston. It seems to me from what I have read on SM that there have been quite a few murders on Aruba in the past year. I think that someone mentioned 6 or 7. The number, as well as the violence involved, seems like a lot per capita. Plus all the public drug dealing is dangerous. I am not comparing Aruba to Houston because Houston has a bazillion people. I lived on Oahu for 1 1/2 years and know the feeling of living on a small island. So I was just wondering how you felt about it. So now I know.

      molly (in Houston)

    107. molly on October 9th, 2006 10:17 am

      Thanks, Carpe & Nychic for your suggestions, etc. I’ll work on all that later tonight. School is out today so I am busy, busy.

      molly (in Houston)

    108. Mortella on October 9th, 2006 11:10 am

      So the live beach cams lie and tourism is up in Aruba. Well, great, Aruba didn’t need us old Americans anyway.

      Nelson, you just really have some dumb friends if they are still paying the high prices. Tell them to check out ShermansTravels.com for deals of 75% OFF on trips to Aruba. Booking Buddy has them as well.

      Gotta keep those rooms full and try to look prosperous even if selling below cost like Royal Caribbean offering cruises for as low as $39 a day all inclusive.

      The new mall is to keep the tourists away from all the crime. See the thread in the forum entitled Murder and Crime in Aruba for their higher murder rate than the U.S. despite their fraudulent claims to the contrary. ALE even admits it now.

      The question is will Aruba take the whole Caribbean basin down with it? Aruba, your neighbors are not happy with you!
      Sleaze Island is just so yesterday! People want a location with a much more healthy lifestyle. Caribbean basin has highest AIDS rate per capita in the world second only to Sub-Saharan Africa per recent meeting of World Council on AIDS. Sad but a fact.

    109. dancinbare on October 9th, 2006 11:53 am

      Carpe,I know what wayfarin can do.My father recently died from a problem with.He would died sooner without,so its a wash.Dancingbare

    110. Miss-Underestimated on October 9th, 2006 12:21 pm

      So lets figure this out.

      If you are rude you get locked up. So like then can Jacobs, Van Der Straaten, Papa Vandersloots, Karin,and Dompig and oh yeah lets not foget Julia, get locked up for being rude to the Twittys and Holloways?

      Oh and how bout this, can the fella that Slapped Natalee Holloway get locked up, I guess that pretty friggin rude.

      But you can’t get locked up for lying to LE or conspiring?

    111. Audrey on October 9th, 2006 5:03 pm

      #108 I know this is digressing from the original topic, but I also wonder whether the NH publicity will affect the entire basin. The whole region has been exposed to media scrutiny, and – whether or not this is true – the image being protrayed is very ugly. I wouldn’t go on a Caribbean cruise if you paid me now.

      The USA has some of the most beautiful white sand beaches in the world. My family is going to the Florida Keys on our next vacation. I can’t think of any reason the Caribbean would be a more desirable location, unless I were 18-20 and looking to hit the bars. Of course, the “Spring Break” crowd is often funded by Mom & Dad, and I’m sure parents are thinking more carefully about the locations they’ll endorse. If nothing else, the NH case has raised awareness about the type of partying that goes on in these locales (at least among those parents who go to bed too early to be familiar with the “Girls Gone Wild” series). Sure, these kids would find a way to be partying anyway, but at least they wouldn’t be doing their 8 AM shots in an unfamiliar foreign country, surrounded by crack houses and eager dealers.

    112. Carpe Noctem on October 9th, 2006 5:21 pm

      Thanks nychic.

      molly, here are the links to
      my graphics Photobucket books.

      Most are still frames pulled
      out of the ARUBAY 510 SERIES
      VIDEOS – Some I’ve made in to

      ***Beware the cam quality was poo to start with!
      It’s pretty hard to get a crystal clear picture
      out of any of these videos to begin with. All
      of us are seeing nasty pixel distortion to a


      If u can use one of these to get Justice 4 Natalee…
      You’ve got my permission to use it already.

      “JUST DO IT” — Dirtpack Kalpoe

      Take it – it’s yours.

      Even if LE CAN’T EVER use a one of them, if
      they help spark off new ideas to help get this
      case back to where it should be… the work was all
      worth it, as far as I’m concerned.


