Natalee Holloway Investigation: Skeeters Tape Mystery goes on. (Abrams Report)


The Abrams Report, November 30, 2005

The mystery of the Dr Phil/Jaime Skeeter’s tapes continue. Both sides stating just the opposite of presumable what is supposed to be the same tape.

ABRAMS: The Aruban government is fighting back and it’s about this interview with Deepak Kalpoe, one of the three suspects in the investigation into Natalee Holloway’s disappearance.


JAMIE SKEETERS, POLYGRAPH EXPERT: And the question I’ll ask you is if you intentionally kill her?


SKEETERS: If it was an accident I can help all of you and if you guys were partying, even if someone had given her a date drug—I’m sure she had sex with all of you.

KALPOE: She did. You’d be surprised how simple it was.


ABRAMS: Well Aruban authorities are saying that interview first aired on the “Dr. Phil” show is not what it seems and that Deepak Kalpoe actually gave a very different answer.


SKEETERS: And the question I’ll ask you is if you intentionally killed her?


SKEETERS: If it was an accident I can help all of you. If you guys were partying, even if somebody had given her a date drug—I’m sure she had sex with all of you.

KALPOE: She did. You’d be surprised how simple it would have been.


ABRAMS: Joining me now is Arlene Ellis Schipper, Aruban attorney and member of Aruba’s Strategic Communications Task Force, polygraph expert Jamie Skeeters—he’s the one who interviewed Deepak Kalpoe—and MSNBC analyst and former FBI investigator Clint Van Zandt.

All right. Arlene, bottom line is I think the big problem here is with regard to the translation or if you want to—the words that are being put on the screen to describe what it is that Kalpoe said, correct?

ARLENE ELLIS SCHIPPER, ARUBAN ATTORNEY (via phone): Well, no, not correct. The biggest problem is that the footage on the “Dr. Phil” show, which is video and audio shows Kalpoe that does not move his head and with a transcript which says yes or which says she did.

The CD ROM that we have received from Mr. Skeeters does not show a frozen image. It shows Kalpoe shaking his head no while he said, no, she didn’t, so that is a clear change of the answer (UNINTELLIGIBLE) denial to an admission. And that was the result from the NFI, the Netherlands Forensic Institute that clearly says that these—the footage of “Dr. Phil” was manipulated both in audio and in video.

ABRAMS: So, again, when you say manipulated look, there is no question they edited the tape. All right and there’s nothing wrong with editing the tape. But you’re—but what you are saying is you believe that this was beyond just editing the tape. You are saying that they actually…


ABRAMS: … manipulated the answers?

ELLIS SCHIPPER: This is not what I believe. This is what the NFI, four separate investigators came to conclude in their report and they specifically used the word manipulation of the answer. And that is—because editing wouldn’t mean that you have to cut right in the sentence. And that is what has happened.

ABRAMS: Jamie Skeeters, look, you’re the one who did this interview. This is a big deal because this is what many thought would be the reason that the—at least Deepak Kalpoe might be brought back in for questioning, the idea that he said he had sex with Natalee and they all did. What is—what do you make of the allegation that Arlene Ellis Schipper is making?

JAMIE SKEETERS, POLYGRAPH EXPERT (via phone): One big cigar smoke screen. Deepak admitted he had sex with Natalee and it’s on the tape. It’ll speak for itself. It’s one of those things where they’re trying to try the case in the court of world opinion. The tapes will say it all.

As far as him shaking his head, I’m looking at my hard drive right now. He’s not shaking his head. And on my tape it’s as clear as a bell. As a matter of fact, I would like for you to have one.

ABRAMS: Well we have I think talked to you about this and we are going to get those and air those tomorrow on the program so we can really get to the bottom of this.

Arlene, he’s the one who made the tape and he’s saying—and look—and when we listen to it, it sounds to me like the difference really isn’t in what’s said on the tape. The difference is in the interpretation of what’s being said on the tape.

ELLIS SCHIPPER: It’s not an interpretation. This is results—forensic results that I’m talking about. It is not my allegation. I’m speaking out of the results of the NFI, four separate investigators and it’s not smoke screen. The comparison has been made of the video and the CD Rom, which Mr. Skeeters sent to the police and the footage of “Dr. Phil”.

And the specific findings were manipulation, not editing, manipulation. And the reason why we were focusing on this, it’s not just because we have joined suddenly the defense team of Mr. Kalpoe, the reason is because for weeks and weeks in the media the police have been battered and—because claims were made that it was crystal clear that he admitted to rape.

And this also set the scene for support for a boycott. Now clearly the results from the NFI state that these tapes have been tampered with. This is not the truth that has been broadcasted. And basically, this was used to manipulate the viewers and the governor to call out for a boycott. This is our problem with this tape.

(The rest of the interview)

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