      26 Pages – over 500 graphics



      3 Pages 46 graphics


      3 Pages 46 graphics, maps, Cali. Lighthouse History,
      and an incomplete timeline graphic.


      -Justice 4 Nat

    113. GRETAmal on October 9th, 2006 6:52 pm

      Audrey, I agree. The ONLY reason teens want to go down there is they know they can drink down there. It is time for parents to STOP sending them down there.

    114. GRETAmal on October 9th, 2006 6:58 pm

      carpe: Thanks for the advice!!!!!
      nychic; Yea I lost money on the yankees but made it back taking MICHIGAN. Tigers look good. I would like to see them go all the way. That other New York team also looks good.

    115. nychic on October 10th, 2006 12:42 am

      Klaas posted this translated article from Diario
      in the forum earlier:

      A tourist couple that arrived on Aruba yesterday and that were staying at the Marriott both drowned at Baby Beach after they went snorkeling.

      According to information and some witnesses, they could see that the couple was having problems and jumped into the water to rescue them.

      At the onset, the man was having problems and his female partner went in to assist him, however this turned out to take a turn for the worse since she also drowned

      The locals that were able to bring them to dry land tried to give them first aid assistance and mouth to mouth help while the police were on their way, however when the doctor arrived, he pronounced them both as passed away.

      This is surely a great shock to the family of the deceased. The police took declarations from all of the witnesses as well as those that tried to rescue them. The DIARIO extends much strength for the family and friends of the deceased.



      SM:   A friend of the couple posted a link to the guys Xanga site in the Diario forum.   The friend that posted the link just wanted the people in Aruba to know what a great couple they were.   Here is the link.   Very sad..they were looking so forward to their trip to Aruba :(    http://www.xanga.com/dsjun  Ã‚   (klaasend)

    116. nychic on October 10th, 2006 12:59 am

      Carpe – Thanks for posting all of your pics
      I can’t imagine the amount of work you have
      put into them –

      I also wanted to say that it helps to watch
      the video in slow motion -



      btw – that “Bloody Mattress” article link in #53

      so telling of what the ALE’s intentions were -

      wonder who called in that “TIP”

      wonder why the mattress was “FOUND” (planted)
      right after the security guards were arrested ??

      wonder why that particular item was “TESTED”
      at the police station and not sent off to
      Holland like the rest of the evidence SUPPOSEDLY WAS !

    117. super dave on October 10th, 2006 12:03 pm

      the suspects are being punished every day they wake up(if they can actually sleep). a branded rapist and murder suspect will be reminded daily by someone or the internet. every waking day they are reminded and this will never change. they have not proven their innocence, only lied about the whole situation.
      they got away with this game for years but now they can’t play anymore and will eventually get desperate and slip up.
      they have not gotten away with this just yet !ten years from now they will still wear this brand.

    118. Linando on October 10th, 2006 4:14 pm

      From Holland: feel sorry for Nat’s family. I really hope they can bring the 3 for court and punish them. Justice 4 Nat!!! I’ve red all the testaments and it’s all so clear, they did murder her. Don’t let them go away with it!!

    119. Waterboy on October 10th, 2006 9:37 pm


      I’m guessing emergency appendectomy (but, remote viewer says it’s the lower left abdomen). Hope you are feeling better.


    120. Waterboy on October 10th, 2006 9:43 pm


      When I talk about the remote viewer, remember, it’s pure B.S.

    121. kbm on October 14th, 2006 7:28 pm


      im commenting on:”KLM Dutch passenger faces jail time for abusive behavior … “set an example and to clarify the boundaries of good manners in Aruba”

      I think that it is the fault of the dutch passanger and the airline company. because:
      -the passanger should not drink if he uses medicine because thats doesn’t go together.
      -and its also the fault of the airline company because, i think they have to ask al the passangers if they use medicines or cant handle alcohol. and if they do then the airline crew should not let that persons drink alcohol on that flight.


    Leave a Reply

    Support Scared Monkeys! make a donation.

    • NEWS (breaking news alerts or news tips)
    • Red (comments)
    • Dugga (technical issues)
    • Dana (radio show comments)
    • Klaasend (blog and forum issues)
    E-mail It